Parts to be watching for? As b5 s4 genuine parts are withering away.

[bmwpower603]

Parts to be watching for? As b5 s4 genuine parts are withering away.
Does anyone have a solid list of important parts that are NLA, that I should be on the look-out for?

I remember purchasing the last 2-3 coolant drain plug on the block. And possibly the last b5 s4 Avant car cover... (which I sold) The cup holders can only be had through Audi Tradition. So if I find a connection in Canada I can order one of those.

I also noticed that the heater core hose coming from bank 1 is also unavailable. Even on audi tradition.

Is this C4 S4 all over again?

Any insight would be appreciated.

Cheers

[christianb5s4]

The upper radiator hose is also very hard to find (I just had to source one), however the heater core hose is an easy workaround since you can reuse the existing hose in most cases and simply replace the fittings on either end.

[R490]

Fuel lines

[Dfloods4]

Good thread. Does anyone found another option for the block drain plug?


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[bmwpower603]

Good thread. Does anyone found another option for the block drain plug?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know that you can replace the o ring on the block drain.

Unfortunately. Most of the time these are kind sucky to get out, and may become slightly damaged upon removal.. And threads may not be perfect when installing / reusing the plug.

Audi stops making stuff way to early in my opinion. I know bmw still makes all the parts for the cars dating back to like 1998.

I understand the b5 S4 is quirky. And may not generate a lot of sales on parts. But it’s also a Legend if a vehicle. And should absolutely make everything available. Just my honest opinion.

I sold my c4 S4 due to the fact that I couldn’t find important parts to replace worn ones.

[rnagy86]

I know that you can replace the o ring on the block drain.

Unfortunately. Most of the time these are kind sucky to get out, and may become slightly damaged upon removal.. And threads may not be perfect when installing / reusing the plug.

Audi stops making stuff way to early in my opinion. I know bmw still makes all the parts for the cars dating back to like 1998.

I understand the b5 S4 is quirky. And may not generate a lot of sales on parts. But it’s also a Legend if a vehicle. And should absolutely make everything available. Just my honest opinion.

I sold my c4 S4 due to the fact that I couldn’t find important parts to replace worn ones.

Audi does not care. After 10-15 years, no newly manufactured parts are available, you can only get what they have
in stock (including Audi tradition) and then you are done. That is why I am considering to sell my RS4, because it is
getting a real pain in the ass, especially because the car is 20 years old and I can't even get a proper OEM headliner
and there is no aftermarket headliner fabric that matches the color either.

[VR6Bomber]

This is a 25 yr old platform.

Its not unreasonable to expect that genuine OEM factory parts will be tapering.
For the most part, febi, Meyle, URO, and etc. will have you covered with the common parts.

Or you might need to get creative and make some parts. I'm looking for non rusted hood strut shocks...they are NLA.

Rarely do you hear b4, b3 and UR guys complaining about NLA parts. They just hunt them down or get creative. It's part of the hobby.

Is not having OEM headliner fabric a real issue? I guess that's up to you.

[iansane]

This is a 25 yr old platform.

Its not unreasonable to expect that genuine OEM factory parts will be tapering.
For the most part, febi, Meyle, URO, and etc. will have you covered with the common parts.

Or you might need to get creative and make some parts. I'm looking for non rusted hood strut shocks...they are NLA.

Rarely do you hear b4, b3 and UR guys complaining about NLA parts. They just hunt them down or get creative. It's part of the hobby.

Is not having OEM headliner fabric a real issue? I guess that's up to you.

You say that like there are more than 10 b3/b4 guys worldwide... Ha.
Resurrecting a mc1 b3 last year was a royal pain, this b5 shit is easy comparatively.

[bmwpower603]

You say that like there are more than 10 b3/b4 guys worldwide... Ha.
Resurrecting a mc1 b3 last year was a royal pain, this b5 shit is easy comparatively.

It is NOT normal for a manufacturer to stop making parts at the rate that Audi is for the B5 S4... (Which is in my top 5 favorite vehicles of all time) It is still way to early in my opinion to stop making some of the parts ive seen wither away.

