Audi A4 2.0T or the BMW 335i Coupe

[addicted2boost]

Just as the title says...

I really like the s line a4 but dont know if it can be up there with the 335i coupes power figures... :(

[bhvrdr]

Not in the same league. 335i is an S4 killer and likely when it is chipped and RS4 killer :(

cheers! Mike

[kannon]

its going to take a while for mods to come out for the new bmw engine so if ur into modding alot and arent very patient then the audi would be better, but the bimmer has a bigger engine and more turbos so it will probably have more power in the end

[Korrect414]

They are two different machines. I love the fact that BMW has integrated turbos into their line up, but I just cant get over how dang ugly the new "Bangle-ized" Bimmers look.
I prefer the looks of the Audi, not to mention the Quattro.

[Borti]

Here are some quick numbers:
1) 70 whp gained at 7,000 rpms

2) 45 wtq gained at 7,000 rpms

3) These numbers were created by increasing boost from 5 PSI to 6PSI at 7,000 rpms and running a richer than stock A/F ratio.



220 wtq at redline is unbelievable without an exhaust or aftermarket FMIC.

The individual who did this tuning said this car is capable of much more, and this is just the tip of the iceburg as he did not have full control over the ECU's functions.

By the way, the A/F ratio is messed up because of the instruments taking false readings, not because the car is running lean or anything.

So yes, it is in a different league than the 2.0T for sure.

I still think the 2.0T is an amazing engine though. I truly love it.

[tachril]

soon, all car will be kinda bangle-ized... so suck it up and like it.

I like changes and will say it is an interesting design .. but the interior is ugly :)

[Sharpointer]

There is software out for the 335 actually. The place i got my car chipped told me he's had the software for a little while. He told me they imported it to the States knowing the car would be comming out soon. Soooo that car is gonna be insane pretty soon with the mods people will do to it in the near future.

['07 S-Line Ti]

Originally posted by bhvrdr
Not in the same league. 335i is an S4 killer and likely when it is chipped and RS4 killer :(

cheers! Mike

rs4 killer? thats a stretch

[Imperial]

the 335i coupe and the A4 2.0T are definitely in different leagues. Even a quick glance at the price ranges will tell you that. It's not a fair comparison.

[CaRJoE0220]

Programming is now out for the 335i which puts it at 375hp so i dont know the numbers of the rs4 but if a 335i could take a s4 stock an extra 75hp is pretty strong argument. I would compare gas mileage. There is nothing like a strong V8 but you will get bad mpg while the 335i claims like 29mpg hwy? which is darn good. I am really into the new 335i. Also 4-door/2-door which is more practical in your life? and last i suggest go and drive them bost and see which tickles your fancy haha.

[Korrect414]

Originally posted by tachril
soon, all car will be kinda bangle-ized... so suck it up and like it.

I like changes and will say it is an interesting design .. but the interior is ugly :)

When the 335XI comes out I will most likely be getting one. I think the exterior will be more tolerable with a nice drop and some rims.

Im still on love with the E46 M3 though

[bhvrdr]

Originally posted by '07 S-Line Ti
rs4 killer? thats a stretch

I wish it was. I drive an Audi. But it is already doing sub 5 second 0-60 times and chipping should have no problem dropping a second off just like it does for us. Actually they will likely benefit more from chipping with twin turbos. Now consider the car is probably 500lbs lighter and can do at least 360/400 with just a chip and you have an RS4 killer. I could be wrong but mark my words here it will be into the 12s.

cheers! Mike

[audisarecool]

all this from a 335, imagine the new M3 chipped... yikes!

[Borti]

Originally posted by audisarecool
all this from a 335, imagine the new M3 chipped... yikes!

Keep in mind the vast majority of the 335i's gains come from having two turbo's. The new M3 will be a monster for sure. But the gains from a NA V8 will be nothing compared to the gains seen on the 335.

