PCV Correct Part # and ECM Update?

[LowKeyLoki]

Can anyone tell me what the difference in part numbers for the PCV are and whether or not they require an ECM update? I've scoured the threads to no avail for a solid answer.
Currently replacing PCV on my 2011 DSG. Did carbon clean,WP, TSAT, crank pulley, belts and valve covers. Finished put everything back together and started fine but is hunting for idle badly.
P/N for what I had on my car was 06E103547F, ECS Tuning sold me the part ending in AC. I see on audiusa that they have AH version fitting my car as well. Any input on if either need the ECM update?
Would really like to not have to have it towed to the dealer just for a ECM flash...

[Mscar1205]

I think I remember fcp euro having a YouTube video going over 3.0t pcv issues... The difference in part numbers were for the facelift 2013+ models. They do require a flash if u get the wrong one and I think it's an aftermarket tune, Audi probably wouldn't even do it.

They touch on item numbers at about 40 seconds in the vid↓

https://blog.fcpeuro.com/how-to-repl...a7?hs_amp=true

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[Smac770]

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...1#post14708429

F and AC are both 30 mbar versions. AH would be a 150 mbar version.

[LowKeyLoki]

Thanks guys, I appreciate both yall's input, decided to keep the new AC version PVC in. I tore everything down and double checked PVC gasket and torque and intake runner flaps, vac lines, electrical connectors etc. Vacuum filled cooling system, passed at -24inHg. Seems to be issue with throttle body, getting at Throttle Valve Malfunction on J338. Connections look good and click tight, but idle is still hunting bad. I suspect one of the wires or pins got pulled or damaged. I plan to take test throttle body actuator in VCDS and check voltage to terminals going to TB. Any advice or input on resolving TB issues like this would be appreciated.

[jessenepywoda]

Does an 06E103547AC + 8K0907551D (revision 003) software on a 2012 S4 work?

Reading the TSB, it seems like I may have the new software, which would call for the 06E103547H.

Address 01: Engine (J623-CCBA) Labels:. 06E-907-551-CAK.clb
Part No SW: 8K0 907 551 D HW: 8K0 907 551 A
Component: 3.0T SIMOS84 H08 0003
Revision: --H08--- CVN: BC966676
Coding: 0104000A240F0128
Shop #: WSC 06324 000 00000
ASAM Dataset: EV_ECM30TFS0218K0907551D 001003
ROD: EV_ECM30TFS0218K0907551D.rod
VCID: 3228E5C06544F81F04-8066

[Smac770]

Yes, TSB (https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...81642-0699.pdf) seems clear that CCBA 0003 (8K0 907 551 D) goes with the 150 mbar PCV, which would be AH (original H was superseded long ago).

[jessenepywoda]

Yes, TSB (https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...81642-0699.pdf) seems clear that CCBA 0003 (8K0 907 551 D) goes with the 150 mbar PCV, which would be AH (original H was superseded long ago).

Nice job with the 246k miles - I have a 2010 A4 with 225k. Went through so many PCV's on that car I had to put helicoils into the bolt holes.

[JRYtheS4]

Yes, TSB (https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...81642-0699.pdf) seems clear that CCBA 0003 (8K0 907 551 D) goes with the 150 mbar PCV, which would be AH (original H was superseded long ago).

One thing I want to add: the continued help and accurate information you're contributing to this forum isn't going unappreciated.

This thread saved me putting in the old 30mbar PCV into my car that has had continuous oil consumption issues since I originally did it 2 years ago. I just returned the AC and got an AH to hopefully resolve my issues. 2 years ago I misunderstood the TSB and got confused on all the part numbers.

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[Smac770]

Nice job with the 246k miles - I have a 2010 A4 with 225k. Went through so many PCV's on that car I had to put helicoils into the bolt holes.

Yeah, got helicoils in two of the holes currently, bolts 1 and 2 by the tightening sequence.

[cremley]

Have you done the install with the AH yet? I bought the AC part number for my 2010 A6 C6 3.0T and am wondering if I should return it for the AH?

- - - Updated - - -

One thing I want to add: the continued help and accurate information you're contributing to this forum isn't going unappreciated.

This thread saved me putting in the old 30mbar PCV into my car that has had continuous oil consumption issues since I originally did it 2 years ago. I just returned the AC and got an AH to hopefully resolve my issues. 2 years ago I misunderstood the TSB and got confused on all the part numbers.

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Have you done the install with the AH yet? I bought the AC part number for my 2010 A6 C6 3.0T and am wondering if I should return it for the AH?

[JRYtheS4]

Have you done the install with the AH yet? I bought the AC part number for my 2010 A6 C6 3.0T and am wondering if I should return it for the AH?

- - - Updated - - -



Have you done the install with the AH yet? I bought the AC part number for my 2010 A6 C6 3.0T and am wondering if I should return it for the AH?

