Flex Fuel Kit for B8s Anyone?

[034Motorsport]

Nothing is solidified, but we at 034Motorsport would like to gauge some interest on whether or not folks would be interested in a flex-fuel conversion kit that comes with all necessary hardware and software to make your B8 flex-fuel compatible? Pricing would likely come in around $1500-2000, though it could be more depending on how the R&D process goes/what we determine to need to be done. This kit would be able to handle anything from E0-E85 and adjust the necessary tuning maps to optimize power, performance, and reliability.

What are your thoughts? Is this something that B8 owners would be interested in? Let us know!

-Nick@034

[Grouch]

Would the software be necessary to run your kit? I would like to purchase the kit by itself as I'm running APR software already.

[034Motorsport]

Would the software be necessary to run your kit? I would like to purchase the kit by itself as I'm running APR software already.

Yes, it would only work with 034Motorsport tuning software, as other aftermarket software's are not built to support flex-fuel capability for the B8.

-Nick@034

[bb-tt]

Yes, it would only work with 034Motorsport tuning software, as other aftermarket software's are not built to support flex-fuel capability for the B8.

-Nick@034

Hpt sw is compatible with flex fuel.

[weagle1856]

Imagine an A4 Avant that could run this. If I ever find an avant, I will be VERY interested.

E85 all the A4s!

[Traptalk]

I’d also be interested in just hardware

Specifically a 5th injector kit

Already have custom tuning, walbro 450, fuel-it content sensor, and cpma flex injectors


Honestly the only piece to the puzzle that’s missing is a nice elegant 5th injector solution

This would also be a nice fueling option for big turbos guys who need more fuel as well as flex applications

Unless you’re saying your going to be custom tuning everyone individual cars because some of us running hybrids cant run cookie cutter stage 1/2/k04 files

[Nano909]

Yesssssss please! Would be great if you could offer a hardware only option as well for us custom tuned guys.

[Audi 4 Life]

I’d also be interested in just hardware

Specifically a 5th injector kit

Already have custom tuning, walbro 450, fuel-it content sensor, and cpma flex injectors


Honestly the only piece to the puzzle that’s missing is a nice elegant 5th injector solution

This would also be a nice fueling option for big turbos guys who need more fuel as well as flex applications

Unless you’re saying your going to be custom tuning everyone individual cars because some of us running hybrids cant run cookie cutter stage 1/2/k04 files

X2

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[bb-tt]

X3 would be interested in hardware options. Not to disparage 034 you guys have made awesome stuff for years, just past the ots tunes at this point.

[Nano909]

X3 would be interested in hardware options. Not to disparage 034 you guys have made awesome stuff for years, just past the ots tunes at this point.

But there are still LOTS of people that will buy the entire kit since they don't want to dip their toes in custom tuning.

[Traptalk]

But there are still LOTS of people that will buy the entire kit since they don't want to dip their toes in custom tuning.

Yeah and look how slow they are.

[Nano909]

Yeah and look how slow they are.

That's not the point. Lol

[Mars2]

I’d also be interested in just hardware

Specifically a 5th injector kit

Already have custom tuning, walbro 450, fuel-it content sensor, and cpma flex injectors


Honestly the only piece to the puzzle that’s missing is a nice elegant 5th injector solution

This would also be a nice fueling option for big turbos guys who need more fuel as well as flex applications

Unless you’re saying your going to be custom tuning everyone individual cars because some of us running hybrids cant run cookie cutter stage 1/2/k04 files

Stratified does a 5TH injector for the G6 GTI you just need to make a new pipe for the injector holder. That is peace of cake you just design it and go to a guy with lathe to get it milled cost me 40$.
every thing else is plug'n play.
Work really good. I have now plenty of E85 for 281G/s and I'm just at 3ms of injection time on the 5th Injector.
On split second controller it's super easy to adjust the injection 3D Map (rpm/boost/ injector m.s). a kid would manage it.

Sure a ethanol content sensor would be nice to switch through timing map. I have all the OEM connection diagram from audi for MED17.1 flex fuel sensor. I just miss a guy that could enable the MED17.1 to use that ethanol sensor and do all the map's. their is this guy in India that can do it for cheaper that guy's in US/Europe.

So as I don't have ethanol content sensor we go around that by making fueling flex and use E85 egressive timing map. I know that if I put 93 in the tank I have to drive conservative until next refill of E85. It will pull out lot of timing.
I can start to drive agressive at E42.
But the last 3 year I never did a full tank of 93. I always mange to find E85.

[jaustin]

what sort of power would it put down?

[Traptalk]

what sort of power would it put down?

Stock turbo power... LOL

[Traptalk]

Stratified does a 5TH injector for the G6 GTI you just need to make a new pipe for the injector holder. That is peace of cake you just design it and go to a guy with lathe to get it milled cost me 40$.
every thing else is plug'n play.
Work really good. I have now plenty of E85 for 281G/s and I'm just at 3ms of injection time on the 5th Injector.
On split second controller it's super easy to adjust the injection 3D Map (rpm/boost/ injector m.s). a kid would manage it.

Sure a ethanol content sensor would be nice to switch through timing map. I have all the OEM connection diagram from audi for MED17.1 flex fuel sensor. I just miss a guy that could enable the MED17.1 to use that ethanol sensor and do all the map's. their is this guy in India that can do it for cheaper that guy's in US/Europe.