Oh my top five

1. Ferrari F430
2. E60 M5
3. Porsche 911 S
4. B5 S4 / E36 M3 (tie)
5. E46 M3

[VR6Bomber]

You say that like there are more than 10 b3/b4 guys worldwide... Ha.
Resurrecting a mc1 b3 last year was a royal pain, this b5 shit is easy comparatively.

I don't think the mc1 was offered in the b3?

MG and RS246 are the classic audi forums, any there is plenty of activity there.

C3, b3 and b4 production numbers were dismal and were a double digit fraction of the b5 production. So was very little aftermarket support for those platforms versus the b5, comparatively speaking.

If you needed a part for a b3, b4, c3, there was usually one, maybe two options. Vw/Audi or Meyle, that's it. You didn't get 4,5, or 6 oe options like you do with B5 parts. You can pick from like 8 different motor mounts for the B5.
I don't even remember a single coil over suspension kit made for any of the b3, b4 or c3 cars. You had to cobble together some Ground Control sleeves on a strut and find some springs made for VW models etc.

I was in the b4 game back in the 1990's.

[VR6Bomber]

It is NOT normal for a manufacturer to stop making parts at the rate that Audi is for the B5 S4... (Which is in my top 5 favorite vehicles of all time) It is still way to early in my opinion to stop making some of the parts ive seen wither away.

Oh my top five

1. Ferrari F430
2. E60 M5
3. Porsche 911 S
4. B5 S4 / E36 M3 (tie)
5. E46 M3

How long is 'normal' in your opinion for mass-produced vehicles to start to discontinue factory parts?

25 years seems like a reasonable amount of time for the 'normal' consumer automotive parts life cycle to complete. The automotive model life cycle in down to 6 yrs currently?
Automotive makers have less time to recoup development costs today than ever before. The pressure is on consumers purchase a newer model as quickly as possible to accelerate the product cycle. Which will also accelerate the end of factory support the previous model, correct?

In fact, It might even be true that automakers loose money the longer they maintain legacy production related operations, factories, tooling, workers and other overhead related to producing unprofitable legacy parts and products.

That is excluding 'boutique' brands like Porsche or Ferrari. It's unfair to compare those makers to more mass production makers.

Should Audi keep making factory parts for 35, 40 years after the last car rolls off? Forever..?
Investors want to see return on development investment, and not continuing parts production for 25+ yr old models.

Parts forever would be wonderful the hobbyists but also a very poor way to run an aggressive forward-looking business.

Audi Tradition could make parts forever and offer them at a price to sustain that business division.
That would just be a 'nice thing to do' for a few unprofitable consumers.




(Edited for grammar/ wording)

[Heavy Winter]

Should audi keep making factory parts for 35, 40 years after the last car rolls off? Forever..?

This. Platforms age out. It's just the way things go. I sold my C4 S6 Avant despite the car's rarity in the USA due to this. At some point I'll sell my B5 S4 Avant due to similar issues. The problem for me is that both of these cars were/are daily drivers. I refuse to drive a boring car and I'm addicted to Quattro Avants. The lack of parts or difficulty in obtaining them may not be such an issue for those with garage queens. but for those of us who drive them all the time, it gets tricky. The used parts situation is pretty good for now for the B5 platform, so I rely on that as needed. With that being said, who has a good condition L+R windshield cowl that they want to sell?

[harryn]

How long is 'normal' in your opinion for mass-produced vehicles to start to discontinue factory parts?

25 years seems like a reasonable amount of time for the 'normal' consumer automotive parts life cycle to complete. The automotive model life cycle in down to 6.7 yrs currently.
Automotive makers have less time to recoup development costs today than ever before. The pressure is on consumers move on to a newer model as quickly as possible to accelerate the product cycle, thus signals the end of factory support for a previous model, no?

In fact, It might even be true that automakers loose money by maintaining legacy production assets. Can a factory producing B5 parts be profitable? With its machinery, tooling and workers and overhead costs versus the demand for those parts?