[audisarecool]

yea, ure right, but one thing we have to keep in mind is comparing a chipped car to a stock car is an unfair comparison.

you cant go comparing a chipped/modded 335 to an rs4, compare a chipped/modded 335i to a chipped/modded RS4... naaa mean

[phillyquattro]

I went to a BMW dealership last week with my friend. His 325 was having some work done so I gave him a ride to pick it up. They had a few 335s on the lot and I have to say they are even uglier than the 3 series sedan. Not to mention that the interior is garbage. The car might have a great engine, but there is no way I could drive an ugly car just cause its pushing 300 horses and has a twin turbo. Plus I wouldn't want to give up quattro.

A heavily modded 335 might be an "RS4 Killer" one day, but it'll still be f#@ckin ugly every other day.

[Imperial]

I'm with bhvrdr - the 335i is a promising car indeed. I really think that car should put everyone on notice.

[A4TwoZeroT]

M3 sales are gonna go down..
if i got the cash.. i would get the 335..

[trifeoc]

F@&K the new BMW's, they all have problems w/o modding. My wifey has one and it's been in the shop too many times to count, it's not the coupe, but still, same setup.

[A4_cabrio]

check this out. the 335i is a beast.

i think the advertised hp and tq numbers are way underestimated.

http://www.automobilemag.com/multime...bmw_335i_dyno/

[4-tified]

Originally posted by Borti
Here are some quick numbers:
1) 70 whp gained at 7,000 rpms

2) 45 wtq gained at 7,000 rpms

3) These numbers were created by increasing boost from 5 PSI to 6PSI at 7,000 rpms and running a richer than stock A/F ratio.



220 wtq at redline is unbelievable without an exhaust or aftermarket FMIC.

The individual who did this tuning said this car is capable of much more, and this is just the tip of the iceburg as he did not have full control over the ECU's functions.

By the way, the A/F ratio is messed up because of the instruments taking false readings, not because the car is running lean or anything.

So yes, it is in a different league than the 2.0T for sure.

I still think the 2.0T is an amazing engine though. I truly love it.

I don't see the 70hp.
Also, the turbo's used are quite small and any boost increase will be modest at best.
The 3.0 is designed to be more NA engine with little boost assist rather than the 2.0T which uses turbo for most of it's power generation.
That's why the BMW 3.0T has no perceptible "lag".

That engine may "have more in it", but so do many other engines. However, I doubt there is a lot more to be had with those modest turbo's.
Still, 300hp/300lb ft. stock is plenty.

Also, the 2.0 and 3.0 are a different league in terms of MPG as well. I'll guess an agressive driver in that 3.0 turbo will be seeing 15-18mpg. OUCH.

[Borti]

Originally posted by 4-tified
I don't see the 70hp.
Also, the turbo's used are quite small and any boost increase will be modest at best.
The 3.0 is designed to be more NA engine with little boost assist rather than the 2.0T which uses turbo for most of it's power generation.
That's why the BMW 3.0T has no perceptible "lag".

That engine may "have more in it", but so do many other engines. However, I doubt there is a lot more to be had with those modest turbo's.
Still, 300hp/300lb ft. stock is plenty.

Also, the 2.0 and 3.0 are a different league in terms of MPG as well. I'll guess an agressive driver in that 3.0 turbo will be seeing 15-18mpg. OUCH.

You did not see the 70 hp because you only looked at the peak numbers.

LOOK at 7,000 rpms. The car, stock is putting out about 220-230 whp at 7,000 rpms. With the flash, it is putting out just under 290 whp at 7 grand. Sorry, so 60-70 whp instead of 70. I do not think that was what you were getting at though.

Also keep in mind that these gains were seen by raising the boost across the midrange by just under 2 PSI and 1 PSI gain towards redline with richer than stock A/F ratio's. These turbo's are small, but that does not mean they cannot run more boost efficiently (do you honestly think BMW maxed these turbo's from the factory). Stock, these turbo's are putting out peak boost of 9 PSI tapering to 5 at redline. Though they are small, they certainly have more in them, even if it is a small amount (but look what a tiny amount has done so far).

