Govdeals Auction car

[EvellSnoats]

Stupidly bought a Govdeals Audi a4. 2009 with over 200k on the clock that has been in impound for a year. Having said that, it cranked with a boost and made it 30 miles to my lakehouse. After clearing a lot of codes I am down to Two of that I think have sidelined me and it is these I need help with.

As I was driving around the parking lot back to my townhome, the car stalled and died on an incline. Never overheated. Did throw the check oil warning. Car died. When I tried to restart it, it cranks but won't catch. Autel Codes are as follows:

P164D00 - Reduced Oil Pressure switch malfunction
P034100- Camshaft Position Sensor Circuit - Range Performance

The car, if anything, has too much oil and a sticker on the windshield says it was changed within a 1000 miles, albeit 2 years ago.

Plan tomorrow is to get both sensors (camshaft and oil pressure) at Autozone as an interim fix and change the oil with the sensors (will replace with OEM down the road but I am nowhere near a dealership). Would anything else be making it go no-start on me? I figure it could be bad gas (it still had a half a tank when I showed up and it was probably a year old) so I am going to get some HEET and maybe think about draining it and putting in fresh gas as well (how big a PITA is the fuel filter?). Anything else I should consider? This is not my daily, just a project to have fun with.

Here is a link to the auction: https://www.govdeals.com/index.cfm?f...11&acctID=5758

[EvellSnoats]

Also, there was a treasure trove of receipts in the glovebox including timing chain replacement at 135K so the car had been maintained and was a CPO car at one point.

[mrg_B8TFSi]

Could be the High pressure fuel pump and or the high pressure fuel sensor on the fuel rail. That being faulty might not throw a specific code. Yes bad or stale fuel in it could be an issue, but the low oil pressure is concerning changing out those sensors won’t fix the stalling. Maybe the breather assembly is faulty might consider that diaphragm being bad. I’d first start with adding fresh 93 octane fuel, the fuel filter is also in the tank it’s configured within the pump submersible pump.. and it’s not that. Start with the basics , oil change and use fill synthetic rated specific for VW502. I’m not saying that the sensors you mentioned are not intermittent but you should rule out simple things first before throwing parts at it


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[EvellSnoats]

Great advice. I am about an hour round trip away from the parts store here at the vacation home so laying in a few cheap parts kind of makes more sense sometimes when I also have another B8 that might use anything surplus in the future. I am going to delve into it a little more with the Autel and see if I can ascertain what my pressures are using that.

Really appreciate your thoughts. Will post more after I diagnose it some tomorrow or tonight.

[audrobotic]

That’s crazy somehow I knew this B8 was Red before I even clicked the link.

Hey at least a previous owner cared enough to buy a dipstick.
Pistons done about 87k.
Timing chain and turbo about 125k.

[EvellSnoats]

That’s crazy somehow I knew this B8 was Red before I even clicked the link.

Hey at least a previous owner cared enough to buy a dipstick.
Pistons done about 87k.
Timing chain and turbo about 125k.

Yeah, that is why I cared enough to bid, that and it was right around the corner from my lake house.

I thew some HEET in it and it started up after about 30 minutes enough to get it up the hill and in my garage before the HOA got on my ass. Tomorrow I am getting the bad gas out and wrenching. Wish me luck!

[EvellSnoats]

Okay, update. I changed the oil. Tried to drain the gas from the return line but it wouldn't work, so I put some injector cleaner in it, babied it and added some fresh fuel. I now turns over fine, doesn't stall and is running well but with issues. It was for sure chocking on shitty ethanol and water but now starts and runs fine.

It is still telling me to stop and check the oil level and the EPC light flashes whenever I slow down or turn sharply (but the sharp turn may be my imagination). I changed not only the oil and filter, but the oil pressure switch as well. I changed the camshaft position sensor too based on that code. The errors that went away involved fuel pressure sensor and I figure that is because I finally got rid of the stale gas. So I am down to 2 codes, an oil pressure switch malfunction and camshaft position sensor circuit/range performance (P034100 despite a new sensor), these codes have been consistently present.

