B9 Allroad - quattro ultra question

[djapeA4]

Hi everyone,

I've just traded in my SQ5 for a beautiful Manhattan gray B9 allroad (pics coming soon) and so far loving the car. Not in the same league performance wise, but the gas mileage is a big difference between the two. Hoping to go stage-1 down the road to add some power to the otherwise great handling wagon.

So my question is about quattro 'ultra'. I've read some articles about the app for the quattro ultra that shows how much it uses AWD vs FWD based on it's learning curve about your driving behavior. Like how much grip it has detected on your last trip and based on all possible variables/scenarios it decouples the rear wheels, then it shows you the percentage of AWD vs FWD used.

If this is true for a 2018 allroad, is this info accessible through MMI or via downloadable app?

[djapeA4]

So it seems like this app is only available to Audi engineers and given to journalists to showcase how it works. NOT available otherwise in any production form. I will reformulate my question:

Since the computer constantly adjusts the amount of AWD and how much of the stop/start function is being used, based on what it learned from the driver's input, does that mean it will apply those settings in all driving modes, comfort, auto and individual? I know the dynamic and offroad are full time 4WD so I didn't mention them.

[SJorge3442]

So it seems like this app is only available to Audi engineers and given to journalists to showcase how it works. NOT available otherwise in any production form. I will reformulate my question:

Since the computer constantly adjusts the amount of AWD and how much of the stop/start function is being used, based on what it learned from the driver's input, does that mean it will apply those settings in all driving modes, comfort, auto and individual? I know the dynamic and offroad are full time 4WD so I didn't mention them.

I cant really add to your question/information here, but I have been looking into learning more about the Ultra system since my 6 speed utilizes it as well. Regarding performance, I've never once thought to myself "this feels like a FWD car" or "I wish I had more grip on that corner" as the system does operate pretty flawlessly. There was a recent TSB that was put out for issues with the front clutch diff which seems like it is related to bad fluid. The TSB essentially has techs drain and fill the fluid, drive till warm, then drain and fill again. Some people (seems like the TSB is really only for the allroads) were having issues with binding/clunking when trying to make sharp turns at slow speeds. If the drain fill drain fill process doesnt fix their problems, they swap the front diff. Just something to be on the lookout for since information around the ultra system is pretty minimal.

In a perfect world, I'd love to lock the differently clutch + rear so it can be full time AWD, but theres no information around how to do that.

[HartzMts]

Not sure if I am adding much, but I remember watching a Youtube video a couple years ago of an Audi engineer (with a plugged-in laptop) sitting in the seat beside a journalist driving an Quattro Ultra-equipped Audi. The engineer is able to show exactly which portions of his hours-long drive engaged all four wheels - cornering, accelerations, etc. - also in real time. (I think his laptop screen would entirely change colors.) Based on what I remember learning, I would be very surprised if any learned settings were NOT applied to all driving modes. I mean, why wouldn't they? I remember being surprised that only a small amount of his drive-time (<20%) was operating in full quattro mode. Very efficient, of course, and the driver in the video (and I) could not perceive the FWD-AWD transititons. Enjoy your Audi. (And, yes, Stage One tune is a great idea!)

[djapeA4]

I cant really add to your question/information here, but I have been looking into learning more about the Ultra system since my 6 speed utilizes it as well. Regarding performance, I've never once thought to myself "this feels like a FWD car" or "I wish I had more grip on that corner" as the system does operate pretty flawlessly. There was a recent TSB that was put out for issues with the front clutch diff which seems like it is related to bad fluid. The TSB essentially has techs drain and fill the fluid, drive till warm, then drain and fill again. Some people (seems like the TSB is really only for the allroads) were having issues with binding/clunking when trying to make sharp turns at slow speeds. If the drain fill drain fill process doesnt fix their problems, they swap the front diff. Just something to be on the lookout for since information around the ultra system is pretty minimal.

In a perfect world, I'd love to lock the differently clutch + rear so it can be full time AWD, but theres no information around how to do that.

