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  1. #1
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    B8 S4 3.0TT twin charge build

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    Hello all,
    I figured I’d introduce myself before I go into the details of my build. I’m Markus, I’ve owned my B8 manual S4 since early 2017. Im the founder and co-owner of German Performance Solutions in which we make some cool upgrades for the 3.0T supercharged engine (including the CREC as well!).

    My car: [IMG][/IMG]

    My build progress started in 2018 when I bought a beater daily while I worked on the S4. Ill add a complete build list to the end of this to summarize the mods since ill only be discussing the mods that I designed/developed.

    In early 2019 I kept asking myself why we couldn’t run E85 in the 3.0T. Randomly, I ran into a friend of mine that I hadn’t seen since the 5th grade on Facebook. He turned into a car enthusiast like me, and we started talking about our cars. He had a focus ST that someone developed a port injection kit for that he was installing. And that got the gears turning for me. So, I started working on the design with Jay from JXB and had the V1 port injection ready in late 2020. We quickly realized that the V1 port injection wasn’t a viable solution since it lifted the supercharger up to the point in which the hood needed to be cut. We got our dyno testing done while I started to work on redesigning the port injection to replace the tumbler valves.

    V1 Port Injection
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Picture of car on dyno
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Fast forward to January 2022 and the V2 design had been finished. It featured replacing the tumbler valves BUT still retained the OEM tumbler valve actuator and encoder. This allowed the engine to “think” the tumbler valves were still there. This also kept the supercharger at OEM height for several advantages. One, you don’t need to resize your supercharger belt when installing the port injection. Two, it allows for future upgrades such as a larger supercharger. Three, no need to cut anything, it fits like OEM. It also featured 550cc Bosch injectors flow matched by 1% and a split-second controller.

    V2 Port Injection
    [IMG][/IMG]

    V2 Port Injection Installed
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Once I started testing the port injection, I quickly realized that the port injection desperately needed higher regulated flow. So I started working on the LPFP upgrade. The first limitation was: I live in an area that typically has a DA of 3000 or so and once it dropped lower than 800 or so, the LPFP would start struggling. The second limitation was: the port injection needed consistent pressure to be tuned effectively. So I designed a kit that consists of a walbro 450 strapped to the side of the OEM pump, with a fuel pressure regulator (set to 72psi), with a return line back to the tank. This kept the pressure consistent at 72psi and provided flow, when needed, for higher power.

    LPFP upgrade:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    After the LPFP upgrade, I installed my built engine that consisted of forged pistons (lower compression), forged rods, sleeved block. This was a kit from Oleg. Look at how much larger the new rods are compared to the old rods. I also had the bearings and pistons coated by calico coating.

    Block
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Rods
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Then I shifted my attention to twin charging. This has always been a goal of mine. I love the concept of keeping the low end power of the supercharger, but freeing the engine up top with a turbocharger. I know there have been a few attempts at this already, (Oleg and Silly Rabbit to name a few) but I think that the setup I’m doing now will definitely be successful. When I was testing the port injection, we quickly ran into the limitations of the stock supercharger. The 1320 cannot flow more. The first limitation that we encountered was the fueling restriction. That was evident in the fact that we cannot run E85 without port injection. The second limitation was the OEM supercharger not providing enough airflow. The twin charging will eliminate the airflow issue. I decided that a rear mount turbo design was the way to go with our platform and that decision was solidified once I talked to Eric (he has a rear mount turbo setup on his RS4). I went up to his place for a few hours and he gave me a lot of pointers.

    That being said, I had this plan for a while (including an entire spreadsheet with parts to purchase to make this dream into a reality) but I never acted on it. Partially I was nervous and partially I was always too busy to take on this kind of project. It wasn’t until I started talking to Matthew from UWRENCHIT (around June 2023) that this really started taking shape. He was super supportive and had some great improvement suggestions. We decided to go forward with this as a partnership in which he does a setup on his 2013 A8 and I do one on my 2010 S4. There were multiple benefits to doing it like this and with the two of us (both engineers), we will be able to problem solve pretty much anything.

    Now onto the specs of the turbo system. This is a rear mount turbo system. In principle, the supercharger is activated in the lower rpm and then the turbocharger takes over in the higher rpm per the bypass valve in the supercharger. The turbo for my car is a 68/75 and the one for Matthew is 72/75. Both turbo’s are oilless from COMP TURBO. This eliminated the need to run a dedicated oil feed line to the turbo and a scavenge pump back to the engine. Currently running 3 inch charge piping to the front and 2.25 (oem) from each bank into a Y 3 inch to the turbo. The blow off valve is a TurboSmart GenV RacePort and the wastegate is a TurboSmart GenV PowerGate60. The boost controller is a TurboSmart EBoost Street 40psi Electronic Boost Controller. I haven’t gotten to the intercooler yet but Matthew is running a massive 1200 hp water to air intercooler.