I have not. Won't be for a bit as I am going to be doing the chain tensioners.

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[Redbeard1979]

I'm about to pull the trigger on a new PCV as well. 2013 B8.5 S4 DSG.

FCP Euro is telling me I need to by the AH version and have the dealership reprogram... Is this a real thing? I've seen so many people online replace PCV's and haven't once heard anyone having a major issue needing to have a dealership reprogram.... Also, I'm Stage 1 "034" and have heard some people say if you're tuned, it doesn't need to be taken to a dealership. Please someone that knows what's up chime in.

[Jroyalty7]

So back when I did this for my 2013 b8.5 my original part# ended with an H but the updated pcv part# ended with an S and since upgrading to 034 tune from EPL I’ve had a soft code for PCV regulator valve control, never had it before. Anyone have any insight on this? I’ve searched for a while but came up with nothing definitive.

19182 - PCV Regulator Valve Control
P05D8 00 [047] - Open Circuit
Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
Freeze Frame:
Fault Status: 00000001
Fault Priority: 2
Fault Frequency: 1
Mileage: 112972 km
Date: 2022.06.25
Time: 14:12:05

Engine RPM: 699.00 /min
Normed load value: 13.7 %
Vehicle speed: 0 km/h
Coolant temperature: 84 °C
Intake air temperature: 50 °C
Ambient air pressure: 1010 mbar
Voltage terminal 30: 12.593 V
Unlearning counter according OBD: 40
Engine speed: actual: 1312 /min
MAF_ENVD: 250.56470 mg/stroke
Coolant temperature (unfiltered): 37.50 °C
Engine: operating status: IS
Engine load: 13.671875 %
Vehicle speed: actual: 0 km/h


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[Smac770]

Having the low vacuum version of the PCV or high vacuum version of the PCV isn't relevant to that DTC, since none of that is electrical in any way.

The positive crankcase vent purpose is simply a exit path (vent) from the crankcase to the intake system so crankcase pressure during load could not build up. To minimize oil loss to this, the path has coarse oil separators in the cylinder head covers and the fine oil separator sitting under the supercharger. To improve ring seal, and reduce oil loss at the rings, the intake manifold vacuum is exposed to this pathway, limited by the pressure regulator valve (the diaphragm balanced between ambient pressure and a spring). To further improve crankcase vapor scavenging, to clear water vapor and blow-by products from the crankcase rather than allow them to settle into the oil, a fresh air entry path (breather) from the post-air filter intake path to the crankcase is present. IM vacuum pulls the "polluted" crankcase gas contents out, replaced by the fresh air.

This is all a fully passive process. No electronics involved. For the EA837 evo (the CRE engine), one of the objectives was improved idle. You have to understand this whole fresh air breather > crankcase > oil separator > supercharger path bypasses the normal throttle plate air volume management. This is why the ECM has to understand the vacuum level, as that will impact the level of uncontrollable air ingestion. Fresh air source also means more "oily, hydrocarbon" crankcase content can be displaced. If the O2 system is seeing high hydrocarbon during idle, the ECM can activate the N548 crankcase vent breather shut-off valve. This can meter the volume of fresh air permitted into the crankcase, assisting idle. Or at least that's what the SSP goes on about.

So I'd have to assume this PCV related electrical circuit error is meaning the N548.

CGW (EU) / CGX (US) is simply the update of the EA837 3.0T to support electromechanical power steering and automatic stop/start, introduced at C7.0 and B8.5. CRE is the EA837 evo update of the 3.0T. But CRE, with its port injection, etc, was not coming to NAR. Instead, various improvements of it such as PCV changes were backported to CGX, and we got CTU. Then D4.5 and C7.5 got CRE anyway, minus the port injection.

CGX breather hose: 06E 103 207 P, now AM:


CTU breather hose: 06E 103 207 AC, then AH, now AP:


So I presume your tune is meant for a CTU, not a CGX, entirely.

[Jroyalty7]

Having the low vacuum version of the PCV or high vacuum version of the PCV isn't relevant to that DTC, since none of that is electrical in any way.

Damn I have not been on Audizine for a while, but this is positively one of the most thorough and informative responses I’ve ever received in the years I’ve been on here!! Thank you for the explanation, truly appreciate your time

*Wanted to add, in some of my research I did come across some mention of the PCV not being updated or correct to the newer ECU flash. Which is why I wondered if this code only originated after I switched from EPL tune which I was on from 2018-2022 with no update. Once I switched to 034 I immediately got that code? Just seemed oddly coincidental to me.