Thank you for that TSB - my new to me allroad had it's AT fluid replaced 29k km ago but I doubt that includes quattro ultra diffs & clutches because I'm guessing those are supposed to be lifetime oils. Also, so far I haven't heard any strange noises that would make me think something's wrong with it. That said, what I'm finding weird is the first few days of owning the car the, the stop/start mechanism was working like a charm. Now all of a sudden it's not kicking in at all. Not in ANY drive mode. My thinking is this: if the computer had learned from a few days of enjoying my new car with little bit of spirited driving, then stored that info, the stop/start function goes off. I'm labeled as aggressive driver. To test that theory I started driving in comfort mode today through the town. Stop/start is still not working (there are no lights on the dashboard). Maybe it will take few days to re-learn before it comes back, I don't know. I'm quite confused.

[SJorge3442]

Thank you for that TSB - my new to me allroad had it's AT fluid replaced 29k km ago but I doubt that includes quattro ultra diffs & clutches because I'm guessing those are supposed to be lifetime oils. Also, so far I haven't heard any strange noises that would make me think something's wrong with it. That said, what I'm finding weird is the first few days of owning the car the, the stop/start mechanism was working like a charm. Now all of a sudden it's not kicking in at all. Not in ANY drive mode. My thinking is this: if the computer had learned from a few days of enjoying my new car with little bit of spirited driving, then stored that info, the stop/start function goes off. I'm labeled as aggressive driver. To test that theory I started driving in comfort mode today through the town. Stop/start is still not working (there are no lights on the dashboard). Maybe it will take few days to re-learn before it comes back, I don't know. I'm quite confused.

Start/stop has a few conditions that must be met to work. Battery voltage has to be above a certain level and also if it's below a certain temp it won't activate either. There may be other conditions, but those are two big ones.

I doubt the diff fluid was changed as they probably just did the DSG change. Might be something to keep in mind. Now that these Ultra cars are starting to get some miles on them, issues are popping up so I'd def stay on top of the maintenance. I'll be doing my fluid soon and will be sure to write a how-to for future reference.

Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk

[djapeA4]

Based on what I remember learning, I would be very surprised if any learned settings were NOT applied to all driving modes. I mean, why wouldn't they? I remember being surprised that only a small amount of his drive-time (<20%) was operating in full quattro mode. Very efficient, of course, and the driver in the video (and I) could not perceive the FWD-AWD transititons.

I agree it's certainly efficient but my question is, how long does the memory last. In another words, how long is the learning curve between 2 drivers of the same car? If I drive more aggressive but my wife likes to save on gas and we both drive it on the same day, should the system relearn quickly enough to apply different setting to each driver in a single drive?

I'm experiencing this weird behavior where (what I think) previous owner's driving habits stored in the computer were causing the stop/start to work all the time even in individual mode set to dynamic engine-trans option, while now suddenly it's completely off all the time in all modes.

[a4audi4fun]

From the Owner's Manual, here are some of the conditions where the engine does not switch off even though Auto Start/Stop is enabled. Do any of these conditions apply to you? - for the interior temperature check the temp setting in the rear seat area as well.

Engine does not switch off
The system checks that certain conditions are met before and during each stop phase. The engine will not switch off in the following situations, for example:
The engine has not yet reached the minimum temperature required for start/stop mode.
The interior temperature selected on the air conditioner has not yet been reached.
The exterior temperature is very high/low.
The windscreen is being defrosted.
The park assist* is switched on.
The battery charge is too low.
The steering wheel is close to full lock or the vehicle is being steered.
Reverse gear has just been selected.
The vehicle is on a steep gradient.
At high altitudes.

[djapeA4]

From the Owner's Manual, here are some of the conditions where the engine does not switch off even though Auto Start/Stop is enabled. Do any of these conditions apply to you? - for the interior temperature check the temp setting in the rear seat area as well.

