Add me to the PCV failure list 2015 S6

[gk1]

CEL came on the other day. Loss of power. Whistle sound. Classic PCV failure scenario.
Still drove "ok" just low power. Took it to the dealer that has been excellent for me so far.
Tuned so PCV warranty extension does not apply. Even though it sucks since it is a known defective part. They are also saying because Audi has not release the strainer recall that they cannot do that at the same time.
I might just see how much extra that is on my own dime to avoid two surgeries.
PCV repair initial quote is $3400.

[qcrazy]

That sucks. Can you just park the car and wait until the strainer recall comes through? Then you should only have to pay for the PCV itself. All labor should be covered under the strainer.

[Alabama]

I might just see how much extra that is on my own dime to avoid two surgeries.

But if the screen recall will pay for everything related to the screen, why incur any extra expense now? Aren't there threads from people who got quotes for PCV alone and PCV with g-screen replacement? My memory is that several hours of labor were added. Oh well, excellent maintenance is not a perfect defense against problems.

[gk1]

That sucks. Can you just park the car and wait until the strainer recall comes through? Then you should only have to pay for the PCV itself. All labor should be covered under the strainer.

Yeah sucks.
Parking is actually a good idea, but no idea when the recall will come through and I need a car unfortunately.

[gk1]

But if the screen recall will pay for everything related to the screen, why incur any extra expense now? Aren't there threads from people who got quotes for PCV alone and PCV with g-screen replacement? My memory is that several hours of labor were added. Oh well, excellent maintenance is not a perfect defense against problems.

I have to see how much extra they want to do the screen. A couple extra hours/few hundred dollars, not to have to go under the knife again....I have to wait and see what they come back with.
I asked them to please just do the screen replacement as the recall now, but they have to follow the rules which are still no go by Audi. Just usual crap timing as always.

[Alabama]

Just usual crap timing as always.

Some of the most helpful AZ members have the worst luck. Maybe it's like your sunroof; you got the sea level PCV and the internal pressure caused it to blow apart at altitude!

[gk1]

Some of the most helpful AZ members have the worst luck. Maybe it's like your sunroof; you got the sea level PCV and the internal pressure caused it to blow apart at altitude!

Thanks. lol
Worst part is it must have failed when I went over to the other office for work. I thought it was just heat soak at first, the car was a dog but no CEL and I couldn't hear the whistle with the windows up.
CEL didn't come on until after I parked and came out to go home.

[RS5ish]

2 weeks ago I had the turbos replaced under warranty and the wanted an extra $725 to do the pcv valve while they were in there.

[gk1]

2 weeks ago I had the turbos replaced under warranty and the wanted an extra $725 to do the pcv valve while they were in there.

Thanks for the info. Yeah the part alone is ~$300.

[qcrazy]

Just to clarify here. There is a difference between replacing the turbos and replacing the screen/strainer.

The turbos can be replaced without removing the PCV. I personally wouldn't want to, but it can be done.

The oil strainer canNOT be replaced without removing the PCV. You physically have to remove the PCV to get access to the valley cover bolts. To replace the PCV with a strainer replacement, you would simply have to just grab a new PCV off the shelf. No additional work would be required.

[gk1]

Just to clarify here. There is a difference between replacing the turbos and replacing the screen/strainer.

The turbos can be replaced without removing the PCV. I personally wouldn't want to, but it can be done.

The oil strainer canNOT be replaced without removing the PCV. You physically have to remove the PCV to get access to the valley cover bolts. To replace the PCV with a strainer replacement, you would simply have to just grab a new PCV off the shelf. No additional work would be required.

Yep. I was hoping I'd make it to the recall and I'd just have them do the PCV then, but no, not that lucky.

[RAF_S7]

I thought the PCV was subject to an extended warranty in the USA?

I’ve just had the turbo screen recall work completed in the UK, and I had them do the PCV while there.

I supplied the replacement PCV, they swapped it out at no additional cost, since they have to unplug it to get to the strainer

[Alabama]

I thought the PCV was subject to an extended warranty in the USA?

Like you, gk1 has an APR tune so Audi would likely deny the warranty. Maybe gk1 should offer to buy kdbryce's C7.5. $7,002 might close the deal!

