Lower control arm removal

[MyDimeIsUp]

Hey all,

removing my front lower control arm and I'm having a problem with this M12 bolt with 18 nut. I got the nut off after finally getting my M12 triple square in the bolt head. Im hammering the bolt out and it stops moving. Sure enough I look on the other side and its hitting something coming from the steering rack. All the videos show there being plenty of room, but for me the bolt is hitting something coming from the steering rack. Any ideas? 2013 allroad

This bolt: https://youtu.be/1Yc-y3o_kR4?t=744

[fastboatster]

hmm, it probably looks different because the allroad is jacked up, i.e., has taller suspension compared to a sedan or an avant. what if you jack the wheel hub a bit, will that bolt clear the steering rack boot?

[MyDimeIsUp]

hmm, it probably looks different because the allroad is jacked up, i.e., has taller suspension compared to a sedan or an avant. what if you jack the wheel hub a bit, will that bolt clear the steering rack boot?

I did try jacking up on the knuckle and it didn't seem to work

[jfo]

Try turning the steering wheel to change the position of the boot. I recall I had a similar issue.

[fastboatster]

in that case you might have to undo the bolts holding the steering rack to the subframe and lower it. I think there's a thread with a manual for all the b8/b8.5 cars, 8k service manual or something, try to take a look there and see what you need to do for the allroad before removing single-use steering rack bolts and nuts.

[fastboatster]

Try turning the steering wheel to change the position of the boot. I recall I had a similar issue.

there we go, it's probably something obvious like this that we were missing)

[jfo]

there we go, it's probably something obvious like this that we were missing)

It will still be difficult to get around the boot, but it can be done.

[MyDimeIsUp]

I got it thanks. Turning the wheel worked. Now I just need to figure out how to spread the boot without the spreader tool. I tried screwdriver and chisel but no luck yet

[jfo]

I got it thanks. Turning the wheel worked. Now I just need to figure out how to spread the boot without the spreader tool. I tried screwdriver and chisel but no luck yet

Spread the boot?? Do you mean the ball joint knuckle?

[MyDimeIsUp]

Spread the boot?? Do you mean the ball joint knuckle?

Correct that's what I meant. I've tried everything I can think of and I'm stressed, annoyed, angry, and more. I'm letting it go for the night. Car is on jack stands in the street and I'll tackle it when I get home from school. I've ordered the spreader tool from Amazon and it should be arriving tomorrow. We'll see if that works.

[jfo]

Correct that's what I meant. I've tried everything I can think of and I'm stressed, annoyed, angry, and more. I'm letting it go for the night. Car is on jack stands in the street and I'll tackle it when I get home from school. I've ordered the spreader tool from Amazon and it should be arriving tomorrow. We'll see if that works.

This is why it's a good idea to download all the repair manuals from erWin. Take a washer the same size as the space in the knuckle and insert it in the space . Then insert the bolt back into the opposite(threaded) side. Tighten the bolt against the washer until the ball joint releases.[B]

[FR_A4]

Correct that's what I meant. I've tried everything I can think of and I'm stressed, annoyed, angry, and more. I'm letting it go for the night. Car is on jack stands in the street and I'll tackle it when I get home from school. I've ordered the spreader tool from Amazon and it should be arriving tomorrow. We'll see if that works.

Ah yes. The sheer frustration because Audi did something stupid. That sounds familiar.

All the videos I have seen have a special spreader tool. Basically an oval shaped breaker bar attachment.


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[MyDimeIsUp]

This is why it's a good idea to download all the repair manuals from erWin. Take a washer the same size as the space in the knuckle and insert it in the space . Then insert the bolt back into the opposite(threaded) side. Tighten the bolt against the washer until the ball joint releases.[B]

I must've missed that. Could you screenshot that so I can see? Sorry just a very long day!

[fastboatster]

I think autozone and oreiily loan ball joint spreader tool among many others, not sure if what they offer works with Audis but it's worth trying because it's effectively free:
https://www.autozone.com/loan-a-tool...oint-separator
https://www.autozone.com/loan-a-tool...tor/787834_0_0
https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/c...n1/67026?pos=3
https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/c...n1/67029?pos=8
ball joint separator is what it's called officially. Might have to look for a store which has it, though

[MyDimeIsUp]

I did see that and was going to rent one but when I watched FCPEuro and another channel, they just wiggled it out. Other one used a socket and a hammer it from the bottom out. It seemed easy enough that I could just spread the knuckle and wiggle it out. I'll loan the puller tomorrow and use in conjunction with the speader socket tomorrow.

[jfo]

While I figure out how to paste the image, look several pages along in the manual. In mine, the page you posted is p75 and the ball joint removal is p81.

[jfo]

I did see that and was going to rent one but when I watched FCPEuro and another channel, they just wiggled it out. Other one used a socket and a hammer it from the bottom out. It seemed easy enough that I could just spread the knuckle and wiggle it out. I'll loan the puller tomorrow and use in conjunction with the speader socket tomorrow.