I have some other codes, but I think I have them figured out. I had a short to ground on the blower motor and when I pulled the motor, it was completely locked up. The resistor looks corroded. I will replace the blower motor for sure, will probably do the resistor unless someone can tell me how to troubleshoot it.

There is a weird code on the radio, but it works and a couple of others like that I will sort out once I figure out whether I have a car or a donor. Appreciate any insight.

[EvellSnoats]

I think I am going to drop the pan and clear the filter to the pump and see if there is sludge. Also will mechanically test the oil pressure. Unfortunately, no one local has a gasket, so all of this will have to wait until next weekend.

[EvellSnoats]

After researching a bit more, it appears that there are two oil pressure senders, one that is brown and one blue. I took out the brown one and replaced it with a blue one I got from autozone not knowing the difference at the time.

Does anyone have a pic of where the blue one is located? Other folks that have had this problem seem to have been a combo of the switches and a bad PCV unit, so I might start there and put a mechanical gauge to see if I really have low pressure.

EDIT: Is it below the guy's thumb in this screenshot?
https://i.imgur.com/lCkXlCc.png"]https://i.imgur.com/lCkXlCc.png[/URL]

[MyDimeIsUp]

After researching a bit more, it appears that there are two oil pressure senders, one that is brown and one blue. I took out the brown one and replaced it with a blue one I got from autozone not knowing the difference at the time.

Does anyone have a pic of where the blue one is located? Other folks that have had this problem seem to have been a combo of the switches and a bad PCV unit, so I might start there and put a mechanical gauge to see if I really have low pressure.

EDIT: Is it below the guy's thumb in this screenshot?
https://i.imgur.com/lCkXlCc.png"]https://i.imgur.com/lCkXlCc.png[/URL]

It should be right by the brown one. This is on my post-facelift model though (2013 - 2016) which has the engine equipped with a metal intake manifold and flex-fuel; still a Gen 2 EA888 though. I don't see why they would've moved it.





EDIT: Reading Audi's erWin, it could also be by the belt tensioner. This illustration shows hydraulic power steering on the serpentine belt, so this illustration is for your B8.0 engine. Idk maybe they did actually change the location on flex-fuel engines

[Theiceman]

FYI the oil sensors are in different locations on different engines. Not sure why or which ones, but don't be alarmed, just make sure you replace like with like. I have a 14 non flex fuel engine and both sensors are by the filter housing as the pic above.

[EvellSnoats]

It should be right by the brown one. This is on my post-facelift model though (2013 - 2016) which has the engine equipped with a metal intake manifold and flex-fuel; still a Gen 2 EA888 though. I don't see why they would've moved it.





EDIT: Reading Audi's erWin, it could also be by the belt tensioner. This illustration shows hydraulic power steering on the serpentine belt, so this illustration is for your B8.0 engine. Idk maybe they did actually change the location on flex-fuel engines

Yeah, mine is by the belt tensioner. I would have noticed if it was right by the one in the housing.

I have a feeling there are more issues than just sensors and I am now 180 miles away with slow delivery times. I am thinking I will spend this weekend switching out the sensors, replacing the diaphragm on the PCV valve and mechanically testing the pressure. If that doesn't fix it I will pull the oil pan and maybe pull the cam bridge to see if the filter there is clogged before just throwing parts at it.

This guy's video scares the hell out of me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJp85pRqrm8

[Theiceman]

the low oil pressure switch is the brown one .55-.85 bar
the Blue on is high pressure switch 2.15-2.95 bar. your code is telling you the brown was is bad.

[EvellSnoats]

Car is a little over 10psi at idle (900 rpm), 47psi at 2000 rpm and just shy of 60psi at 3500 rpm. Thoughts? I am picking up a brown oil pressure switch today.

[hamfisted]

If you do drop the oil pan, there isn't an actual gasket for it so you have to use RTV. I used Permatex Ultra Black.

[EvellSnoats]

Car is a little over 10psi at idle (900 rpm), 47psi at 2000 rpm and just shy of 60psi at 3500 rpm. Thoughts? I am picking up a brown oil pressure switch today.

