realistically how much ADM are u willing to pay?

[sanlovessushi]

as of right now my dealership said i would be paying msrp plus 1200 for some dealer package that includes tint and few other things. ive been using the same guy since 2013 so i trust him. but i know in these crazy times anything can happen. i think push comes to shove 3k ADM is my limit. i hope for MY23 the price increase is around 1000-1500. BMW M3/4 got a price hike of 3700 for MY23. yikes!!

[jrubio96]

I'm in Central FL. Audi North Orlando told me 7500 markup, I said no thanks. I have a placeholder order for a 23 and it's being sold to me at MSRP, Audi Gainesville, much closer to me anyways and I purchased from them previously so it works out. I'd say 2500 is the most that makes sense. What manufacturers need to do is add more profit margin for the dealers and we wouldn't be dealing with this markup nonsense. I sold BMWs for a year up until last month, and you'd be surprised how little margin there is in cars in the 50-70k range from the german brands. By raising the price of the car on the MSRP side, you also won't be screwed as hard with negative equity.

[ThunderGatti]

Any reputable Audi Sport dealerships shouldn't be charging anything. That should only be happening at low volume RS model dealerships. To answer your question in the title, personally, I've had a major change of heart on the new model. Until I can get over the changes (if I'm ever able to), I honestly can't see myself spending anything at all on it.

[Woobachuckie]

I'm in Central FL. Audi North Orlando told me 7500 markup, I said no thanks. I have a placeholder order for a 23 and it's being sold to me at MSRP, Audi Gainesville, much closer to me anyways and I purchased from them previously so it works out. I'd say 2500 is the most that makes sense. What manufacturers need to do is add more profit margin for the dealers and we wouldn't be dealing with this markup nonsense. I sold BMWs for a year up until last month, and you'd be surprised how little margin there is in cars in the 50-70k range from the german brands. By raising the price of the car on the MSRP side, you also won't be screwed as hard with negative equity.

This, this right here. I left the car business in January and so many people would come in thinking there's gobs of profit of a RAM 1500 Limited. Shocker, there isn't on any RAM 1500. It all depends on what car, and price the dealer is selling at. The one I worked at would actually throw in all discounts that didn't have crazy terms and conditions. Hell, we were super late to the game when it came to markups.

But no Kevin and Karen, you can't get an additional 10k off a truck we are selling for 12k under MSRP.

To answer OP's question, I'd say 5k max but that's with it being perfect from factory(microscratches, swirls on the piano black, color accessories etc) but 2500 for something well outfitted with maybe the second choice color or packages. I understand why it is how it is, but that doesn't mean I like it.

[8STTRS]

Not that I'm in the market to buy a new RS3 or anything but, since you asked, zero. Zero is the amount of ADM I'm willing to pay. I've never paid MSRP for a car and the maximum I would ever stomach paying for a car is MSRP. There's no car out there that I want bad enough that I can't forego that aspect of car buying.

[TToysRuS]

Typically I believe the service department feeds the lions share of income for a dealership, not the sales department, but could be wrong.

[o1turbo30v]

Not that I'm in the market to buy a new RS3 or anything but, since you asked, zero. Zero is the amount of ADM I'm willing to pay. I've never paid MSRP for a car and the maximum I would ever stomach paying for a car is MSRP. There's no car out there that I want bad enough that I can't forego that aspect of car buying.

^^^ This is the correct answer, for what it is it’s already to expensive.

[RMode]

I'm in Central FL. Audi North Orlando told me 7500 markup, I said no thanks. I have a placeholder order for a 23 and it's being sold to me at MSRP, Audi Gainesville, much closer to me anyways and I purchased from them previously so it works out. I'd say 2500 is the most that makes sense. What manufacturers need to do is add more profit margin for the dealers and we wouldn't be dealing with this markup nonsense. I sold BMWs for a year up until last month, and you'd be surprised how little margin there is in cars in the 50-70k range from the german brands. By raising the price of the car on the MSRP side, you also won't be screwed as hard with negative equity.

raising the MSRP of the car has zero to do with equity.