This car was originally designed as an NA inline six. This engine, however, is quite different than the outgoing NA inline six found in the 330. It has everything it needs to handle turbo-charging except a lower compression ratio typically found in turbo-charged motors. However... BMW did not just slap turbo's on on NA motor and use the same headgasket and hope the turbo's could handle the high compression ratio. No, this engine is a direct-injection engine. This is why it is high compression.

Also, the reason this car experiences very little lag has to do with high-compression and small turbo's. Not because they kept the same compression ratio as the NA inline six. Come on man, BMW is a little smarter than that.

I will say that the engine does use cast pistons, which tends to be the trend with turbo-charged motors lately. It is based off of the outgoing inline six, but it is not the same motor. Time will tell if this engine is capable of maintaining large amounts of power, but there is no question that it will have no problem producing large amounts of power.

[astris]

Originally posted by 4-tified


Also, the 2.0 and 3.0 are a different league in terms of MPG as well. I'll guess an agressive driver in that 3.0 turbo will be seeing 15-18mpg. OUCH.

Nope. The 335 has BMW's version of direct injection. So, like the Audi FSI cars, it will get quite good MPG. They claim nearly 30 mpg on the freeway. Hell, I get around 26-28 mpg in my M3 on the freeway and average nearly 20 mpg overall. Right now I'm getting less than 20 because the car is new to me and I can't keep my foot off the gas.

Both are great cars no doubt, but as for performance, the 335 is going to be in another league. The next B5 S4 basically.

[CaRJoE0220]

Originally posted by phillyquattro

A heavily modded 335 might be an "RS4 Killer" one day, but it'll still be f#@ckin ugly every other day.

Not heavily modified. a flash which is $1200 and can be done in less then an hour puts it at 375 which i believe could take the RS4 but i dont know i dont know much about the rs4 besides its beautiful. I would love to take a ride/drive a flashed 335i.

[Imperial]

Originally posted by astris
Both are great cars no doubt, but as for performance, the 335 is going to be in another league. The next B5 S4 basically.

Good analogy

[John1.8T]

the new 335i is definitely impressive... BMW is obviously still all about the numbers... they are an extremely reputable company but I hope they didn't skimp on anything else....

The whole Audi v.s. BMW battle has been going on for YEARS. Sure its nice to see such high performance cars coming out for us car enthusiasts but Audi is starting to back down on the numbers race.

Take the S6 Avant and M5 for example. The S6 AVANT can keep up and hold its own against an M5 with "lower" numbers and they can still keep up. Audi/VW is starting to focus more on the overall aesthetics v.s. raw horsepower. Personally I would take an S6 Avant over an M5 any day - and thats not because I'm bias to Audi - its because the conventional use of an Avant with a V10 that can still smoke just about any car on the road is amazing. Another good example is the VW R32 and the BMW 1 series... no competition... the R32 is AWD, faster, handles better, and is MUCH more conventional than the 1 series as far as interior space. Plus its considerably less expensive.

I'm very curious to see/drive the new 335i. It sounds extremely impressive and they are going to be FAST.

I'm also curious to see what happens to the M3. There is almost no reason to buy one over a 335i. This is very comparable to the thread we had a couple months ago regarding a faster A4 and 2.0T... it would eventually start nipping at the heels of the S4... which would need to be souped up to justify keeping it on the line up... and chances are that would start getting into RS4 territory. This is exactly what is happening with BMW. I'm all for a fast 335i but its going to kill the M3 and M5 sales and personally I find that extremely dissapointing. the M3 has been around for a long time.

[Imperial]

couple things, though - the 335i is the E90/92. The current M3 is still the E46, which premiered in, what, 2000? It's a dated model with respect to the 335i, so a more apt comparision would wait for the arrival of the E92 M3 (if they call it that). The same argument kinda goes for the A4 2.0T vs the 335i. The B7 is mostly just a cosmetic upgrade of the B6, which debuted in 2002. Yes they got the new 2.0T and 3.2 FSI motors, but I think that a better comparison would probably involve the B8 and the E90/92.