[gk1]

Like you, gk1 has an APR tune so Audi would likely deny the warranty. Maybe gk1 should offer to buy kdbryce's C7.5. $7,002 might close the deal!

Exactly.
They said the tune voided the extended PCV warranty. And since the recall is not available yet in the US I can't just ask them to do the recall and tack on the PCV.
qcrazy's idea is actually the best...just park the car until the recall is ready and then tell them to also do the PCV, but even the dealer has no idea WHEN the recall will finally be ready...could be weeks...months...unknown.
They even said if I pay to have the rev G screen installed which they do have in stock...it will not mark the recall as completed. So if/when I go to sell it will have an outstanding recall that I can try to asterisks with service records showing they did the exact same work as the recall.

[gk1]

Final dealer estimates:
PCV $2700
Calibration since the bumper is off.. $600
Screen/check valve $1200

Total $4500

[Mr-S6-13]

I would go to a third party and have them do the screen and pcv valve then send audi the receipts to get reimbursed. I'm not going to the dealership.

2013 Audi S6 Prestige Quartz Gray | IE Engineering Stage 1 91oct | IE Engineering TCU Tune | Dyno 4-1-2022 471 WHP | 583 WTQ |
Track Time 03-13-2022
IE Stage 1 tune with Intake
91 Oct
1/4 Time w/o Tune
12.463 @ 109Mph

[MattyMarkey]

I would go to a third party and have them do the screen and pcv valve then send audi the receipts to get reimbursed. I'm not going to the dealership.

I think it's only for retroactive repairs - if it fails today or tomorrow, you have to go to the dealer. He also wont be able to get reimbursed, since AoA knows he is tuned now.

$1200 additional for the screen/check valve while they are already in there is ludicrous!

gk1 - since you are tuned and assuming your preference is to keep the screen(?), you could go the indy route and likely save some cash. After all, since you have to get the PCV replaced anyway (paying out-of-pocket), you could have the indy do the PCV and the revG screen while they are in there, for a lot less than this Audi total quote; I'd wager a guess 1/3rd less or more ($2500 for PCV/Screen replacement). Though you might have to get recal'd at the dealer.

I also do wonder if Audi may reimburse people a ways down the road for those that chose to incur the cost to proactively upgrade to revG

[DT13s6]

I’m a little confused. The dealer will cover the screen recall but not the PCV with a tune? I just got my letter stating a recall for the screen but no replacement yet. They say another letter will follow when the work can be completed. I have a DS1 tune myself and I was thinking I would have to bite the bullet and get them done on my dime.

[MattyMarkey]

I’m a little confused. The dealer will cover the screen recall but not the PCV with a tune? I just got my letter stating a recall for the screen but no replacement yet. They say another letter will follow when the work can be completed. I have a DS1 tune myself and I was thinking I would have to bite the bullet and get them done on my dime.

Correct. PCV is an extended warranty. Screen is a Safety Recall, which they are legally obligated to cover (aka tune, mods, etc. do not matter)

[gk1]

I try my best to offer full discloser (even if bad) and if you have any technical questions please ask.

Replace failed PCV

079-103-542-E Separator (PCV) $431 $323 $291
079-129-717-J Gasket $46 $39 $24 (air guide gasket)
079-129-717-K Gasket $46 $39 $35 (air guide gasket)
N-904-425-01 Clip (hose clamp) $2 $1 $1
N-904-898-01 Clip (hose clamp) $1 $0.50 $0.50
N-904-095-01 Hose Clamp $0.82 $0.36 $0.32
079-145-818 Seal (Throttle Body gasket) $15 $11 $9
079-145-417-B Seal (recirc tube seals) $38 $31 $28
WHT-001-011 Seal ring (water pipe lower seal left) $4 $1 $1
G-12E-050-1G-DSP Coolant $44 $26 $23

Parts $713 Labor $2553 - Total $3266

Replace oil strainer and associated parts

079-115-175-G Strainer $12 $8 $6
079-103-175-C Valve (oil check valve) $130 $90 $68
079-103-161-Q Gasket (crank vent cover gasket) $17 $12 $11
079-145-242 Seal Ring (intercooler brick face seal) $117 $82 $73
079-145-865 Gasket (intercooler brick bottom seal) $112 $78 $60
N-910-568-01 Seal ring (upper oil feed seal) $7 $4 $3
N-903-038-01 Seal ring (oil return sela) $2 $1 $1
WHT-006-901-A Seal ring (lower oil inlet seals) $6 $4 $3
WHT-006-335-A Seal ring (outlet seal) $4 $3 $2
WHT-006-537 Seal ring (water upper inlet seal) $7 $4 $3
WHT-001-011-A Seal ring (Lower inlet water) $2 $1 $1
G-12E-050-1G-DSP Coolant $44 $26 $23

Parts $532 Labor $630- Total $1162
Grand Total $4428 - discount + tax etc. = $4140

They also did a wheel alignment and calibration of all cameras afterwards.