    Rear mount turbo diagram:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Turbo:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Turbo Bracket Setup:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Turbo on Car:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Matthews engine bay:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Under Matt's car:
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Status as of right now:
    Matt has his car back and is installing my port injection kit along with making a custom LPFP upgrade. Then he will focus on tuning and nitrous stuff.
    I am still waiting for my exhaust side to get finished before I get my car back so that we can get the tuning for the port injection completed. Then we will start on the charge piping.


    Mod list for my S4 (im only doing things that affect performance) (im sure ill miss a few things and ill add to it as I remember):
    Merc racing heat exchanger
    57 griptec upper pulley
    203 fuid damper lower pulley
    JXB front differential
    JHM 5R clutch and pressure plate
    Eurocode flywheel
    Test pipes
    Autotech HPFP
    Mike Bunton Ported Blower
    GPS Port Injection
    Hoosier D06
    GPS LPFP upgrade
    Forged Pistons and Rods
    Sleeved Block

    Matthew's audizine name is Lightningmatt70.

  2. #2
    Stage 2 Banner Advertiser Four Rings Jake@JHM's Avatar
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    Aug 31 2011
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    80618
    My Garage
    C7 A6 3.0T - D4 A8L 4.0T
    Location
    Lathrop

    Pretty sweet build, excited to see the end result

    JHMotorsports.com - (209) 968-0077 - JHM Dealers
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Two Rings ccssid's Avatar
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    Jul 03 2011
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    Location
    michigan

    Very nice setup
    2011 S4 prestige. Imola 6mt.

  4. #4
    Veteran Member Four Rings eurojunkjon's Avatar
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    Mar 12 2017
    AZ Member #
    395361
    My Garage
    2013 S4
    Location
    Burlington, wi

    Can’t wait to see the end result
    2013 S4 Imola Yellow / IE Stage 2 / ECS Supercharger Pulley / IE Intake / ECS HX / AWE Non Resonated Downpipes / AWE Touring Exhaust / Vogtland Coilovers / Rs4 Grill / Eurocode SS / Black Forest Shift Knob / BBS LM-R / Alcon BBK / S6 Rear Brakes

    1996 Golf Harlequin #10

  5. #5
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Sep 16 2020
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    564872
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    West Michigan

    When twin charged, don't people typically run the blower at a more moderate RPM?
    2012 A6 Prestige - APR single pulley via Fluidampr 189, Injen intake+RS7 airbox, IE HPFP, EPL TCU, JHM HX, 034 motor mounts, Eurocode drivetrain inserts, gutted cats - 034 tunes purchased, not installed.

  6. #6
    Veteran Member Three Rings shreddykrueger's Avatar
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    Feb 14 2016
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    368733
    My Garage
    S4 Avant
    Location
    Denver, CO

    this is absolutely legendary. cannot wait to see this monster come together
    S4 Avant (6MT)
    RCP dual pulley | AWE touring | JHM catted/baffled DP's | AEM water/meth | Ringer Stage III | RSNAV | Vogtland Coilovers | many other tings

  7. #7
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Oct 25 2017
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    408923
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    Vale/North Carolina

    Thanks for the support!!

    Quote Originally Posted by sepheroth86 View Post
    When twin charged, don't people typically run the blower at a more moderate RPM?
    Im not sure what people typically do because i haven't researched many other twin charge setups. Either way, i want to run the supercharger faster for the lower rpm (for more power down low) and then completely bypass the supercharger at the higher rpm.

  8. #8
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Apr 04 2012
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    MSP

    I've never seen a turbo mounted like that! Fun project! Hope it all comes together for you!

  9. #9
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrFunk View Post
    I've never seen a turbo mounted like that! Fun project! Hope it all comes together for you!
    Thank you! im looking forward to getting it running.

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkusS4 View Post
    Thanks for the support!!



    Im not sure what people typically do because i haven't researched many other twin charge setups. Either way, i want to run the supercharger faster for the lower rpm (for more power down low) and then completely bypass the supercharger at the higher rpm.
    That seems significantly different than most twin charged setups I have previously seen.

    Typically the blower is run at a low speed which gives plenty of low end grunt. And simply helps the larger turbo spool quickly.