[jrubio96]

raising the MSRP of the car has zero to do with equity.

Raising the actual price of the car will leave you with less equity loss than paying 10k over. Say msrp of car is 50, buy at 60, trade at 45, you're at much more loss than buy at msrp 60 and trade at 50-55.

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[RMode]

Raising the actual price of the car will leave you with less equity loss than paying 10k over. Say msrp of car is 50, buy at 60, trade at 45, you're at much more loss than buy at msrp 60 and trade at 50-55.

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I'm not following your logic, sorry

The MSRP of the car, whatever it is, and it's trade value later, have nothing in correlation with one another. Any dealer that charges an ADM is going to do so regardless of what MSRP ends up at. Their % margin does not change. In actuality in the last few years alone, our margins have dropped.

[DanMPower]

I'm not following your logic, sorry

The MSRP of the car, whatever it is, and it's trade value later, have nothing in correlation with one another. Any dealer that charges an ADM is going to do so regardless of what MSRP ends up at. Their % margin does not change. In actuality in the last few years alone, our margins have dropped.

I think he is saying that anything you pay over "MSRP" will be added to your loan, so when it comes to trading it in you will owe a lot more than what the car is worth. Just think of ADM as "rolling negative equity" into the new loan, a person who paid MSRP will owe less than a person who paid 10K ADM on the same car. His proposal instead of adding ADM, the manufacturers should increase the MSRP vs "invoice" so that the dealers will make more profit upfront and hopefully get rid of these ADM shenanigans. At least that's what I'm reading.

[RMode]

I think he is saying that anything you pay over "MSRP" will be added to your loan, so when it comes to trading it in you will owe a lot more than what the car is worth. Just think of ADM as "rolling negative equity" into the new loan, a person who paid MSRP will owe less than a person who paid 10K ADM on the same car. His proposal instead of adding ADM, the manufacturers should increase the MSRP vs "invoice" so that the dealers will make more profit upfront and hopefully get rid of these ADM shenanigans. At least that's what I'm reading.

Good luck trying to finance much of an ADM fee in this market - the banks are tougher and tougher on it the more time goes on. It's viewed differently to negative equity now. I'd doubt a bank (and definitely not AFS) is going to finance, let's say a $10k ADM fee on a $70k car, with no money down, even if the person is an 850 score. Those paying big ADM fees tend to not be financing that part of the deal at all. They are paying the ADM fee up front.

Never in the history of ever is Audi going to increase MSRP and leave invoice the same. They lose that way, and as the house, they don't lose.

At the end of the day, they cannot do a thing about an ADM fee, because they don't own the inventory, we do. As such, any dealer can sell any car for whatever they want. There may be (though I tend to doubt it), state policies which limit or prohibit ADM's. Not sure. I can't think of any states that have that off the top of my head.

When every manufacturer thought it was all about volume, you didn't see them taking their dealers to task for selling $2000 under invoice right? Not that any new RS3 ever sold for that, but you see my point. This is exactly the same thing. Now that they see volume really doesn't mean a thing, they are making the same as before on the car. But, they are making more profit than ever, on far less output, because there are zero incentives. They are simply not giving away money like they once did. At the same time, their costs have gone up for raw materials, supplies, and especially transportation. Nevertheless, their profits have soared.

[jrubio96]

I think he is saying that anything you pay over "MSRP" will be added to your loan, so when it comes to trading it in you will owe a lot more than what the car is worth. Just think of ADM as "rolling negative equity" into the new loan, a person who paid MSRP will owe less than a person who paid 10K ADM on the same car. His proposal instead of adding ADM, the manufacturers should increase the MSRP vs "invoice" so that the dealers will make more profit upfront and hopefully get rid of these ADM shenanigans. At least that's what I'm reading.

This is what I was trying to get across. Thanks!