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[Smac770]

2013 has the CGX engine, 2014 changed to the CTU engine. The CGX engine does not have that solenoid, the CTU engine does have that solenoid. So if your ECM has programming that is testing for that electrical connection, it's meant for CTU, not CGX. Again, nothing to do with the core PCV system, which was updated at one point from a low vacuum config to a higher vacuum config, which the ECM programming would need to accommodate. But all B8.5 came with the higher vacuum config. Your DTC is nothing about the core PCV, it's about the breather line solenoid, which you don't have. But the programming you've loaded is clearly looking for. Because it's probably based on CTU. Is my take. If you've got the DTC now after changing to 034 software, ask 034 why they are looking for an electrical device that doesn't exist on a CGX, only on a CTU.

[Jroyalty7]

2013 has the CGX engine, 2014 changed to the CTU engine. The CGX engine does not have that solenoid, the CTU engine does have that solenoid. So if your ECM has programming that is testing for that electrical connection, it's meant for CTU, not CGX. Again, nothing to do with the core PCV system, which was updated at one point from a low vacuum config to a higher vacuum config, which the ECM programming would need to accommodate. But all B8.5 came with the higher vacuum config. Your DTC is nothing about the core PCV, it's about the breather line solenoid, which you don't have. But the programming you've loaded is clearly looking for. Because it's probably based on CTU. Is my take. If you've got the DTC now after changing to 034 software, ask 034 why they are looking for an electrical device that doesn't exist on a CGX, only on a CTU.

Exactly what I was trying to tell them but not as well explained appreciate your help on this


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[Wootstapler]

I'm assuming AK is the latest after AH? Have a 2014 Q7 that has constant oil conusmption (needs a quart every month / 1,000 miles) but I always went back and forth deciding if an ECM revision is still needed (which looks like it is).

Does this need to be accomplished with an aftermarket tune or will dealers still be able to flash it from low pressure to high pressure?

[LowKeyLoki]

I just replaced from AH to AK on my friends 2013 Q7, no there is no update needed, that only applies to 2009-2012 B8s that needed to change crank case pressures to the higher 150mbar version. Be sure to replace the breather solenoid/hose that runs from the PCV as well.

[Wootstapler]

We'll sh**. I can't figure out what's consuming oil on this thing. I already replaced it with the AK a few months ago and like I said oil consumption is a constant rate and I've logged it.

Dealer re-seales the rear mains and I don't see any leaking or grime by the valve covers. I was sure the Q7 would need the flash to high pressure.

Have an S4 and replaced with AH and have had no issues.

[Smac770]

It helps to understand the actual version lines of the 06E (EA837) oil separator revisions. I use "x" as a placeholder for "no revision letter". x<>X. X at the end would mean remanufactured (and U mean used). The below are not specific to the B8, they apply to the EA837 in whatever Audi (S4, S5, Q5, SQ5, A6, A7, A8, Q7).

3.2L:
x > E > P

3.0T through MY12, 30 mbar:
C > F > Q > AC

3.0T starting MY13, 150 mbar:
H > S > AB > AH

3.0T starting MY13, 150 mbar, CARB compliant:
L > T > AE > AK

3.0T evo (CRE), 150 mbar:
N > AD > AF

There's also G>R and K>AA>AG version lines, but these are related to the 2.5L/2.8L engines.


CARB is why the CTU have cylinder head cover attached breather hoses (an EA837 evo (CRE) update; since we didn't get CRE, we got some of the CRE updates backported and ended up with CTU):

The vent pipe has a fixed, i.e. non-detachable, connection to the cylinder head cover in order to meet the requirements of the CARB (California Air Resource Board). The vent pipe is identical in all country-spec versions (reduction in the number of variants).

Yeah, they can be removed but

Risk of violating emission legislation applying to USA models.
♦ Crankcase breather hoses cannot be removed without being irreparably damaged. Once removed, they must be renewed.

It's curious what all CARB looks into that might never have been a thought to normal people: https://news.thomasnet.com/fullstory...andards-551562

Like the EA888 4-cyl, we start getting differentiated oil separator/PCV and related hoses on NAR spec models starting MY13. This is driven by CARB. So the H line and L line are probably functionally identical. But there are also CARB differentiating hoses.


breather line = fresh air line from intake to crankcase via port on oil separator
06E 103 207 H > AK -- 2.5L, 2.8L, 3.2L
06E 103 207 L > M > AL > AQ -- 3.0T check valve version, >MY12 (CAKA, CCBA), RoW MY13> (CGW, CJT)
06E 103 207 N > P > AM -- 3.0T CARBonized check valve version, NAR MY13> (CGX, CJW)
06E 103 207 AB > AG -- D4.5 2.5L CVBA
06E 103 207 AC > AH > AP -- EA837 3.0T solenoid version, (NAR CTU/CTW)
06E 103 207 AE > AJ > AR -- EA837evo 3.0T solenoid version, (RoW CRE, later NAR CRE)
(as noted above, evo introduced CARB requirements across the line to reduce part variation, so NAR CRE use the same line as RoW CRE)
CARBonized seems to be nothing more than there's a band clamp on the rubber elbow to make sure it can't come off?