    Then the turbocharged air gets blown into the engine via the blower.

    This way the blower doesn't add significant amounts of heat to the charge air.

    https://www.enginebuildermag.com/202...arged-engines/
    2012 A6 Prestige - APR single pulley via Fluidampr 189, Injen intake+RS7 airbox, IE HPFP, EPL TCU, JHM HX, 034 motor mounts, Eurocode drivetrain inserts, gutted cats - 034 tunes purchased, not installed.

  11. #11
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Mar 31 2008
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    27118
    My Garage
    eS-4
    Location
    CAL*SO

    so mathew ISNT going to run the new merc blower?? what about the 034 cams?
    The same throttle body and corn toon as everyone else.
    A ported blower and the mega bitch pulley.
    Lots of water and wheels lighter than my bank account.

  12. #12
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fresh.S4 View Post
    so mathew ISNT going to run the new merc blower?? what about the 034 cams?
    No matt isnt running merc's blower. But he will be running the 034 cams

  13. #13
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by sepheroth86 View Post
    That seems significantly different than most twin charged setups I have previously seen.

    Typically the blower is run at a low speed which gives plenty of low end grunt. And simply helps the larger turbo spool quickly.

    Then the turbocharged air gets blown into the engine via the blower.

    This way the blower doesn't add significant amounts of heat to the charge air.

    https://www.enginebuildermag.com/202...arged-engines/

    We want to spin the supercharger up as much as we can prior to the turbocharger takes over. The faster you spin the supercharger, the more low end grunt youll get. Once we get to the point in which the turbocharger can take over, we will bypass the supercharger.

  14. #14
    Veteran Member Four Rings AudiA4_20T's Avatar
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    Oct 29 2005
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    8553
    My Garage
    10speed
    Location
    San Francisco, CA

    Wow this is an actual build!! Also, can't wait to see what E85 can do on these cars. While $7k+ supercharger upgrades are cool, a ton more people will adopt a port injection solution.
    - Clint

    Current : 2013 Q5 3.0T Prestige S-Line - 11.6@117 - 034 Stage2+ FBO
    Gone : One of the first ever 2.7T Swaps - White '04 S4 2.7T - Stage 2+
    Gone : Fastest B6 A4 ever - 464awhp/12.1@116

  15. #15
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4_20T View Post
    Wow this is an actual build!! Also, can't wait to see what E85 can do on these cars. While $7k+ supercharger upgrades are cool, a ton more people will adopt a port injection solution.
    Thanks! im looking forward to completing it!

  16. #16
    Established Member Two Rings B4Audi's Avatar
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    Delaware

    Is your port injection kit for sale yet?

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

  17. #17
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by B4Audi View Post
    Is your port injection kit for sale yet?

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
    Soon i hope! we are starting to test a tune in hopes that we can provide a tune with the kit as an option.

  18. #18
    Established Member Two Rings B4Audi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkusS4 View Post
    Soon i hope! we are starting to test a tune in hopes that we can provide a tune with the kit as an option.
    Will there be an option to buy the port injection if we have separate tune?

    Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk

  19. #19
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by B4Audi View Post
    Will there be an option to buy the port injection if we have separate tune?

    Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk
    Yes, most likely there will be 3 options.

    Option 1: Just the port injection (includes injectors)
    Option 2: Port injection, and split second controller.
    Option 3: Port injection, split second controller and ECU tune.

    i may create more options (such as an option without injectors so you can run whatever injector you want) but thats the main 3 options ive been considering.

  20. #20
    Veteran Member Four Rings
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    Mar 31 2008
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    eS-4
    Location
    CAL*SO

    i suppose the injectors will be on the smaller side as to not flood the intake?
    The same throttle body and corn toon as everyone else.
    A ported blower and the mega bitch pulley.
    Lots of water and wheels lighter than my bank account.

  21. #21
    Established Member Two Rings B4Audi's Avatar
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    Delaware

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkusS4 View Post
    Yes, most likely there will be 3 options.

    Option 1: Just the port injection (includes injectors)
    Option 2: Port injection, and split second controller.
    Option 3: Port injection, split second controller and ECU tune.

    i may create more options (such as an option without injectors so you can run whatever injector you want) but thats the main 3 options ive been considering.
    Awesome.

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

  22. #22
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fresh.S4 View Post
    i suppose the injectors will be on the smaller side as to not flood the intake?
    Yeah im running 550cc injectors at the moment. For the 1320 supercharger, that is plenty. Who knows what this twin charge will need for fueling but there are many higher flowing injectors to choose from when that time comes.