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[8STTRS]

Good luck trying to finance much of an ADM fee in this market - the banks are tougher and tougher on it the more time goes on. It's viewed differently to negative equity now. I'd doubt a bank (and definitely not AFS) is going to finance, let's say a $10k ADM fee on a $70k car, with no money down, even if the person is an 850 score. Those paying big ADM fees tend to not be financing that part of the deal at all. They are paying the ADM fee up front.

Never in the history of ever is Audi going to increase MSRP and leave invoice the same. They lose that way, and as the house, they don't lose.

At the end of the day, they cannot do a thing about an ADM fee, because they don't own the inventory, we do. As such, any dealer can sell any car for whatever they want. There may be (though I tend to doubt it), state policies which limit or prohibit ADM's. Not sure. I can't think of any states that have that off the top of my head.

When every manufacturer thought it was all about volume, you didn't see them taking their dealers to task for selling $2000 under invoice right? Not that any new RS3 ever sold for that, but you see my point. This is exactly the same thing. Now that they see volume really doesn't mean a thing, they are making the same as before on the car. But, they are making more profit than ever, on far less output, because there are zero incentives. They are simply not giving away money like they once did. At the same time, their costs have gone up for raw materials, supplies, and especially transportation. Nevertheless, their profits have soared.

Many banks have a standing 125% policy in place. They are willing to finance a vehicle for 125% of it's estimated worth.

[RMode]

Many banks have a standing 125% policy in place. They are willing to finance a vehicle for 125% of it's estimated worth.

Many banks had 120% in place. Some, not many, had 125%. In years past. Those are rapidly shrinking. I do this all day, so I see it first hand. The underwriting of new car loans is far stricter now than it was even 6 months ago.

[8STTRS]

Many banks had 120% in place. Some, not many, had 125%. In years past. Those are rapidly shrinking. I do this all day, so I see it first hand. The underwriting of new car loans is far stricter now than it was even 6 months ago.

Oh, no doubt at all. There's opportunity to finance some modest ADM's but, that's not for me. I won't pay a penny over MSRP and even at MSRP, I'm not exactly a happy customer. I understand that the market is decidedly different now than it was a few years ago but still.

[RMode]

Oh, no doubt at all. There's opportunity to finance some modest ADM's but, that's not for me. I won't pay a penny over MSRP and even at MSRP, I'm not exactly a happy customer. I understand that the market is decidedly different now than it was a few years ago but still.

I hear ya. I've had a lot of cars as well. I've only paid an ADM once, many years back, but at the time was ok with it given the scarcity. At the same time, the way we've decided to do things is we won't charge over MSRP for anyone in our immediate area. Outside of the area, and it really only makes sense, since inventory is so limited in the first place. However, I also won't give any false hopes to those looking to order one for MY22 or 23. I already have more local orders than there will ever be allocations for.

[HODL_B58]

$0. Sure a tint package or floor mats etc something reasonable, but nothing over. If they have a modest deposit from me for over a year and still try to charge extra I’d be extra pissed and probably never drive an Audi/Porsche again (deposit was originally on a Porsche but then told them I wanted the RS3 instead). Luckily for me there’s probably a half dozen Audi dealers within a reasonable driving range for me—more room for negotiation. 8V wasn’t upcharged where I am—swear i might even seen a couple priced below MSRP. Volume provides jobs, ADM just lines pockets of a couple.
And I sound like a broken record, but—markets, markets, markets. Just because cars were selling overpriced anymore doesn’t mean it will continue. Most people don’t have the money they had a year ago and EV competition is getting hot (some also get tax credits), so even more asinine for dealers to try to pull one over

[RMode]

$0. Sure a tint package or floor mats etc something reasonable, but nothing over. If they have a modest deposit from me for over a year and still try to charge extra I’d be extra pissed and probably never drive an Audi/Porsche again (deposit was originally on a Porsche but then told them I wanted the RS3 instead). Luckily for me there’s probably a half dozen Audi dealers within a reasonable driving range for me—more room for negotiation. 8V wasn’t upcharged where I am—swear i might even seen a couple priced below MSRP. Volume provides jobs, ADM just lines pockets of a couple.
And I sound like a broken record, but—markets, markets, markets. Just because cars were selling overpriced anymore doesn’t mean it will continue. Most people don’t have the money they had a year ago and EV competition is getting hot (some also get tax credits), so even more asinine for dealers to try to pull one over

Didn't even consider the point about the deposit, which is a great point. A 0% interest loan to the dealer for a completely unspecified amount of time, and then a further kick to the nuts by paying over sticker?