vent pipe = vapor exit path to compressor
06E 103 213, same for all 3.0 supercharged
but US spec installation has two o-rings on each end? "2x on USA versions" for each end of the tube in the workshop manual.


vent plug = plug sealing unused output port on I/O end of oil separator; was the vapor exit path for N/A V6; exit path was removed for evo update, so CRE line (rev N/AD/AF) doesn't use one; 2.5L/2.8L G>R line doesn't need plug either it seems.
06E 103 213 A, all through MY12, RoW from MY13
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...be/06e103213a/
06E 103 213 B, NAR from MY13, this would be the CARB modified version. All I see is a second o-ring in contrast color. But we see the same specification on the vent pipe in the workshop manual, "o-rings x2 for USA".
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...be/06e103213b/


vent lines = hoses from cylinder head covers to input port on I/O end of oil separator
06E 103 217 AC - >MY12 all, MY13> RoW
06E 103 217 AD - MY13> NAR for the H (now AH) oil separator
06E 103 217 AF - MY13> NAR for the L (now AK) oil separator
06E 103 217 AL - CRE

Don't really know what's different about AD vs AF, they both have the second blue o-ring. All of them have the physical keying to be sure it goes in the correct port on the end of the oil separator, including the RoW AC version.

So tf if I know. But it seemed to let Audi make Cali happy doing all this whatever. But to the replacing an AH with an AK, one is not an update to the other, they are both 150 mbar units. One has to presume something is different about the H line vs the L line such that the vent line part needed a different part number. So if you have your original hoses on an engine that started 30 mbar or H line 150 mbar, probably better to stick to the H line. If you have your original hoses on an engine that started 150 mbar L line, probably better to stick to the L line.

[Wootstapler]

Smac thanks for the detailed write up, very clear and concise.

But now that leaves me wondering, our MY14 Q7 would have had a 150mbar PCV regardless and it's a CA vehicle so the AK rev. sounds like the correct one to have installed.

Only thing I can think of doing to chase our oil consumption would be to replace the VC gaskets and do a compression test...I really hope we don't need new piston rings :(

[Smac770]

If you have a 150 mbar part, and you're validating that 150 mbar via a vacuum gauge on the dipstick tube, then I don't know what is the next common thing on a 3.0T. On the 4-cyl, big money is what's next.

[Carnaval09]

Hi! Curious if you figured out your oil consumption issue?

[kappax12]

Having the low vacuum version of the PCV or high vacuum version of the PCV isn't relevant to that DTC, since none of that is electrical in any way.

The positive crankcase vent purpose is simply a exit path (vent) from the crankcase to the intake system so crankcase pressure during load could not build up. To minimize oil loss to this, the path has coarse oil separators in the cylinder head covers and the fine oil separator sitting under the supercharger. To improve ring seal, and reduce oil loss at the rings, the intake manifold vacuum is exposed to this pathway, limited by the pressure regulator valve (the diaphragm balanced between ambient pressure and a spring). To further improve crankcase vapor scavenging, to clear water vapor and blow-by products from the crankcase rather than allow them to settle into the oil, a fresh air entry path (breather) from the post-air filter intake path to the crankcase is present. IM vacuum pulls the "polluted" crankcase gas contents out, replaced by the fresh air.

This is all a fully passive process. No electronics involved. For the EA837 evo (the CRE engine), one of the objectives was improved idle. You have to understand this whole fresh air breather > crankcase > oil separator > supercharger path bypasses the normal throttle plate air volume management. This is why the ECM has to understand the vacuum level, as that will impact the level of uncontrollable air ingestion. Fresh air source also means more "oily, hydrocarbon" crankcase content can be displaced. If the O2 system is seeing high hydrocarbon during idle, the ECM can activate the N548 crankcase vent breather shut-off valve. This can meter the volume of fresh air permitted into the crankcase, assisting idle. Or at least that's what the SSP goes on about.

So I'd have to assume this PCV related electrical circuit error is meaning the N548.

CGW (EU) / CGX (US) is simply the update of the EA837 3.0T to support electromechanical power steering and automatic stop/start, introduced at C7.0 and B8.5. CRE is the EA837 evo update of the 3.0T. But CRE, with its port injection, etc, was not coming to NAR. Instead, various improvements of it such as PCV changes were backported to CGX, and we got CTU. Then D4.5 and C7.5 got CRE anyway, minus the port injection.

CGX breather hose: 06E 103 207 P, now AM:


CTU breather hose: 06E 103 207 AC, then AH, now AP:


So I presume your tune is meant for a CTU, not a CGX, entirely.

Anyone know what I replacement I can use for the elbow tubing? I removed mine from the pcv and it so old it cracked.