  23. #23
    Veteran Member Four Rings a4darkness's Avatar
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    Dec 01 2007
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    San Jose CA

    Tracking this one for sure, looks awesome. Even stock the 3.0t makes for such a great driving experience and this would make it that much more fun.

  24. #24
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by a4darkness View Post
    Tracking this one for sure, looks awesome. Even stock the 3.0t makes for such a great driving experience and this would make it that much more fun.
    Thats the idea. I really enjoy the instant supercharger drivability but want the higher power from a turbo. So i want to combine them.

  25. #25
    Veteran Member Four Rings f1torrents's Avatar
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    Apr 27 2012
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    92640
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    B8.5 6MT S5 Coupe / B9.5 S5 Coupe
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    Guelph

    Stock ECU?
    Aftermarket ECU?
    Dual ECU's?

  26. #26
    Established Member Two Rings serg72's Avatar
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    Kharkiv, Ukraine

    An interesting project. I will follow up.
    Another question, was the project on the stroker 3.0T > 3.2T not considered?
    2014 Q5 3.0T S-Line | Glacier Grey |034 Stage 2+ 93 octane tune | CTS Crank Pulley 192mm / APR SC Pulley 57.75 | BG HPT ZF8 Tune | 2 CWA-50 pump / Custom HX + custom reservoir (Divorced Coolant Loop) | K&N filter/mod stock box intake /4" Intake Tube/ TB 84mm | 034 HPFP piston | Long tube headers/custom exhaust 2,5" | tires 265/45/20 |

  27. #27
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by f1torrents View Post
    Stock ECU?
    Aftermarket ECU?
    Dual ECU's?
    Stock ECU with a split second controller for the MPI.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by serg72 View Post
    An interesting project. I will follow up.
    Another question, was the project on the stroker 3.0T > 3.2T not considered?
    I had considered using the 3.2 crank but there were alot of unknowns with that and i wanted to get my engine into the car asap to start working on the twin charge stuff.

  28. #28
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Ive had a few requests to include more pictures of the built engine. A bit of background on the engine; i purchased the pistons, rods and sleeved block from Oleg. This is the sleeved block.



    This was me removing the original engine/tranny. The S4 was up in the air on jackstands. Is it difficult? yes but the main advice i can give people doing engine removals is to label absolutely everything, purchase the technical documents, and have patience.



    This is the engine block with calico coated main bearings. Calico coatings is roughly 15 minutes from my shop so its convenient to have things coated.



    This the lower cradle with calico coated main bearings as well.



    Rods, calico coated rod bearings, and calico coated piston skirt and top.



    Pistons and rods installed. it was almost too pretty to cover up with the cylinder head.



    Reinstalling the engine. I know there are quite a few steps i missed, but i can only upload so many photos.



    I also wanted to mention a few things that i replaced while doing the engine build. The big thing that i replace is all of the timing stuff. New timing chain, new tensioners and guides. Of course all of the bearings (main, and rods). New bolts particularly head bolts. All new gaskets (head gasket, valve stem gaskets, orings for between the cradles, valve cover gaskets). I am sure i am missing stuff and ill update as i remember.

    I used OEM head gaskets, OEM valve springs, OEM Head bolts and OEM camshaft. None of those items were available when i was doing my build. I now have head studs and head gaskets from 034 on the shelf to put in. I am sure ill need upgraded valve springs soon, but im going to test without them for the moment.

  29. #29
    Veteran Member Three Rings A42007's Avatar
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    Jan 12 2011
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    2018 Audi A4 B9, 2012 B8 Avant
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ

    I was JUST looking at your port injection the other day and then stumbled into Mathew's current YouTube build.

    Just picked up an amazing deal on a 12' Avant that will be getting an S4 swap. So, coming across all the MercRacing / 034 and now the port injection / twin-charge builds. It's safe to say I'm glad I'm jumping back into the Audi platform with all this going on. Already picked up an Air Lift Performance 3H the other day.

    So, I'll be on the search for my co-part S4 and waiting a bit longer until some of these things start to pan out more. See what kind of fueling solutions and numbers people are putting down.
    2007 B7 A4 FWD - APR Stage II / Magna Flow Cat Back / 2.5" TP / ST Coilovers / 19x8.5 ET 32 RS6 Reps / Aftermarket Navigation / 235/35 Hankook Ventus V12 Evo's. - http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...di-07-A4-Build.