I'd also never accept a car tinted either, but that is a personal preference.

The problem you'll face now is volume. There simply isn't any, and there isn't going to be any for the 22-23 model year cars. It won't last forever that is true, but it's never ever going back to what it once was. It simply can't.

I totally get your point on the marketplace in general, and generally agree, but, the typical EV buyer isn't cross shopping an RS anything.

[Skunkwerx]

as of right now my dealership said i would be paying msrp plus 1200 for some dealer package that includes tint and few other things. ive been using the same guy since 2013 so i trust him. but i know in these crazy times anything can happen. i think push comes to shove 3k ADM is my limit. i hope for MY23 the price increase is around 1000-1500. BMW M3/4 got a price hike of 3700 for MY23. yikes!!

Those numbers don't sound too bad from my seat and where I "feel" now. Depending on how much I like a car and understanding how popular / rare / unique it may be... I'm willing to pay a premium but it varies. No matter what, there is always someone willing to pay a minimal to outrageous ADM so whatever "$ line" each of us choose to draw for our own reasons... someone is willing to go past it. Some dealerships know this and continue the practice.

I bet in a few months if we look back.... the $1200 you noted above will be considered a bargain.

[0000 RS5]

^ this. Plus knowing what I know now, I would have paid more for my car than I did initially. Though, I would prefer that money go to Audi and not the dealer.


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[ECNMY R]

I think in a competitive market like California, ADM ~$5k for a new RS3 is gonna be a good deal. The supply is simply nowhere near the demand, with no sign of catching up, and MSRP doesn't reflect the car's real world value. Guys on forums love to talk about what big discounts they get but that stuff doesn't hold anymore in big markets. It's like people who won't pay over list for a house, or are "waiting for the crash." Not gonna happen. We aren't building enough houses, Audi isn't building enough RS3s.

I have a Cayman GTS 4.0 (Guards Red, manual) arriving in six weeks, for which I'm paying $10k ADM, negotiated down from the $15k they were asking. Good luck convincing me that's a bad idea. And later this year someone in a $70k MSRP RS3 they paid $75k for probably won't feel bad about it either.

[sanlovessushi]

Rmode... how are you guys handling the rs3 that you guys are getting from audi. whos getting first crack? ill admit my dealership did ask for 5k deposit, but since ive bought 2 cars from the same guy he said 2.5k was good. its been 3 weeks, i still havent seen the charges on my CC. last time they never cashed the check i wrote for a deposit, granted that was with an allocation. i was hesitant to put down 2.5 deposit without an allocation. but i figured if they do get some my22 rs3, they would ask the people with deposit first.

[RMode]

Rmode... how are you guys handling the rs3 that you guys are getting from audi. whos getting first crack? ill admit my dealership did ask for 5k deposit, but since ive bought 2 cars from the same guy he said 2.5k was good. its been 3 weeks, i still havent seen the charges on my CC. last time they never cashed the check i wrote for a deposit, granted that was with an allocation. i was hesitant to put down 2.5 deposit without an allocation. but i figured if they do get some my22 rs3, they would ask the people with deposit first.

I have 6 people with orders in, excluding myself, so it will be for the first person who ordered. I'll be doing a 23 since I want an exclusive color.

[juve05]

My dealer said they wouldn't charge more than MSRP....let's hope the rubber meets the road when we can actually order.

