Actual Aftermarket Intercooler Performance?

[FromS60toB61.8t]

I'm in the market for an intercooler, and have searched a bit on here.
Initially I was looking at the Wagner, but for 1/3 of the price, the Rev9 one seems like the better bang for the buck for what I'm aiming for.
I'm only planning on going stage 2 with intake, dp, intercooler, so I'm wondering if I would even be utilizing the extra cooling that the wagner offers.

I found this thread comparing all of the options (Intercooler Area-Volume Comparison Thread), and $350 for something that ranks in the middle of all of the intercoolers seems like a no-brainer to me.

The purpose of this thread is to see what people are getting as ACTUAL IAT temps after repeated pulls, and at what ambient temp with each intercooler and with what turbo/tune setup.

Post up any data you may have and I will compile it into a google doc to possibly help others decide in the future as well.

Update:
I ended up ordering the Rev9 IC. $409 shipped after tax, figured I could sell it for close to that after I'm done with it and ready to go hybrid turbo/wagner IC.
Link below for anyone interested as well.
Rev9 - $385

Andy_FL's OEM vs Rev9 vs Carbnlab IC Comparison Thread

Update:
Found a site selling brand new wagner for $881 shipped and no tax, so i chanced it and ordered it. Should be coming in today, so I will report back if it is legit or not. The site has some weird facebook reviews so I wasn't sure if it's a legit place or not. Ordered on monday, then heard nothing until midnight last night when i got a tracking number.
Price is back up to $988, but this is where i got it if anyone is interested in saving tax and shipping charges.
Wagner IC $881-$988

[AldermanToffee]

There's already a thread on this, started by Andy. I don't have the link sorry.

[FromS60toB61.8t]

There's already a thread on this, started by Andy. I don't have the link sorry.

oh, that would be great to see.

I didn't come across it when i searched so i figured i would start one.

If anyone happens to have the link, please share!

[QuickHandCam]

I'm in the market for an intercooler, and have searched a bit on here.
Initially I was looking at the Wagner, but for 1/3 of the price, the Rev9 one seems like the better bang for the buck for what I'm aiming for.
I'm only planning on going stage 2 with intake, dp, intercooler, so I'm wondering if I would even be utilizing the extra cooling that the wagner offers.

I found this thread comparing all of the options (Intercooler Area-Volume Comparison Thread), and $350 for something that ranks in the middle of all of the intercoolers seems like a no-brainer to me.

The purpose of this thread is to see what people are getting as ACTUAL IAT temps after repeated pulls, and at what ambient temp with each intercooler and with what turbo/tune setup.

Post up any data you may have and I will compile it into a google doc to possibly help others decide in the future as well.

Thanks for checking out my post!
However I have updated the Rev9 intercooler pricing. It was lower, but since they have ran out of stock they have increased the price.
If you don't plan on going hybrid turbo then any of these intercoolers will work, but if you are then look at the bigger volume units with a greater surface area.

[Mad Cow]

Keep in mind that there's more to an intercooler than raw cool-ability, one of the big reasons I went with Wagner (which is definitely overkill for anything less than a hybrid turbo) is the quality and design of the package as a whole. My impression of the Rev9 brackets is that they just bent some steel flat stock to make bolt holes line up and left it at that, no consideration for how securely it holds the intercooler. The last thing you want is a heavy intercooler just flopping around in there because the mounting brackets can't hold it steady. I'm sure you could fabricate something better, but for a lot of people that's not a viable option. I can't speak for all the different alternatives, but the Wagner mounts are very well-designed and I can barely move it a quarter inch in any direction. The ECS mounting system looks pretty good too, I would've gone with that instead of Wagner personally but it's backordered forever.

Maybe I'm overthinking it but I'm not a fan of the Rev9. Clone products always halfass design and material choices whenever possible, sometimes that only creates theoretical issues, sometimes it creates practical issues.

[FromS60toB61.8t]

Thanks for checking out my post!
However I have updated the Rev9 intercooler pricing. It was lower, but since they have ran out of stock they have increased the price.
If you don't plan on going hybrid turbo then any of these intercoolers will work, but if you are then look at the bigger volume units with a greater surface area.