I do also agree that there's much more to a car, even a quick one, than JUST the horsepower you put down. That being said, however, I'm afraid I'm not too sure if Audi can dethrone BMW so far as driving characteristics. It'll be a great race, but I just don't know if BMW can be beat (in this case at least...we're not talking M6 vs 997 or anything cuz that's a different story)

[bhvrdr]

Originally posted by 4-tified
I don't see the 70hp.
Also, the turbo's used are quite small and any boost increase will be modest at best.
The 3.0 is designed to be more NA engine with little boost assist rather than the 2.0T which uses turbo for most of it's power generation.
That's why the BMW 3.0T has no perceptible "lag".

That engine may "have more in it", but so do many other engines. However, I doubt there is a lot more to be had with those modest turbo's.
Still, 300hp/300lb ft. stock is plenty.

Also, the 2.0 and 3.0 are a different league in terms of MPG as well. I'll guess an agressive driver in that 3.0 turbo will be seeing 15-18mpg. OUCH.

This doesnt seem to be the case. Actually we are the ones running the turbos at higher boost pressures already on the 2.0T FSI (12psi) in stock form so it is likely the BMW will benefit at least as much from chipping. Not to mention it has 2 turbos. The K03 is an absolutely tiny turbo, the reason Audi claims there is almost no lag with this A4 and peak torque is reached at something rediculous like 1900rpm or some such. Our B5 S4 similarly had two tiny turbos on it like the 335i does. The 335i starts out with an even larger motor with more advanced technology. Chipped S4s with their tiny little K03 turbos on them were going from 250hp/250tq to 320hp/380tq or gains of 70hp and 130tq just by chipping! Imagine what the 335i will do. Lets just be extremely conservative and say the tuners decide to be very restraining for warranty reasons and give it a 70hp and 130tq boost. You have a 370hp/430tq (more likely about 390hp and 450tq as the car seems to be underrated) car that weights only 3500lbs. You'll need steam rollers on the back of that car. Keep in mind the S4 easily dropped well over a second off the 1/4 mile due to chipping only. If that happens with the 335i than it is a 12 second car...and not just a little into the 12s. Those are my predictions.

cheers! Mike

[Tommy@Nemesis]

I hate these Audi/ BMW comparison threads. 3 pages coming up.....

[Andrew A4]

Originally posted by bhvrdr
Not in the same league. 335i is an S4 killer and likely when it is chipped and RS4 killer :(

cheers! Mike

You're correct about the 2.0 not being in the same league as the 335i. The price is over 10k difference.

The S4 is more of a comparable car to the 335i and I'll wager that the S4 will be better track suited with minimal mods.

Not in the same league. 335i is an S4 killer and likely when it is chipped and RS4 killer :(

cheers! Mike

You guys really don't understand the purposes of the turbos on the 335i. These turbos will not get massive gains like the 20T will.

Also, whoever said that the chipped 335i will smoke an RS4 need to return to reality.

I've driven a 335i, S4, and RS4. The S4 is a far superior vehicle than the 335i in my opinion and even the current RS4 a better drivers car in every aspect I considered when I drove an E92 M3 a week ago.

The bimmer guys are dreaming. End of thread.

[Borti]

Originally posted by Andrew A4
You're correct about the 2.0 not being in the same league as the 335i. The price is over 10k difference.

The S4 is more of a comparable car to the 335i and I'll wager that the S4 will be better track suited with minimal mods.



You guys really don't understand the purposes of the turbos on the 335i. These turbos will not get massive gains like the 20T will.

Also, whoever said that the chipped 335i will smoke an RS4 need to return to reality.

I've driven a 335i, S4, and RS4. The S4 is a far superior vehicle than the 335i in my opinion and even the current RS4 a better drivers car in every aspect I considered when I drove an E92 M3 a week ago.

The bimmer guys are dreaming. End of thread.

Did you ignore the dyno I posted in the begining of this thread? How can you say this car is not capable of any gains when evidence to the contrary is right in front of you? These turbo's are already showing huge gains from a tuner who still does not have full control over the car.