You don't need a ball joint separator for this one. Either the spreader socket in the video or the washer technique as per the manual, and tap it with a socket from the bottom if it's stuck.

[Smac770]

So much confusion. I have no idea what actual step OP is actually trying to process.

There's the 3424 "spreader", but that's for getting the strut out of the strut fork.
There's the T40010A "ball joint puller", but that's for popping the arms off the ball joints.
If this is about trying to get the ball joint for the lower straight arm out of the wheel bearing housing, jfo provided the process as in the Audi manual. The ElsaWin stuff is organized differently than the PDF from ERWIN. It's section 5.16 Ball Joint within group 40, right after control arm and control arm ball bearing. So maybe a few pages down from the current text in Dime's screens shots.

[Smac770]

(in Audi text re the lower arms, "control arm" is the lower straight and "guide link" is the lower curved)

[MyDimeIsUp]

You don't need a ball joint separator for this one. Either the spreader socket in the video or the washer technique as per the manual, and tap it with a socket from the bottom if it's stuck.

I did find it. erWin/PDFs use such odd names. It's not ball joint but rather called "swivel joint" . If only I had a washer that was >= 8mm. Thanks for letting me know of that but even then I don't have any spare washers that I could use that are that thick.

[MyDimeIsUp]

@smac I'm having problems pulling the lower control arm out of the knuckle as shown in this part of the video: https://youtu.be/1Yc-y3o_kR4?t=772

I didn't buy the VW 3424 thinking I could just use a chisel or screwdriver to spread the knuckle but think I was sadly mistaken I think. I would tug, pull, wiggle, and hammer the lower control arm from the bottom and it wouldn't come out of the knuckle. I purchased 3424 from Amazon and it should be arriving tomorrow and hopefully that should work.

[jfo]

The 3424 is spec'd for the strut fork as smac noted, but it may work if it fits into the ball joint slot. The spreader the FCP guy uses may or may not be the same size as the 3424...there are different versions of this socket/tool. I would only open the slot as much as needed to loosen the ball joint, rather than cranking it to the max opening that the socket can deliver.

[Smac770]

Ok, so removal of the control arm ball joint from the wheel bearing housing.
Anything that's the same width as the slot will work. I can't believe FCP is not bothering to do it correctly, instead hacking up the edges of the slot with a spreader tool.
All you need is something that can sit into the slot, that is the same width as the slot, so you can put the screw in and hand tighten the screw up to the object. Then one half turn and out comes the ball joint easy peasy. Do two quarters fit?

[MyDimeIsUp]

Ok, so removal of the control arm ball joint from the wheel bearing housing.
Anything that's the same width as the slot will work. I can't believe FCP is not bothering to do it correctly, instead hacking up the edges of the slot with a spreader tool.
All you need is something that can sit into the slot, that is the same width as the slot, so you can put the screw in and hand tighten the screw up to the object. Then one half turn and out comes the ball joint easy peasy. Do two quarters fit?

This is why I'm so glad we have forums. Can't imagine working on cars without any resources (IE the internet). Definitely going to give quarters a try tomorrow!

[MyDimeIsUp]

Thanks everyone for the help. I decided to quickly try the VW 3424 tool before moving to screws and it worked actually. In 3 minutes I got it out! I got the new one in except I'm having alignment problems with the shock absorber fork. I can't for the life of me get it to align. Is this something with the avant? I didn't find anything in erWin about the shock absorber. Also I have to turn the wheel all the way to the right then ever so slightly left for the inside bolt hole to line up. I fear I may have messed something up with the shock absorber fork when jacking the knuckle up as it looks like its leaning more towards the outside

[fastboatster]

for some reason I thought you were trying to pop the tie rod end ball joint out of the knuckle, pickle-fork tool wouldn't work for popping the control arm ball joint. To line up the holes, I'm going to suggest to insert the bolt into the subframe control arm mount, make sure that the ball joint is all the way in in the knuckle and play with steering angle and jacking the wheel hub to get the shock mount to align. shock fork can rotate a few degrees as well. Another thought is to double check if the new arms are the same as the old ones, could be possible that allroad arms are different, but that needs to be double-checked

[Smac770]

Do you have only one side jacked up? If so, the anti-roll bar is likely twisting on that strut fork. When I did mine, I was on QuickJacks so both sides were hanging freely (you have to jack the level back up to torque the bolts, but to get the bolts installed, they were hanging).

Also, it looks like the wheel is turned; I think I remember them being straight for all but that lower straight to subframe bolt due to the steering rack boot. (I read you have it turned intentionally, but I don't remember needing to do that, thus my wonder about the ARB).

8K allroad lowers are the same as 8K sedan/avant; it's the uppers that are longer.

[MyDimeIsUp]

Gotcha thanks all for the info. I'm all set and going in for an alignment tomorrow! Don't know what I'd do without this forum.