That is excluding 'boutique' brands like Porsche or Ferrari. It's unfair to compare those makers to more mass production makers.

Should audi keep making factory parts for 35, 40 years after the last car rolls off? Forever..?

That would be wonderful for us hobbyists and also a very poor way to run an aggressive forward-looking business. The automotive industry being prime example.

Audi tradition could make parts forever and offer them at a price to sustain that business division.
That would be a 'nice thing to do' for a very small few.

I'll add Mercedes Benz to that list of "boutique" brands. They still make parts for some of their more "ancient" cars. But all in all, you hit the nail on the head. I was very lucky to get my windshield cowl pieces brand new for the left and right side. Now, I just treat them and keep them clean to extend their life as long as possible.

Making parts with part fabricators/3d printers, that's a possibility for some plastic and metal parts. At this point, if you can find a parts car, buy it and stock up on parts. Some VW Passat B5.5 parts fit on our cars just fine, such as the (in my opinion) upgraded heater core.

[bmwpower603]

Everyone is talking about the windshield cowls.

I need to go check the condition of mine now.

[VR6Bomber]

Everyone is talking about the windshield cowls.

I need to go check the condition of mine now.

FYI, I see that you are in NH. Contact Chris@Forcefive. Good dude.

[belms4]

From what I've heard Mercedes is pretty good at keeping old parts available. I've been told they make just about anything still for their cars around the age of the B5 and a little further back into the 90s (maybe even 80s?), they just sell them at really high prices. Would be nice if Audi followed that. I don't care what the price of some of these parts go to if it at least kept Audi producing new batches from time to time. To be fair, the B5 is their first real mass produced "classic" Audi model in my mind, so it's all relatively new to them having to try to keep up with a 20+ year old platform that still has so many active owners around the world. I'd heard some time ago Porsche was beginning to take advantage of modern 3D printing to begin producing parts for their classic models. Maybe someday that could take a dent out of what disappears for the Audi lineups too without the overhead of keeping so many employees and large plants to produce small numbers of ancient parts. You'd think there would be a renewed push to produce more replacement parts longer with the economy of the past couple years with shortages of new cars and used car values skyrocketing and people holding on to their used cars longer than they did previously. Though there is the government push to make everything electric as fast as possible and get rid of ICE cars.

We in the states also have the added headache of Audi Tradition versus Audi USA territory. Audi Tradition (Audi Germany branch last I knew) can't sell here because it's Audi USA's sales geo and Audi USA has really no classic parts division I'm aware of (maybe they do?). Once it's NLA, it seems gone from the states pretty much for good. An Audi parts department employee once told me they may produce small new batches of NLA parts from a classic division of Audi USA, but I've never seen that happen once to my knowledge, nor have I heard ever again about a classic parts division of Audi USA. At least we've got a good community here that for many NLA parts have come up with homemade workarounds/replacements. But things like the cowls or battery covers seem too big for home 3D printers or printing at home would make the piece too brittle/stiff to make a quality replacement. Doesn't make sense to me when Audi quits making a more complex, very visible wear item like cowls which most B5s have needed replaced once or twice by now. Luckily a large majority of the mechanical parts are still available for the 2.7T, but we'll see how much that matters in a few more years when you can't do a full ground up restoration with new interior/exterior parts. The platform will have to move to heavily leaning on its remaining community for solutions there or hope for a major classic parts supplier to appear like there are for classic American car restorations. It's taken me a massive effort to do a full overhaul with my widebody avant build and I'm lucky I've owned a B5 S4 since 2005 and had a head start with collecting parts and making connections for the past 17 years.

[iansane]

We in the states also have the added headache of Audi Tradition versus Audi USA territory. Audi Tradition can't sell here because it's Audi USA's sales geo and Audi USA has really no classic parts division I'm aware of (maybe they do?).