Here is what Shiv from Vishnu (the actual tuner) had to say in regards to his first attempt at tuning the car

Hi guys,
It's been 5 days since we got our car. Fortunately, most of us here are a bit obsessive when it comes to digging into perfectly fine, brand new cars and seeing if we can come up with any newfound power. We're not anywhere close to being done. I still want to get control of the closed loop fuel targets, directly control the boost contol solenoids as well as interface with the vanos system. That's at least a few weeks out. So far, all we did was minor ignition timing, fuel and boost pattern tweaks. Even on our 91oct, I suspect there is still a good deal more power that can be safely extracted once we have finished this project. Once again, these results are just our first attempt at tuning this car. It does not represent a complete tune. It's just one step at a time.

The gains were greatest at higher engine speeds. At 7000rpm, we picked up nearly 70whp with richer-than-stock A/F ratio. Peak WHP increased from 278 to 310whp at 6000rpm. Torque from 288lb-ft to 311lb-ft. I stayed nice and conservative at low to mid engine speeds (where, quite frankly, we should see the biggest gains when all is said and done). This was because I don't yet have control of the AFR targets in this region. The stock fuel mapping is too lean to run either the extra boost the turbos most certainly are capable of supporting, or optimal spark advance. Once we get control of the fuel in this region, we can start to turn up the wick and really get the sick midrange torque than the hardware is capable of supporting. For now, all we really wanted to do is make the car charge to redline instead of fall flat above 6000rpm. We did a little more than that but that was just an unexpected bonus.

To claim that these turbo's will not get massive gains is in direct defiance of a professional who actually has experience with this car.

Furthermore, the 2.0T is not some tuning mecca. It does respond very well to modification, but is no means acclaimed for its power when it comes to other turbo-charged vehicles (EVO, STi, SRT-4).

The 335 has already seen the great gains you claimed were impossible.

[boostedsline]

A4 2.0T vs. BMW 335i in the snow = you do the math = 414 whp, chipped BMW 335i = 375 I think we know who would win that one!

[bhvrdr]

Originally posted by Andrew A4
You're correct about the 2.0 not being in the same league as the 335i. The price is over 10k difference.

The S4 is more of a comparable car to the 335i and I'll wager that the S4 will be better track suited with minimal mods.



You guys really don't understand the purposes of the turbos on the 335i. These turbos will not get massive gains like the 20T will.

Also, whoever said that the chipped 335i will smoke an RS4 need to return to reality.

I've driven a 335i, S4, and RS4. The S4 is a far superior vehicle than the 335i in my opinion and even the current RS4 a better drivers car in every aspect I considered when I drove an E92 M3 a week ago.

The bimmer guys are dreaming. End of thread.

Not sure why the turbos on the 335i would not genterate gains like the 2.0T FSI? We use a TINY k03 turbo that is already spinning at a very high 12psi just in stock form (the 335i turbos are only spinning at 6psi-9psi in stock form IIRC). The 335i is already putting down lower acceleration times in stock form than the B6/B7 S4. And it's price is quite a bit cheaper. More comparable to the A4 3.2 FSI. As for track use, the car weighs in at 3500lbs versus 3850lbs for the B6/B7 S4. It also has a near 50/50 weight distrubution with the S4 having a terrible 60/40 distribution. The S4 has quattro which is the only thing that saves it a bit but trust me I am doing everthing I can to make my S4 track worthy and it's not in stock form.

Again, the B5 S4 uses similarly TINY k03 turbos and makes massive gains when chipped knocking well over a second of it's 1/4 mile time. The 335i is doing mid 13s stock. With a chip mid 12s is definitely predictable. Stating that the 335i wont make gains that the 2.0t FSI does is odd to me. It should make much more gains than the 2.0TFSI does. It uses small turbos just like our car but those turbos have even more headroom than ours (they are being worked less in stock form than ours) and there is two of them instead of one with much more displacement.