Engine does not switch off
The system checks that certain conditions are met before and during each stop phase. The engine will not switch off in the following situations, for example:
The engine has not yet reached the minimum temperature required for start/stop mode.
The interior temperature selected on the air conditioner has not yet been reached.
The exterior temperature is very high/low.
The windscreen is being defrosted.
The park assist* is switched on.
The battery charge is too low.
The steering wheel is close to full lock or the vehicle is being steered.
Reverse gear has just been selected.
The vehicle is on a steep gradient.
At high altitudes.

I've taken into consideration all of the above. For example, I would have expected it to go off when engine has already reached it's operating temp and it feels nice and toasty inside. I've purposely set the 3-zone climate to be 20'C so not too high and easily reached, and have also tried turning the climate off completely so that the system doesn't have to work for that parameter at all. All other obvious requirements have been satisfied, like not turning the wheel, stopping on flat surface, not on high altitude and even confirmed with Audi employee that messing with MMI options like drive assist or different modes would not cancel the stop/start. The only exception is "Sport" which is available in all modes. And I'm driving in Individual but in D, not S. And like I said before, I have also tried Auto and Comfort just to see if my Individual setup is causing it. It isn't.

So right now I think 2 possibilities remain:

1. The alternator isn't fully charging the battery, the voltage is low etc - but I can't tell because the are no warning lights on the dash, or
2. The outside temperature that turns the system off is below 0'C (although the Audi guy thought it's more like -20'C). it is very possible when I picked up the car and for the first few days of driving the outside temp was hovering around and just above zero degrees Celsius. I will find out if this is true on Monday, it will be +5'C.

If that fails, then it's a trip to the stealership and bend over to find out.

[djapeA4]

Ok, so the outside temp below 0'C is causing the system to cancel stop/start. It came back on today, it was +5. This essentially means it will be cancelled for at least 3 months every year here in cold Canada lol. Not complaining though, very happy it works.

[SJorge3442]

Ok, so the outside temp below 0'C is causing the system to cancel stop/start. It came back on today, it was +5. This essentially means it will be cancelled for at least 3 months every year here in cold Canada lol. Not complaining though, very happy it works.

Most on this forum hate the start/stop function. It's such an annoying feature, especially for anyone with a manual transmission (at least IMO). It's very odd to be rolling up to a red light and have the engine cut off when you're in neutral and not full stopped yet. Not to mention the wear and tear on the starter/battery/alternator.

[Sibmets]

Ok, so the outside temp below 0'C is causing the system to cancel stop/start. It came back on today, it was +5. This essentially means it will be cancelled for at least 3 months every year here in cold Canada lol. Not complaining though, very happy it works.

If battery is fully charged and engine is warmed up, Start-stop system is working for me even in temperatures below freezing here in Northern Europe

Audi A4 B9 3.0 TDi quattro 200 kw

[djapeA4]

If battery is fully charged and engine is warmed up, Start-stop system is working for me even in temperatures below freezing here in Northern Europe

Audi A4 B9 3.0 TDi quattro 200 kw

Who knows, maybe I need a new battery (or alternator - but I would expect CEL to light up for that). It's now not coming on even in +11'C weather. Engine warmed up and all.

[djapeA4]

Most on this forum hate the start/stop function. It's such an annoying feature, especially for anyone with a manual transmission (at least IMO). It's very odd to be rolling up to a red light and have the engine cut off when you're in neutral and not full stopped yet. Not to mention the wear and tear on the starter/battery/alternator.

You are right, I don't want it for my self - I'm in dynamic/individual all the time I only wish AR was manual. It's for my other half she doesn't care and the difference in gas is substantial these days.

[Mythdoc]

The Audi shift paddles and DSG are a de facto manual transmission system. The only thing you can’t do that you might do on an old style MT is go directly from 2nd to 4th or 3rd to 5th. That is a loss, of course.

From the maintenance standpoint the DSG can be finicky and expensive to repair if it goes wrong which is not that often.

The rest is just nostalgia from folks who want to row the shifter through the gears and drop the clutch. I’m not a guy prone to nostalgia, myself. I had an Integra GSR back in the day, a ton of fun with the MT, I don’t pine for my lost youth.

I use the paddles quite a bit. It’s a great system with the added benefit that when in manual mode auto start-stop stays off.