New switch did not change anything. Only code is P164D00, reduced oil pressure switch malfunction. Anyone know how I can check wiring to sensor? I'm going to re-hook the mechanical gauge and see if it is triggered which would tell me with the sensor out it could be the level sensor in the pan I guess. That way I guess I could continue to monitor the pressure during the drive?

Car does seem to stumble sometimes and does not seem to like inclines. I was kind of writing that off to stale gas still. One good thing, camshaft code seems to be a thing of the past after the sensor change.

[EvellSnoats]

I don't see why they would've moved it.

Because to get to it in mine you have to:

[EvellSnoats]

Well I put the mechanical gauge back on and drove it a couple of miles. Once the car got up to temp, the oil pressure did dip down to 5 on any sort of incline/decline. Nursed it home and into the garage. Had to let it cool down to get it restarted.

Started to pull the pan. Despite some youtube videos to the contrary, looks like I will have to drop the subframe, there are just some bolts I cannot get to (about 3). One torx bolt is also hollowed out, but it is pretty accessible. I don't have my dremel tool here to cut a slot and may try to just hammer in a sacrificial larger bit or a hex bit. There are two bolts in there that are not OE, a 10mm and a hex head bolt. So I am going to order a pan kit with new bolts as well.

The oil that came out looks good (it was fresh), nothing frightening in the way of chunks came out at least.

So, it clearly has intermittent low oil pressure. I just hope there is not much screwed up as a result of driving it the little bit I did.

Besides the everpresent P164d00 reduced oil pressure switch malfunction, the following codes returned:
P019100 fuel rail pressure sensor a circuit range/peformance
P034100 camshaft pos circuit range/performance
P030x00 cyl 3, 4 2 misfire detected
P030000 random/multiple cylinder misfire

Pretty sure this is going to wind up being the balance shafts, but I'm going to try and be patient with it.

[Theiceman]

imo pulling balance shafts is easier than dropping pan and subframe. plus you get to check timing gear

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[EvellSnoats]

imo pulling balance shafts is easier than dropping pan and subframe. plus you get to check timing gear

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Hope you are right! Because:





Timing chain was done at 125K at an audi dealership. I don't have records on the oil pump, but it is stamped 06H-115-105-AF, which I think I remember reading somewhere was the latest iteration of that pump? Sump screen was cleaner than a whistle. There was no plastic in the pan, just metal and a tiny sliver of RTV.

[Theiceman]

yeah low oil pressure on these cars 90% of the time is the balance shafts. im not sure what you are showing there but it looks pretty good to me.

[EvellSnoats]

yeah low oil pressure on these cars 90% of the time is the balance shafts. im not sure what you are showing there but it looks pretty good to me.

Metal in pan. Admittedly not much but something is coming apart.

[Theiceman]

can you tell what it is ?? will it stick to a magnet. Problem is you really don't know how long that has been there . could even been from brand new.. those types of problems suck lol.. but yeah you gotta think balance shafts next right ? now obvious catastrophe down there

when i took my 130K motor completely apart it did all look brand new in the oil pump screen/ area.

[Theiceman]

something just occurred to me ... you might go directly for the balance shafts and that's fine but did you check your crankcase vacuum before you started by chance ?

high crankcase vacuum can cause low oil pressure messages, usually caused by a bad PCV. might have been worth a check before ripping it apart but just thought of it now.

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ghlight=vacuum

[EvellSnoats]

can you tell what it is ?? will it stick to a magnet. Problem is you really don't know how long that has been there . could even been from brand new.. those types of problems suck lol.. but yeah you gotta think balance shafts next right ? now obvious catastrophe down there

when i took my 130K motor completely apart it did all look brand new in the oil pump screen/ area.

Flakes are definitely magnetic. I am thinking balance shafts.

As far as the PCV goes, the diaphragm was not torn. When I pulled the dipstick, it started running rough which I understand would normally tell me the PCV system is working. However, I did not have the gauge to check the crankcase pressure. I do remember it having some greater vacuum than my 2012 when I took the cap off at one point, thinking wow that is a lot of pull! Maybe I can slap it back together one more time and see what the vacuum is.

Appreciate the info!