As for it becoming an RS4 killer, look at the stats, the RS4 is putting down about 350whp and 280wtq on an independent dyno. The 335i is putting down 310whp/310wtq with only increasing boost 1 single psi (we increase boost about 8 psi on our little tiny turbos). Figure them making 340whp/360wtq should be no problem with a proper chip which would easily outpower an RS4...oh, and weigh 500lbs less than one which can help.

cheers! Mike

[audib7a4]

thought the RS4 is $65k+
the 335i only starts @ $42k....

they have a good lease offer...dammm...already...

[xtort44]

The 335i is a sweet Bimmer indeed... Though I'd still take the e46 m3 over the 335i anyday... There is more to an M car than just the motor...

[SteveMondragon]

I'm a few days late as I don't check these boards as much lately, but here's what I wrote up a couple of weeks ago:

----------------------------------------------------------------

Now I'm sure there have been lots of 335i vs. A4 comparason posts but I figure I will post this info up since I was able to drive my A4 2.0T and the 335i TT back to back tonight. Sorry for the long post but here's my thoughts on it.

Funny thing, the car I drove was the same color as my A4 (Quartz Gray and the Space Gray Metallic look very similar when side-by-side). The body lines are ok, but kind of weird looking with its weird curve on the doors & rear quarter panel. There is basically no fender flare in the rear, although there is room underneath for a 10" wide wheel (which may look weird since there's no flare), and the fender gap is huge in the front with no gap in the back (just like the 3-series sedans). Ok, interior-wise it felt nice but I could not get the steering wheel into a good position to where I have mine in my A4, as if I couldn't get it close enough to me. Also the steering wheel is like a 330mm size and the A4 is a 350mm size so it reminded me of driving a Honda with a MOMO steering wheel in it . The seat felt fine, but I didn't like how my arms/elbows felt when they rested on the center console and the door padding. Well, it didn't feel as comfortable as in my A4. I think the A4 'hugs' you more and you feel like you're in a cockpit with controls easier to reach. Still, the 335i interior was nice and roomy up front so I really didn't have much complaints about that. I didn't bother to try the paddle shifters (more like thumb push-button buttons on a stick) since it wouldn't feel the same as in my S-Line with my real paddle shifters. Trunk space was huge, about the same amount as the A4, maybe slightly bigger. There is no spare tire (the car has run-flats) so there is a small dinky comparment under the floor that is worthless. However, the rear seats do fold down so compared to the A4, trunk space is about the same.

I test drove the car at night so I could see how the adaptive bi-xenon headlights looked on the road compared to my adaptive bi-xenon headlights. Not really any difference there but I think the A4 beam pattern shoots out a little further out in front of the car. Since my car is an auto, I decided to test drive the auto and to see if there was any turbo lag. In the A4, when you're a complete stop (stop light for example), you give it gas when the light turns green, you see the tach needle shoot up to around 2500-3000 rpms, and you wait maybe .5 to 1 second until the car starts to move. I notice this lag all the time and it is annoying but I've gotten used to it. In the 335i..... SAMETHING. Only difference is that the power is much more noticable once the car is moving, and the turbos spool up fast and the car starts to fly down the road. This is only a 1/4 throttle in both cars. When I put either car in the "S" sport mode, both pick up nice but the 335i is so much quicker with much more noticable torque. After driving the 335i, and then jumping back into my car, the A4 seriously felt slow and even when I put it into the 'S' sport mode, the A4 still felt slow compared to the 335i I was just in. I'm not saying I hated it, but it was pretty noticable.

As for handling, my A4 is lowered on Eibach Sportline springs with Koni adjustable shocks. Very firm/smooth ride (better than stock IMO) and the car handles well. The 335i was very tight when you took turns but over bumps, the shocks absorbed them very well, maybe better than my A4. But when I had pulled back into the parking lot, driving at a low speed (5 mph), I drove over a drain cover and the vibration was huge in the 335i, much more so than in the A4 (I ran over the same cover when I left to feel the difference). The 335i felt like it was riding on a rail and if you give it too much gas, especially on a rainy day on a non-LSD car, I can see the rear end coming loose very easily with an unexperience driver. It basically reminded me of driving a turbo MR2 with a turbo upgrade. My A4 felt more neutral. Granted it's not setup to track or anything, but I just liked the feel of my A4 more than the 335i, feeling like I had better control of the car on high speed turns.