I found some sources that still have it at $380 so it's still a considerable difference. I plan on staying stock turbo until i get another daily (atleast another year or two) so i fell like going wagner would be overkill.

Keep in mind that there's more to an intercooler than raw cool-ability, one of the big reasons I went with Wagner (which is definitely overkill for anything less than a hybrid turbo) is the quality and design of the package as a whole. My impression of the Rev9 brackets is that they just bent some steel flat stock to make bolt holes line up and left it at that, no consideration for how securely it holds the intercooler. The last thing you want is a heavy intercooler just flopping around in there because the mounting brackets can't hold it steady. I'm sure you could fabricate something better, but for a lot of people that's not a viable option. I can't speak for all the different alternatives, but the Wagner mounts are very well-designed and I can barely move it a quarter inch in any direction. The ECS mounting system looks pretty good too, I would've gone with that instead of Wagner personally but it's backordered forever.

Maybe I'm overthinking it but I'm not a fan of the Rev9. Clone products always halfass design and material choices whenever possible, sometimes that only creates theoretical issues, sometimes it creates practical issues.

Yea, that's the only downside i see to it, but i have access to a 3D-printer and CNC machine at work so i can fab up some real mounts for free.

this one here is a pretty decent looking one as well with much better mounting points
https://www.ebay.com/itm/22369972490...EAAOSwbwRiY38X

[Andy_FL]

Keep in mind that there's more to an intercooler than raw cool-ability, one of the big reasons I went with Wagner (which is definitely overkill for anything less than a hybrid turbo) is the quality and design of the package as a whole. My impression of the Rev9 brackets is that they just bent some steel flat stock to make bolt holes line up and left it at that, no consideration for how securely it holds the intercooler. The last thing you want is a heavy intercooler just flopping around in there because the mounting brackets can't hold it steady. I'm sure you could fabricate something better, but for a lot of people that's not a viable option. I can't speak for all the different alternatives, but the Wagner mounts are very well-designed and I can barely move it a quarter inch in any direction. The ECS mounting system looks pretty good too, I would've gone with that instead of Wagner personally but it's backordered forever.

Maybe I'm overthinking it but I'm not a fan of the Rev9. Clone products always halfass design and material choices whenever possible, sometimes that only creates theoretical issues, sometimes it creates practical issues.

Yeah maybe overthinking a bit. While the REV9 brackets are non CNC machined like an APR bracket, they're quite sufficient for the application and not going to allow it to "flop around." LOL. I did a stock vs Rev9 vs CLM intercooler comparo on a dyno and while the Rev9 was inferior to the CLM, my take home message was that it's great bang for the buck (at least it was when it was in the $350 range). The thread is here in the archives somewhere, not hard to find. At a higher price point, the Rev9 may not make as much sense. But, I at least showed that it wasn't a complete dud, as many are quick to assume. I'd say its sufficient for a stock turbo Stg1/2.

[FromS60toB61.8t]

Yeah maybe overthinking a bit. While the REV9 brackets are non CNC machined like an APR bracket, they're quite sufficient for the application and not going to allow it to "flop around." LOL. I did a stock vs Rev9 vs CLM intercooler comparo on a dyno and while the Rev9 was inferior to the CLM, my take home message was that it's great bang for the buck (at least it was when it was in the $350 range). The thread is here in the archives somewhere, not hard to find. At a higher price point, the Rev9 may not make as much sense. But, I at least showed that it wasn't a complete dud, as many are quick to assume. I'd say its sufficient for a stock turbo Stg1/2.

I think i just found it. So from what I'm seeing, the rev9 runs like 5-10°C hotter than the higher end FMIC, but even then, at its hottest, it's still better than OEM without load lmao.

It's intriguing also, more and more chinese/ali express items show up that have the same or very similar design to the carbnlabs products. This is another one i saw that looks VERY close to the CLM one.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/19461583556...QAAOSwBhRhuDRa

There's also heat shield wrapped downpipes that look almost exactly the same.

[QuickHandCam]

I think i just found it. So from what I'm seeing, the rev9 runs like 5-10°C hotter than the higher end FMIC, but even then, at its hottest, it's still better than OEM without load lmao.