[Theiceman]

it might be worth a quick check . PCVs can fail in a few different ways. the failure mode most common is the diaphragm tearing allowing unmetered air in , when you take the cap off and and it stumbles you are checking fo r one failure mode. Look over the thread i linked, you should have the all black one unless it has been updated with the flash .
Admittedly it is a long shot. but you never know, it might avoid you pulling the front end apart...

[EvellSnoats]

Anyone know where I can get a CTA 1023 Timing Tool kit for the 2.0T? Seems to be backordered everywhere and no used ones on flea bay.

[Theiceman]

Anyone know where I can get a CTA 1023 Timing Tool kit for the 2.0T? Seems to be backordered everywhere and no used ones on flea bay.

that is very surprising as they used be available everywhere.. do you have local forum you can ask on to see if there is anyone nearby ?

[EvellSnoats]

Long weekend and I might be out past my tool order. But first, some wierdness:



This plastic bag was in the air intake pipe, almost like it was placed there. I'm wondering if the outfit auctioning this thing off was screwing with it to try and make it stumble? It would have been a once in a lifetime shot for it to get picked up on the road and the bag looked almost new. Really weird, but the car is halfway apart now and this likely has nothing to do with its low pressure problems but could be why its pressure at the crankcase was high?

Anyway, I did this:



Honestly I was going to make room on one of my stands at home I was stripping an engine on and move my crane up temporarily (this project is at a vacation home), but I think I am going to leave it in. I am waiting for timing tools to take off the lower timing cover. I pulled the PCV unit and the intake cam under there looks okay to me, but that just means no apparent scoring and obviously I have not seen the journals. Once I have timing tools I figure I can pull the cambridge and hope its a plugged filter there.

So last night I started cleaning the interior, which really is not bad at all. Only two things, the drivers seat has some splitting going on:



Damage is just that one area, so I am thinking pull the cover and find an upholstery shop? Ebay parts so far are worse looking than this. Suggestions welcome.

The headliner needs to come out. According to ErWin, it comes out through the front windshield, which ain't happening so I am kind of looking for a junkyard board to practice on. My prior headliner replacement job was marginal at best and its tough to find anyone to do the job anymore that will do it right, so I guess I am going to take a stab at it.

In other good news, I wacked the bottom of the fan motor and unlocked it. Sprayed some lube on it and it turns. Stuck it in the car without hooking it up permanent and it powered up and spun a little. I am going to keep at it with oil and see if it throws any codes. Still have no idea how to test the resistor and ErWin was no help. Would like to save the $300 bucks a cheapie replacement of both would cost, but for now there is no sense in spending that money on new until I figure out what is up with the engine.

[audrobotic]

Cool update. Be sure to checkout car-part.com if you haven't already for used parts.

[EvellSnoats]

Cool update. Be sure to checkout car-part.com if you haven't already for used parts.

Thanks, with seats, by the time a lot of older cars make it there, they are in pretty rough shape. The car-part suggestions near me for a possible engine were all in the $3K range, so I think for now the plan is a rebuild.

Here are some pics:







(All plugs looked like this.)

Fortunately, my timing tool kit gets here tomorrow so I can take it up to my lake house and spend some time on it this weekend and see if there is any obvious damage. Will probably check clearance on the bottom bearings too, so any suggestions on that are welcome. Its been years since I have done that kind of work so don't worry about hurting my feelings.

[Theiceman]

thats a new style chain . timing work was done recently on this engine. check others work carefully.

[EvellSnoats]

thats a new style chain . timing work was done recently on this engine. check others work carefully.

Timing was good. Unfortunately, a couple of the T30 torx bolts holding it down low hollowed out on me, so I had to do some violence:



So it now sits like this:



I pulled the vacuum motor off as well as the cambridge. The filter that normally disintegrates in the cambridge was gone. I understand they recommended removing that when the car has a timing service. The little filter in the vacuum motor was clean. No signs of metal.

Anyone with tips on how to line the vacuum up with the cam to reseat it, let me know.

The balance shafts move freely but I am unsure on the timing settings for them, of if they even get timed. There is one different color link on that chain, but it doesn't seem to match to any of the marks on the balance shaft gears. I have some more pics to share tomorrow.