I keep seeing this posted here but I've never had any issue ordering parts from the dealer through Audi Tradition. Granted, I worked in the Audi parts department for a bit so it was easier to push the issue so someone would actually try to order it versus 'just being too much work'. Cupholder, door handles, sunroof seal for a b3 and misc other odds and ends. It definitely isn't cheap because they just revamped the pricing structure (used to be based off the original MSRP I believe and now it's just whatever they feel like, ie expensive) but it's definitely doable.

However, you all are right in that BMW is much better about vintage parts. They're still being made en masse. The quality has suffered a great deal so older nice condition parts are sometimes is just as good, or better than the new stuff. I've found that a lot with my e30s.

I don't think the mc1 was offered in the b3?

MG and RS246 are the classic audi forums, any there is plenty of activity there.

C3, b3 and b4 production numbers were dismal and were a double digit fraction of the b5 production. So was very little aftermarket support for those platforms versus the b5, comparatively speaking.

If you needed a part for a b3, b4, c3, there was usually one, maybe two options. Vw/Audi or Meyle, that's it. You didn't get 4,5, or 6 oe options like you do with B5 parts. You can pick from like 8 different motor mounts for the B5.
I don't even remember a single coil over suspension kit made for any of the b3, b4 or c3 cars. You had to cobble together some Ground Control sleeves on a strut and find some springs made for VW models etc.

I was in the b4 game back in the 1990's.

Oh, it was a swap car. But like you said, I had to build coilovers(super easy) and there's absolutely no support for the 034efi that was on it.

[RMode]

I keep seeing this posted here but I've never had any issue ordering parts from the dealer through Audi Tradition. Granted, I worked in the Audi parts department for a bit so it was easier to push the issue so someone would actually try to order it versus 'just being too much work'. Cupholder, door handles, sunroof seal for a b3 and misc other odds and ends. It definitely isn't cheap because they just revamped the pricing structure (used to be based off the original MSRP I believe and now it's just whatever they feel like, ie expensive) but it's definitely doable.

However, you all are right in that BMW is much better about vintage parts. They're still being made en masse. The quality has suffered a great deal so older nice condition parts are sometimes is just as good, or better than the new stuff. I've found that a lot with my e30s.




Oh, it was a swap car. But like you said, I had to build coilovers(super easy) and there's absolutely no support for the 034efi that was on it.

Comparatively, BMW enjoys a far larger collectible status across models than Audi, which has a lot to do with it. Porsche gets it right....but it took a long, long, long time to get it to where it is today (and that's without considering what the items cost). The wave that brought the values of anything aircooled up, even the previous undesirables, fueled it, particularly since like MB, you can commission Porsche to restore the car for you. Even on the BMW side, the highly collectible cars don't have lots of important parts sitting around. You're hunting them down. It's the same with Ferrari.

The thing to realize, is especially going back to when our cars were new, Audi didn't make the parts to begin with. This is true for the S models before ours too (S2, S4/S6). That was the heyday of their outsourcing, because financially, they were in the toilet. For them to now tool up plastic molds, and set forth a production schedule, for the maybe 500 pair of windshield cowls they would sell (at lord knows what price), isn't a great use of resources, especially in a day an age where they struggle to deliver 2 keys with a new car.

[RMode]

I keep seeing this posted here but I've never had any issue ordering parts from the dealer through Audi Tradition. Granted, I worked in the Audi parts department for a bit so it was easier to push the issue so someone would actually try to order it versus 'just being too much work'. Cupholder, door handles, sunroof seal for a b3 and misc other odds and ends. It definitely isn't cheap because they just revamped the pricing structure (used to be based off the original MSRP I believe and now it's just whatever they feel like, ie expensive) but it's definitely doable.

However, you all are right in that BMW is much better about vintage parts. They're still being made en masse. The quality has suffered a great deal so older nice condition parts are sometimes is just as good, or better than the new stuff. I've found that a lot with my e30s.




Oh, it was a swap car. But like you said, I had to build coilovers(super easy) and there's absolutely no support for the 034efi that was on it.

Most aren't willing/able, as it's a process (ask me how I know lol).