It's intriguing also, more and more chinese/ali express items show up that have the same or very similar design to the carbnlabs products. This is another one i saw that looks VERY close to the CLM one.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/19461583556...QAAOSwBhRhuDRa

There's also heat shield wrapped downpipes that look almost exactly the same.

There's a few companies on Alibaba/Aliexpress that if you do some digging will have the same specifications that the Wagner's offer. Not saying the same performance, but same everything... Color, Tube and Fin, Width, Height, Length, Mounting points, etc. Even same looking design on the end tanks.

[Mad Cow]

I found some sources that still have it at $380 so it's still a considerable difference. I plan on staying stock turbo until i get another daily (atleast another year or two) so i fell like going wagner would be overkill.



Yea, that's the only downside i see to it, but i have access to a 3D-printer and CNC machine at work so i can fab up some real mounts for free.

this one here is a pretty decent looking one as well with much better mounting points
https://www.ebay.com/itm/22369972490...EAAOSwbwRiY38X

Oh snap that's a straight Wagner clone right down to the mounts, it even uses the Wagner install pictures. How did I not find this when I was searching?

A lot of carbnlab products are straight outta China, they're not blatant about it like most resellers but it's pretty clear when you can see the same stuff on Aliexpress. Maybe they pay for better QC, maybe they don't, but I prefer to go straight to the source and cut out the middleman fee.

Yeah maybe overthinking a bit. While the REV9 brackets are non CNC machined like an APR bracket, they're quite sufficient for the application and not going to allow it to "flop around." LOL. I did a stock vs Rev9 vs CLM intercooler comparo on a dyno and while the Rev9 was inferior to the CLM, my take home message was that it's great bang for the buck (at least it was when it was in the $350 range). The thread is here in the archives somewhere, not hard to find. At a higher price point, the Rev9 may not make as much sense. But, I at least showed that it wasn't a complete dud, as many are quick to assume. I'd say its sufficient for a stock turbo Stg1/2.

That's good to know, when I saw the long vertical brackets I assumed they wouldn't provide much support for front-to-back movement or twisting.

[YoYo]

I was about to say that looks like the Wagner. Do you think it's designed and tested like a Wagner?

[FromS60toB61.8t]

Oh snap that's a straight Wagner clone right down to the mounts, it even uses the Wagner install pictures. How did I not find this when I was searching?

A lot of carbnlab products are straight outta China, they're not blatant about it like most resellers but it's pretty clear when you can see the same stuff on Aliexpress. Maybe they pay for better QC, maybe they don't, but I prefer to go straight to the source and cut out the middleman fee.



That's good to know, when I saw the long vertical brackets I assumed they wouldn't provide much support for front-to-back movement or twisting.

only difference i have noticed between the wagner and the "competition" one is 70mm vs 60mm thickness.

seems like the inside is a bit different between the two as well

[AldermanToffee]

IRT: Carbnlab products coming out of China.

Yep, apart from their carbon offerings, any manufactured performance parts they offer are made in China.

However.. there is definitely a noticeable difference in terms of quality and material used between the "official" offerings and the knock off items. The factory that manufactures the parts for Carbnlab reproduces them on the side but they cut a few corners to bring down costs and increase their own profit margins.

If you don't care about that then there isn't really any reason to not buy the cheaper knock off to be honest (unless you want to support Carbnlab, which I recommend). No different to clothe reps.

[FromS60toB61.8t]

IRT: Carbnlab products coming out of China.

Yep, apart from their carbon offerings, any manufactured performance parts they offer are made in China.

However.. there is definitely a noticeable difference in terms of quality and material used between the "official" offerings and the knock off items. The factory that manufactures the parts for Carbnlab reproduces them on the side but they cut a few corners to bring down costs and increase their own profit margins.

If you don't care about that then there isn't really any reason to not buy the cheaper knock off to be honest (unless you want to support Carbnlab, which I recommend). No different to clothe reps.

yea, that's what it seems like.

Im looking for a downpipe and am waiting for the carbnlab or CTS one to come in stock. The aliexpress ones seem to taper down right after the v-band, but the other two seem to have a much smoother transition.