I removed the intake cam timing valve. When I was checking to see if the balance shafts were moving by turning the engine, it spit oil about three feet out of the end of the cam shaft where the valve was. Don't know if maybe there was some sort of obstruction there or something? It only did it once.

I went ahead and pulled the oil pump and screen. Screen was clean. All of the stuff on the pump seemed to work and it turned pretty cleanly except for the sucking noises I attribute to being a pump.

I think I mentioned wanting to check the crankshaft bearings, but to do that you have to remove the upper oil pan which involves pulling the rear main seal which you cannot do with the engine connected to the transmission.

Any suggestions welcome.

[Theiceman]

firstly why did you remove vacuum pump. ?
secondly we know the balance shafts turn. that has nothing to do with them causing low oil pressure.
cam and balance shafts all have to be timed precisely. you should not move forward without a service manual or professional help

any bearing work requires engine removal.

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[EvellSnoats]

firstly why did you remove vacuum pump. ?
secondly we know the balance shafts turn. that has nothing to do with them causing low oil pressure.
cam and balance shafts all have to be timed precisely. you should not move forward without a service manual or professional help

any bearing work requires engine removal.

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I removed the vacuum pump to check the oil screen at the back, which I understand can clog and cause the problem. My screen was clean however, see here:



I have a service manual. Thanks for confirming the balance shafts won't just seize up and cause low oil pressure. Common sense told me that was the case, but I don't want to pull them if I don't have to as they are one time use.

Here are some pics of the balance shafts, which don't look right based on videos, etc. I have seen, but, as I said, I thought I read they don't require any specific timing. I will do them per the service manual once I get the tool if that is what it takes. (by "don't look right" I mean the color keyed links don't line up with the marks on the balance shafts.)





I hate to do a "parts cannon" approach, but what would be the board's thoughts on replacing the balance shafts, timing components, oil pump and pan, PCV (and anything else under $100) and putting it back together to see if that works before pulling the engine and doing the bearings? There is no rod knock but the engine does have over 200K on it.

Again, thanks for your follow up!

[EvellSnoats]

Theiceman, looking at the second pic and the service manual, the painted links don't look like they line up right and the balance shafts seem "off." However, the painted links on the cam shafts and TDC on the crank look right, but the painted links don't match there either.

[Theiceman]

okay everyone falls down here so dont worry about it.

coloured links are ONLY for install... once you rotate from that it takes a ridiculous amount of revolutions to get them to line up again.. but getting it all right including balance shafts can be very tricky I would suggest once it's done post clear pics of how it looks here so we can look at it including where the balance shafts sit we have caught more than one wrong and saved people tonnes of work

the low oil pressure caused by shafts seems to pop up a few times a year I've never had it but I think when people pop the shafts out they find plugged screens. I'll let others comment on that one
personally I've never seen bearings or oil pump cause low oil pressure on this engine but you just never know.

if you do pull the engine 100% replace pistons if it has not been done.

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[StuckAntichris]

In my experience the timing of the balance shafts has nothing to do with oil pressure. If you think the timing is off for them you can take the tensioner loose and the guides off and time them per the service manual without taking the Cam chain off. It'll take some doing but it is possible.

If you want to replace the oil pump I believe you will have an easier time removing the engine in order to do that. The subframe is in the way of removing the lower oil pan and since you may end up tearing this thing down to do pistons I will probably be worth your time to go ahead and pull the engine.

I pulled mine with the harness attached and can answer any questions you may have about doing that. Just make sure to disconnect the AC compressor plug since that will be staying in the car. Oh and start from the ECU and work your way around the engine to remove the harness from the car.

I hope this helps!

[WHT13AR]

Not to steer away from the topic but the service manuals, I went to the erwin site and they want 35 clams for a 1 day subscription. Can I DL a pdf or just view it?? Thanks.

[jbain2]

Not to steer away from the topic but the service manuals, I went to the erwin site and they want 35 clams for a 1 day subscription. Can I DL a pdf or just view it?? Thanks.

You can download whatever you need. Save it as PDF’s. All within your allotted time.


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