One thing I didn't like at all (besides the lag I mentioned above) was how fast the turbos spool up, especially in the "S" sport mode in the 335i. I can see this as being a problem on a surface with little traction. Basically I left from a complete stop, testing the lag issue, and giving it around 1/4 to 1/2 throttle to see how well it picked up compared to my A4 in the Sport mode. The damn turbos spool up too fast that you can easily break traction after 4000 rpms and for an unexperienced drive, I can see them getting into trouble there. Sure the 335i turbos spool up quick and you have good power (passing on the freeway in Sport mode, compared to passing on the freeway in Sport mode in my A4... much better pickup speeds in the 335i), but at low speeds and a heavy foot, you're asking for trouble.

Now, in conclusion, would I buy the 335i over the A4? Maybe, but not likely. I like my A4, I like how it looks, but if I was going to spend over $45k on a loaded car, it better 'wow' me more than the 3-series coupe does. Also, I consider the 3-series (like the C-class Mercedes) as being a "low class" car for that car manufacturer. Sure the A4 might be considered the same but to me personally, I don't really see the A4 as in the lower class since they are not flooded out on the roads like the C-class and 3-series cars are (which I can see at least either one at any given intersection in So Cal). Also, I'm sure in the next few months, or by the new year, there will be tons of them on the road here in So Cal, most of which will probably be driven by yuppies who only own it just because it's the latest fad (new coupe & BMW name recognition). Just as I got to the dealership, some high school girl's parents were buying her the new 335i auto, and she sounded so snooty about driving it. Seriously made me want to strangle her but that's neither here nor there . Still, the B7 A4 will still be a more unique car to see on the roads than a 3-series BMW so I'm happy with that. I will say this, if the new M3 does come out by the time my lease is up next September, I might be tempted to get that but only time will tell.

[Toast]

looks like the only thing limiting the 335 potential is the ability to switch out the turbos due to lack of space and that the car is fugly

['07 S-Line Ti]

its still not as bengel as the others.. like that stupid looking E90

[HeHateMe]

Originally posted by phillyquattro
I went to a BMW dealership last week with my friend. His 325 was having some work done so I gave him a ride to pick it up. They had a few 335s on the lot and I have to say they are even uglier than the 3 series sedan. Not to mention that the interior is garbage. The car might have a great engine, but there is no way I could drive an ugly car just cause its pushing 300 horses and has a twin turbo. Plus I wouldn't want to give up quattro.

A heavily modded 335 might be an "RS4 Killer" one day, but it'll still be f#@ckin ugly every other day.

HAHA

You guys should get off BMW's nutz, go buy a 335i and take your asses to the Bimmer forums. Or hang around the Audi forums while owning a BMW and talk shit on Audis ( which I don't really understand BTW).

[Andrew A4]

Originally posted by Borti
Did you ignore the dyno I posted in the begining of this thread? How can you say this car is not capable of any gains when evidence to the contrary is right in front of you? These turbo's are already showing huge gains from a tuner who still does not have full control over the car.

Here is what Shiv from Vishnu (the actual tuner) had to say in regards to his first attempt at tuning the car






To claim that these turbo's will not get massive gains is in direct defiance of a professional who actually has experience with this car.

Furthermore, the 2.0T is not some tuning mecca. It does respond very well to modification, but is no means acclaimed for its power when it comes to other turbo-charged vehicles (EVO, STi, SRT-4).

The 335 has already seen the great gains you claimed were impossible.

Flame all you want my friend. I've been getting all my information directly from the top tuners in Germany who have had this car for much longer than we've had it here.

Eventually these guys here will get pretty solid gains. Especially when they get the the variable geometry turbos and the control modules where they need to be.

All i can say is i'm not spending any $60+k loaded on a 3 series that doesn't have an M on it.