I ended up ordering the Rev9 IC yesterday. $409 shipped after tax, figured I could sell it for close to that after I'm done with it and ready to go hybrid turbo/wagner IC.

[AldermanToffee]

yea, that's what it seems like.

Im looking for a downpipe and am waiting for the carbnlab or CTS one to come in stock. The aliexpress ones seem to taper down right after the v-band, but the other two seem to have a much smoother transition.

I ended up ordering the Rev9 IC yesterday. $409 shipped after tax, figured I could sell it for close to that after I'm done with it and ready to go hybrid turbo/wagner IC.

Carbnlab are currently working on a new downpipe which I believe will be available soon. I definitely recommend their downpipe for anyone wanting to run catless.

Speaking of which, that's just reminded me that I've got a milltek decat sitting in my storage container.. I should probably sell that.

[slws4]

I did a bit of research:

400 and below: Rev 9 - great bang for the buck but would probably go hybrid and due to the cost, reselling wouldn't be worth it to me so i opted out of this one
500-600 - Ebay chinese clones (wagner) - I wouldve went with this but due to the amount, at that price Id just throw another 100-200 and get a legit made product from the 600-900 range below.
600-900: CTS,CarbnLab,AWE, HG Motorsports - I settled in this range. And ultimately picked the HG Motorsports one. Reasoning was that it was made in germany, and the other ones were probably all chinese made. Carbnlab looked like a Forge clone IMO but in its defense is it comes with alot of hardware, piping and what not. My HG one just came with brackets LOL.
1000+: Wagner/Forge/APR: Way too expensive, all looked great, and im sure fitment is nice. Yea I wasn't going to touch any of these due to pricing, 1k for an intercooler is insanity.

Downpipe - plenty of choices out there. At this point you can even pick up a chinese clone. I got an offer on a really good deal brand new Bull X pipe (after getting burned by a member on here via EBAY). So I was out 500 bucks on a chinese clone downpipe. Coughed up more dough and had to re buy. I now have a chinese clone of a a7 or a6 downpipe if anyone wants.

HG FMIC: https://hg-motorsport.de/en/hf-serie...9-2.0-3.0-tfsi
HG Bull X pipe: https://hg-motorsport.de/en/bull-x-d.../s5-b9-3.0tfsi

[jrhgto]

I did a bit of research:

400 and below: Rev 9 - great bang for the buck but would probably go hybrid and due to the cost, reselling wouldn't be worth it to me so i opted out of this one
500-600 - Ebay chinese clones (wagner) - I wouldve went with this but due to the amount, at that price Id just throw another 100-200 and get a legit made product from the 600-900 range below.
600-900: CTS,CarbnLab,AWE, HG Motorsports - I settled in this range. And ultimately picked the HG Motorsports one. Reasoning was that it was made in germany, and the other ones were probably all chinese made. Carbnlab looked like a Forge clone IMO but in its defense is it comes with alot of hardware, piping and what not. My HG one just came with brackets LOL.
1000+: Wagner/Forge/APR: Way too expensive, all looked great, and im sure fitment is nice. Yea I wasn't going to touch any of these due to pricing, 1k for an intercooler is insanity.

Downpipe - plenty of choices out there. At this point you can even pick up a chinese clone. I got an offer on a really good deal brand new Bull X pipe (after getting burned by a member on here via EBAY). So I was out 500 bucks on a chinese clone downpipe. Coughed up more dough and had to re buy. I now have a chinese clone of a a7 or a6 downpipe if anyone wants.

HG FMIC: https://hg-motorsport.de/en/hf-serie...9-2.0-3.0-tfsi
HG Bull X pipe: https://hg-motorsport.de/en/bull-x-d.../s5-b9-3.0tfsi

Are you located in Europe? I see that the HG Motorsports IC costs 157 euros to ship to the USA. Is there a US seller that stocks it?

[INS4NE_B9]

Are you located in Europe? I see that the HG Motorsports IC costs 157 euros to ship to the USA. Is there a US seller that stocks it?

EMD Auto sells them.