Above I put Dealer price, MSRP from online and AudiUSApart.com price.

I know full well the dealer prices are a rip, especially considering the PCV has a warranty extension and the screen has an issued recall.
But alas I am tuned, also I'm not going to tackle this as a DIY, I feel it is foolish of me to wait for the recall to be officially released while they have the car apart, they give me a loaner for a week with a free tank of gas and free tolls (whoopee lol) and it included the alignment and camera/acc calibration which I would not be able to do.

I could have saved $435 on parts alone.
Was the alignment and calibration strictly needed, perhaps no, I think I needed it though. Would have saved $600.
Looks like they charged roughly 10 hours labor total. Took them about 3 days to do.


And here is what the screen looks like after 65k miles and mostly Motul Specific 502 or equivalent used every 5k miles.
I would not say clogged, but definitely debris there. Remember it is still wet with oil which will always make such a fine screen look "clogged".
Looks like the same debris as I saw when I cut open the main oil filter (carbon) (I might check later.)

[qcrazy]

Not plugged yet, but certainly on it's way. At least it is changed!

Also, I have no idea why they pulled your intercooler. That makes no sense to me. Unless you had some other issue going on.

[gk1]

Not plugged yet, but certainly on it's way. At least it is changed!

Also, I have no idea why they pulled your intercooler. That makes no sense to me. Unless you had some other issue going on.

I'm not sure...it doesn't have to be moved for the PCV work? or maybe more correctly the book maybe says remove it, but it could be done without?
They did not advise that there was any other issue regarding the intercooler.

Also BTW the debris does not appear to be carbon like in the main oil filter. It is not easily crushed and smeared like pencil lead. It seems like it is just straight small "debris" of some kind. No idea where it is coming from. Maybe like someone suggested, fibers from the main oil filter? Kinda defeats the point of an oil filter if it is the thing "introducing" debris that are then caught by this screen. Weird.

Also I know it is already documented, but my old "fine" strainer was 079-115-175-F on a 2015 pre-facelift US C7 S6 4.0T

Also FWIW some electrical contact cleaner spray cleaned it 100% and it looks like brand new. So it is not even like the screen is cooked or something...at least in my case.

The way I try to look at it is this is 65k miles & 8 years. So in my case even just replacing with the same fine filter should get me to 130k+, the course filter IMO should be even longer...well beyond my ownership I'm thinking.

[Alabama]

Also BTW the debris does not appear to be carbon like in the main oil filter. It is not easily crushed and smeared like pencil lead. It seems like it is just straight small "debris" of some kind. No idea where it is coming from.

Also FWIW some electrical contact cleaner spray cleaned it 100% and it looks like brand new. So it is not even like the screen is cooked or something...at least in my case.

So, the inference is that oil was still flowing freely through the "F" version screen but it was filtering out something?

[gk1]

So, the inference is that oil was still flowing freely through the "F" version screen but it was filtering out something?

Exactly.
What that something is...I am not sure, just looks like dirt to me.
Where it is coming from, again not sure.
I personally think it is from the intake. Blowby filth. Perhaps why people with poor filtration or aftermarket intakes, poor OCI and low quality oil may fail even sooner.
As some others mentioned and I confirmed in my case it was easily washed away so, at least for me, it is not any kind of coking or extreme heat in the valley causing the screen to oxidize shut or something to that effect.

FYI even the dealer master tech said the 10k OCI is ridiculous on this high heat high performance motor. As you can see even my relentless 5k interval cannot keep it spotless and it would surely clog over a longer time period. Hence the recall.