[ZRated_]

I have 6 people with orders in, excluding myself, so it will be for the first person who ordered. I'll be doing a 23 since I want an exclusive color.

What Exclusive color you lookin to get? Mexico Blue for me.


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[RMode]

What Exclusive color you lookin to get? Mexico Blue for me.


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I wish I could say I knew lol. I have it narrowed to 8 at last check

[ZRated_]

I wish I could say I knew lol. I have it narrowed to 8 at last check

Damn 8 colors? Quite the amount haha.


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[RMode]

There’s too many nice Porsche colors lol, they make it tough. I still have a couple older Audi books to go through too and check colors

[jsilas]

$0.00

hth

[Kemora]

$0.00

hth

Yep. This car is a want, not a need, I can wait, and there are dealers who will sell at MSRP. I'm willing to make a road trip out of it.

[LJS5]

0.00

[MXblau]

What Exclusive color you lookin to get? Mexico Blue for me.


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You want to join the smurfy family?

[meatoverrice]

lmao the dealership closest to me told me there's a $30k ADM on 22MY RS3s and an undefined ADM for all manufacturer ordered cars since "inventory is low". Yet nothing will change because a bunch of clowns will buy a $90k RS3 and the dealership is rewarded for their greed.

[949]

https://news.yahoo.com/volkswagen-bo...qqLNZpOxy4bOXk

[HODL_B58]

Said in other post: ADM on 2022/launch edition is good because it allows car to sit longer on dealer lot for us to see (unless dealer is a dick and ropes the car off). But I can’t help but wonder those quoting high markups—do you at all think maybe the way you are asking is influencing their answer? These are salesmen after all, if they think they can get you to pay markup, they’re gonna ask for it. So if you’re coming in asking “how much markup if any would i have to pay on a RS3” seems to me that’s seen as a green light to them to ask high. I doubt it’s the same once cars start hitting lots and the salesmen want to make sales

[Kaliking]

It really is a bummer that so many dealers are marking up, just sucks the joy and excitement out of any new product. I have heard that Ford dealers are already telling potential Lightning buyers to expect 40 to 50k mark ups.

[HODL_B58]

It really is a bummer that so many dealers are marking up, just sucks the joy and excitement out of any new product. I have heard that Ford dealers are already telling potential Lightning buyers to expect 40 to 50k mark ups.

Financial advice: don’t pay the markup. Car prices aren’t going to be very high when everyone can only afford mass transit in a few years. I was just reflecting about how backwards all the traditional financial advice has been over the last few years. They’ve always said cars are the worst investment you can make, but here we are your car has probably held value better than the S&P500. But the greed is getting too high now—people have already become so used to prices just going up so they’re just assuming their cars will keep appreciating. It’s gonna be a f’ng violent price correction when it reverses. You should see how cheap dealers were selling autos back in 2008. Also doesn’t help that low inventories and high resales lead to people shotgunning deposits on cars hoping to get lucky. Hell I have deposits down on 5 myself. RS3 is the only one I’m dead set on, the F150 Lightning will probably run out of tax credits by the time I get mine and then I sure as hell am not paying $80k for a truck no matter how practical it may be. Anyways I digress, tl;dr dealers have gotten too cocky with long waiting lists that are just going to vaporize once vehicles start getting delivered in scale. Nvidia is already freezing hiring, doesn’t seem like something they’d do if they still couldnt meet demand on chips for all the vehicle demand

[sanlovessushi]

had a dealer quote me msrp + 2700 for ceramic coating, nitrogen, and tint + 5k adm... no thank you.

[Chase1994]

had a dealer quote me msrp + 2700 for ceramic coating, nitrogen, and tint + 5k adm... no thank you.

There are few dealers who sell these at MSRP the ones that do already have massive wait lists for even getting a 23MY I was able to get my hands on a 22 kemora grey every option but the CCB option[forgot the name of option] for 5k ADM but brings I’m getting what I paid for my 2019 STI brand new 3+ years ago it’s not bad plus I’m impatient