[jrhgto]

Thanks...Looks like EMD sells them for the same price as Buying directly from HG and paying the usa shipping costs

[slws4]

Are you located in Europe? I see that the HG Motorsports IC costs 157 euros to ship to the USA. Is there a US seller that stocks it?

Yea as noted I used emd auto. Their prices in relation of the product is real. Take a look at their lowering springs; or their cf lip. Nothing is wildly priced.

But yea great guys/shop. I’ve copped both the fmic and the dp from them overall both experiences = great.

Now if I can somehow magically send my car to ca and have them build me a motor and a full frame turbo setup I’d be set lol

[ESSVIER]

Anecdotal evidence:

I’m running the ECS intercooler with JB4. George@BMS, unsolicited, told me my intercooler is working very well based on the logs I sent him. I was logging back to back runs using Map 4 which is usually reserved for ethanol blends or race gas, but he said everything was looking good on my car running 93 octane. Mind, I have only been approved to use this map up to 80F ambient. I haven’t sent him any logs at higher ambient temps.

IMG_0996.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

[ESSVIER]

Anecdotal evidence:

I’m running the ECS intercooler with JB4. George@BMS, unsolicited, told me my intercooler is working very well based on the logs I sent him. I was logging back to back runs using Map 4 which is usually reserved for ethanol blends or race gas, but he said everything was looking good on my car running 93 octane. Mind, I have only been approved to use this map up to 80F ambient. I haven’t sent him any logs at higher ambient temps.

IMG_0996.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

[JimmyS3]

Anecdotal evidence:

I’m running the ECS intercooler with JB4. George@BMS, unsolicited, told me my intercooler is working very well based on the logs I sent him. I was logging back to back runs using Map 4 which is usually reserved for ethanol blends or race gas, but he said everything was looking good on my car running 93 octane. Mind, I have only been approved to use this map up to 80F ambient. I haven’t sent him any logs at higher ambient temps.

IMG_0996.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum

My exact setup as well.. JB4 & ECS intercooler.

Coming out of warranty so JB4 is for sale but that combo was great!

[DreamTFK]

Finally got around to installing my Wagner IC with charge pipes. I live in Florida so it does get pretty hot here. Build quality is excellent.

Really don't drive that much but I am sure it will help when I hit the highway and need to leave a BWM in my rear mirror.

[OverBooster]

I went with AWE. Had it on for about two years and seems to be working great along with my tune. Install was a breeze and everything has remained tight and secure. Dealer has never mentioned anything about it.

[flee]

Finally got around to installing my Wagner IC with charge pipes. I live in Florida so it does get pretty hot here. Build quality is excellent.

Really don't drive that much but I am sure it will help when I hit the highway and need to leave a BWM in my rear mirror.

In FL as well, curious what your IAT averages. I’m running the Rev9 and lately I’m hovering at 100-120 and around 80 wot.

[Quickarl]

Has anyone seen the AWE Cold Front? What do they think about it?

[qcrazy]

Here is some actual data. 2018 S4 running a Wagner IC - Stage 1 (91 oct). Data pulled from a 0-124MPH (0-200kph) run.

This run was done a while back with my EPL. I did another run today with my IE tune, but the IE logging has some issues so I didn't include the data here. IE run was actually a bit better all around (a few degrees), just the logging time stamps have problems.

What you see below is the temperature delta over ambient. In this case the Wagner IC maxed out on this run 29.6F above ambient. After the run, you can see a decent recovery...50 seconds after the pull, the temps recovered back to near where the car started.

I also included a few of my other cars just for comparison purposes. All cars were on 91. The B9 has the lowest temperature, but it is also by far the least modified.
0to200IAT-Stage1.JPG

[flee]

Cool info ^

[FromS60toB61.8t]

Update:
Found a site selling brand new wagner for $881 shipped and no tax, so i chanced it and ordered it. Should be coming in today, so I will report back if it is legit or not. The site has some weird facebook reviews so I wasn't sure if it's a legit place or not. Ordered on monday, then heard nothing until midnight last night when i got a tracking number.
Price is back up to $988, but this is where i got it if anyone is interested in saving tax and shipping charges.
Wagner IC $881-$988