What worries me slightly more is I know there are other screens littered throughout the motor it is just they do not feed a "safety" critical system like the turbos. Just sucks thinking about those failing.
I know the oil control valve for the piston cooling jets has a screen, perhaps the timing chain tensioners like other motors...there are probably more. Well...fingers crossed.


Side note:

Prior to PCV failure I had noticed more oil consumption than usual.
I was adding 500ml-1L between 5k OCI since about 40k miles, but no PCV squeal.
I am curious to see if the oil consumption stops now.

[Valpo A7]

If you have not pulled the trigger on the dealer repair, maybe see if you can find a local indie shop that will be much less money.

[MattyMarkey]

If you have not pulled the trigger on the dealer repair, maybe see if you can find a local indie shop that will be much less money.

Based on the pics of his screen and check valve, I think he already pulled the trigger

[gk1]

If you have not pulled the trigger on the dealer repair, maybe see if you can find a local indie shop that will be much less money.

Based on the pics of his screen and check valve, I think he already pulled the trigger

Yep, it is done....I don't have time to shop around right now. Plus I don't have any idea of the quality of work of the indies in my area, but based on other contract work ...meh. The indie may get in their break some weird thing and take forever getting a part or half-ass it together...dealer had all the weird things they needed. The dealer took care of me the best they could even giving me a sales loaner for a couple days before the weekend which they did not have to do. Also I found out my front parking camera was glued in some weird way from a previous repair and the dealer can't even replace it...they would have to replace the entire bumper....shoddy previous repairs... ugh.

[qcrazy]

Also BTW the debris does not appear to be carbon like in the main oil filter. It is not easily crushed and smeared like pencil lead. It seems like it is just straight small "debris" of some kind. No idea where it is coming from. Maybe like someone suggested, fibers from the main oil filter? Kinda defeats the point of an oil filter if it is the thing "introducing" debris that are then caught by this screen. Weird.

Interesting! Oddly, my screen had much smaller and less debris (chunks) when I pulled it. Mine came out at 90k+ miles (after turbo popped). Minimal debris, but the screen was "masked" over by a coating. Thin film oxidation, I presume.

20210425_163244.jpg
20210425_164929.jpg

[gk1]

Interesting! Oddly, my screen had much smaller and less debris (chunks) when I pulled it. Mine came out at 90k+ miles (after turbo popped). Minimal debris, but the screen was "masked" over by a coating. Thin film oxidation, I presume.

20210425_163244.jpg
20210425_164929.jpg

Hmmm yeah. Mine was not like that and after cleaning it looks like a brand new screen other than the slight bulge to one side.

[austin_s]

I just had mine done too, under warranty. Guess I got lucky as I'm tuned. It probably helps that I bought the car from the same dealer I service it at, with all of the mods already installed...

[Akakios]

Exactly.
What that something is...I am not sure, just looks like dirt to me.
Where it is coming from, again not sure.
I personally think it is from the intake. Blowby filth. Perhaps why people with poor filtration or aftermarket intakes, poor OCI and low quality oil may fail even sooner.
As some others mentioned and I confirmed in my case it was easily washed away so, at least for me, it is not any kind of coking or extreme heat in the valley causing the screen to oxidize shut or something to that effect.

FYI even the dealer master tech said the 10k OCI is ridiculous on this high heat high performance motor. As you can see even my relentless 5k interval cannot keep it spotless and it would surely clog over a longer time period. Hence the recall.

What worries me slightly more is I know there are other screens littered throughout the motor it is just they do not feed a "safety" critical system like the turbos. Just sucks thinking about those failing.
I know the oil control valve for the piston cooling jets has a screen, perhaps the timing chain tensioners like other motors...there are probably more. Well...fingers crossed.


Side note:

Prior to PCV failure I had noticed more oil consumption than usual.
I was adding 500ml-1L between 5k OCI since about 40k miles, but no PCV squeal.
I am curious to see if the oil consumption stops now.

After I opened the filter box after picking the car up from Audi, I was shocked to see how much debris was in there. I wouldn't doubt that it would make it into the intake path if it weren't put back together properly or not using the pre-filter on the premium filters.

Lastly, many deal with engine mounts going out and there's absolutely zero tolerance for play in the air box connection to the filter which was a mistake from a design standpoint as it could allow debris in under heavy load if it weren't "screwed" back in properly or had a hair line crack in the plastic.