[belms4]

I keep seeing this posted here but I've never had any issue ordering parts from the dealer through Audi Tradition. Granted, I worked in the Audi parts department for a bit so it was easier to push the issue so someone would actually try to order it versus 'just being too much work'. Cupholder, door handles, sunroof seal for a b3 and misc other odds and ends. It definitely isn't cheap because they just revamped the pricing structure (used to be based off the original MSRP I believe and now it's just whatever they feel like, ie expensive) but it's definitely doable.

The explanation here is pretty much what I've been told as a customer (I don't work at Audi). My assumption would be it's an internal Audi favor if you can order from Tradition, but maybe things have changed more recently. I wouldn't know, been a while since I've bothered asking since the question usually goes nowhere with the parts department.

https://www.motorgeek.com/threads/co...n-parts.84649/

[bmwpower603]

Audi tradition is very skimpy. For the b5 S4 Atleast. The c4 S4 /s6 they do indeed have an abundance of items I believe compared to the b5.

I cannot even get a coolant drain plug for the block.. Which is pretty significant. Considering it’s an item needed for timing belt service. (To do it properly)

Another important one would be the front bumper alignment clips. Which should be replaced at every timing belt service as well..

Crank case PCV cover , exhaust clamps, ect. A lot of important parts.

I’m pretty sure the c4 S4 /s6 serpentine belt tensioner, and idler pulleys are NLA as well. And those are wear and tear items.

[Scotty@Advanced]

Pretty much there isn't much money to be made by an OEM supporting 20+ year old cars.

Is this C4 S4 all over again?

With limited exception Audi Tradition just sells New Old Stock, and when that New Old Stock is depeleted it's gone forever, as the cost of retooling to make a limited run of parts isn't worth it.

Audi tradition is very skimpy.

[LJS]

FWIW-
If you want to keep this car for the long term you have to start collecting parts---
I presently have a LARGE assortment of NOS and used parts...
Instrument cluster, ECU, OE radiator hoses, OE heater hoses, OE turn signal,headlight,cruise control switch and a shit load more---all collected over the last 10 years
There's no way around this.

[Scotty@Advanced]

It is NOT normal for a manufacturer to stop making parts at the rate that Audi is for the B5 S4... (Which is in my top 5 favorite vehicles of all time) It is still way to early in my opinion to stop making some of the parts ive seen wither away.

Actually it is normal for a manufacturer to stop making parts at the rate Audi is for the B5 S4, in fact I'd say Audi has made parts far longer than many.
Ford at one time quit making crash parts for the late 80's thunderbird. One of the fenders was marked NLA by Ford 3-4 years after the conclusion on the model, which lead to many cars being totalled for minor fender benders.
Companies like Audi are in business to make money, and that is done by making and selling new cars. Their replacement parts business is a small fraction of that, and there is no money to be made by an OEM supporting a 25+ year old platform.

[A4Qwattro]

Actually it is normal for a manufacturer to stop making parts at the rate Audi is for the B5 S4, in fact I'd say Audi has made parts far longer than many.
Ford at one time quit making crash parts for the late 80's thunderbird. One of the fenders was marked NLA by Ford 3-4 years after the conclusion on the model, which lead to many cars being totalled for minor fender benders.
Companies like Audi are in business to make money, and that is done by making and selling new cars. Their replacement parts business is a small fraction of that, and there is no money to be made by an OEM supporting a 25+ year old platform.

Far longer than many? Not compared to the other German manufacturers. Audi is the worst. Porsche/BMW/Mercedes are some of the best.

We're not even talking about Audi not wanting to keep supplier contracts for a 25 year old car. That is expected. It's the fact that they won't even let Audi Tradition deal with the USA directly. This is pure anti-enthusiast and anti-heritage behavior.

Porsche classic parts: https://www.heritagepartscentre.com/us/porsche

Mercedes classic parts: https://classicparts.mbusa.com/

BMW you can get the connection at the dealer. BMW will even have reproduction part runs.