    2012 B8 A4 Avant Premium Plus Quattro (S4 Conversion In-Progress) - ECS Hi-Flow Cat / 3" Down-pipe / Air Lift Performance 3H Air Ride / 10.25" RSNAV Series 4 / Rohana RC7 20x9 ET25 / Ohtsu FP8000 255/30R20

  30. #30
    Registered User Four Rings Jay@JXB's Avatar
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    Dec 21 2014
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    2018 Silverado 3500 HD DRW, Bart the Big Ass Red Trailer.
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    Milwaukee

    Oh hey Markus fancy seeing you here!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  31. #31
    Active Member One Ring GMigic88's Avatar
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    Dec 07 2022
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    Bay Area, CA

    Pumped for all these developments. Having had the platform for a year and being FBO besides ported blower I think I’m going to wait another 3-6 months to see what developments may be available from a fueling standpoint before porting the blower.


    Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

  32. #32
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by A42007 View Post
    I was JUST looking at your port injection the other day and then stumbled into Mathew's current YouTube build.

    Just picked up an amazing deal on a 12' Avant that will be getting an S4 swap. So, coming across all the MercRacing / 034 and now the port injection / twin-charge builds. It's safe to say I'm glad I'm jumping back into the Audi platform with all this going on. Already picked up an Air Lift Performance 3H the other day.

    So, I'll be on the search for my co-part S4 and waiting a bit longer until some of these things start to pan out more. See what kind of fueling solutions and numbers people are putting down.
    Great to have you back in the audi world. Im currently planning to start the preorders for the port injection on February first.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@JXB View Post
    Oh hey Markus fancy seeing you here!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Fancy seeing you here

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by GMigic88 View Post
    Pumped for all these developments. Having had the platform for a year and being FBO besides ported blower I think I’m going to wait another 3-6 months to see what developments may be available from a fueling standpoint before porting the blower.


    Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum
    Hopefully in 3-6 months we will have all of this finalized. Stay tuned though!

  33. #33
    Veteran Member Four Rings AudiA4_20T's Avatar
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    Oct 29 2005
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    8553
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    10speed
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    San Francisco, CA

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkusS4 View Post
    Great to have you back in the audi world. Im currently planning to start the preorders for the port injection on February first.
    Will you have data on a normal dual pulley car before/after?
    - Clint

    Current : 2013 Q5 3.0T Prestige S-Line - 11.6@117 - 034 Stage2+ FBO
    Gone : One of the first ever 2.7T Swaps - White '04 S4 2.7T - Stage 2+
    Gone : Fastest B6 A4 ever - 464awhp/12.1@116

  34. #34
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4_20T View Post
    Will you have data on a normal dual pulley car before/after?
    Yes i have that data already. Ive been running the MPI since 2021. If you have facebook, its in the S4 network group, otherwise ill be posting it on the product page soon.

  35. #35
    Established Member Two Rings B4Audi's Avatar
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    Delaware

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkusS4 View Post
    Yes i have that data already. Ive been running the MPI since 2021. If you have facebook, its in the S4 network group, otherwise ill be posting it on the product page soon.
    Is the price listed on your site for the mpi the pre sale or regular price?

    Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

  36. #36
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by B4Audi View Post
    Is the price listed on your site for the mpi the pre sale or regular price?

    Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk
    At the moment thats the regular price. However i have to update that here soon with the updated manufacturing costs.

  37. #37
    Established Member Two Rings
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    Jun 12 2018
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    2012 Q7 TDI
    Location
    Wisconsin

    I was wondering if you could get a overall measurement of the engine top to bottom please?

  38. #38
    Junior Member Two Rings
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    Quote Originally Posted by Audisom View Post
    I was wondering if you could get a overall measurement of the engine top to bottom please?
    Yes i can. It will be a while before i do though.

  39. #39
    Veteran Member Three Rings MerkurRS's Avatar
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    101609
    My Garage
    Four Passat W8's, 2003 allroad 2.7t , Ford Excursion Ltd V10, 1989 Merkur Scorpio, 1987 Merkur XR4Ti
    Location
    Berthoud, CO

    Enjoying reading into your build

    Great build there, MarkusS4.
    I'm building my 3.0T, may I ask few questions?
    - Have you looked into the 3.2 stroker any further?
    - What would you do differently (relevant to an E85 build)?
    We run a performance shop north of Denver and will be doing YouTube posts once we get a channel up. Yes, I'll be contacting you for the MPI kit!!
    Check us out: www.rockymountainperformance.com

  40. #40
    Veteran Member Three Rings
    Join Date
    Mar 21 2011
    AZ Member #
    72707
    My Garage
    B8.5 S4 6spd
    Location
    NJ USA

    Looking forward to seeing this progress.

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