So as I don't have ethanol content sensor we go around that by making fueling flex and use E85 egressive timing map. I know that if I put 93 in the tank I have to drive conservative until next refill of E85. It will pull out lot of timing.
I can start to drive agressive at E42.
But the last 3 year I never did a full tank of 93. I always mange to find E85.

Easy if you’re capable with CAD or 3D modeling software and have a cheap machinist.

I can’t even find a local machinist to port my turbo lol

Dudes are dodging me telling me they don’t have the right tools

[Mars2]

for this case I just did a 2D drawing as the part was so easy and after got a injector carrier welded on it.
it goes just before throttle body
For some more complicated part I do 3D .IGS or .STL file.

Capture 2020-09-15 à 22.36.06.jpg

[Mars2]

If you have a boost hard pipe kit ( aluminium) like ECS you can get the 5th injector holder welded on the the aluminium pipe just before the throttle body

[fastboatster]

why do we necessarily need 5th injector for e85? Is this because of hpfp or stock injector flow limits? if that's an injector limitation then can s3 injectors help? I get it, though, spraying some e85 into the intake manifold might help to keep the valves cleaner

[Traptalk]

why do we necessarily need 5th injector for e85? Is this because of hpfp or stock injector flow limits? if that's an injector limitation then can s3 injectors help? I get it, though, spraying some e85 into the intake manifold might help to keep the valves cleaner

It helps cold starts especially in winter months if you only use e85.

For big turbo guys it helps get more fuel since ethanol requires approx 30% more volume

[fastboatster]

For big turbo guys it helps get more fuel since ethanol requires approx 30% more volume

that's right, I guess my question was if it's possible to achieve extra fuel flow by using higher flow injectors from the s3 plus hpfp upgrade.

[Traptalk]

that's right, I guess my question was if it's possible to achieve extra fuel flow by using higher flow injectors from the s3 plus hpfp upgrade.

To an extent

You’re fuel needs will depend on your turbo/power level

There’s not really much flow data to compare if s3 injectors are really even a worthwhile upgrade. Would have to be from a flex fuel s3

And then still a non flex fuel in tank fuel pump won’t be able to handle pure ethanol and runs out of flow around e40 it seems

[itsdan313]

Would be interested

[Smac770]

I suggest reading SSP 439. It discusses the changes made to the gas only CDNx engine (Euro version of our CAEx engine) to create the flex fuel CFKA engine. The CFKA was around before the CPMx engines in the NAR B8.5 models. I'm not sure what more or less of the CFKA changes the CPMx incorporated.

But I notice it mention the stronger conrods for the E85 handling. The CAEB changed on May 30 2011 to the stronger rods and larger pins which would carry through the B8.5 CAED/CPMB engines. So if you have stock on a pre-May 30 '11 engine, you might have to give that some thought.

There's also the different, E85 resistant, fuel pump. And details like: "A different material exhibiting higher wear resistance was required for the valve seat rings due to the lower lubricating action of the ethanol."

[19birel]

I would be interested in the full kit, tuning and everything. I have a B8.5 but being a 6MT I still lack flex fuel compatibility from factory.

[IronAudi]

If I am reading this correctly the B8 like the B7 still don't have a large injector option passed S3? They make fire hose injectors for K motors, nothing for Audi.

[Mars2]

I don' think the S3/golf MK7R injector flow much more than the B8.5 flex fuel injector.
They flow more on a S3/G7R because they run 235 Bar. but we can't run more than 200 Bar.

On 100% E85 G7R injector on a E888.1 are max out at 390 CHP 200 bar upgrade HPFP and B8.5 FF injector are max out at 380 CHP 200 bar and upgrade HPFP on EA888.2
those are not on same dyno. but that show that they flow almost same.
the dyno from the EA888.1 read a bit optimistic compare to dyno of EA888.2.
So it not like they flow a 100 Hp more.

[flowhigh]

Nothing is solidified, but we at 034Motorsport would like to gauge some interest on whether or not folks would be interested in a flex-fuel conversion kit that comes with all necessary hardware and software to make your B8 flex-fuel compatible? Pricing would likely come in around $1500-2000, though it could be more depending on how the R&D process goes/what we determine to need to be done. This kit would be able to handle anything from E0-E85 and adjust the necessary tuning maps to optimize power, performance, and reliability.

What are your thoughts? Is this something that B8 owners would be interested in? Let us know!

-Nick@034

It's going to be difficult to offer a real flexfuel conversion kit for under 2G. The Flexfuel A4's have every thing from different fuel line componentry, piston rings and more. Even the valve guides are different. If your potential customers just want to be able to fill up from the E85 pump and not really be too concerned with what's happening internally then I guess you might make it fly.

[Mars2]

It's going to be difficult to offer a real flexfuel conversion kit for under 2G. The Flexfuel A4's have every thing from different fuel line componentry, piston rings and more. Even the valve guides are different. If your potential customers just want to be able to fill up from the E85 pump and not really be too concerned with what's happening internally then I guess you might make it fly.

You don't need all that.
I did now 85.000km only 100%E85 on this EA888.2, on My R32 engine before I did 100.000km only E85, on MY FRS/BRZ I did 60.000kmonly E85, without all that.
Non of my car ever see pump gas.
Here in France E85 is so cheap compare to gas ( 2 time cheaper) that many convert their car to 100% E85. Government even agree on that and give the opportunity to make it legal on your car registration.
Some have done 400.000km only E85 with non of all the above. just a remap to have E85 fueling right or a E85 Piggy back box for right AFR with E85.

All fueling component can get E85 on any car since 2000. This has been cover a thousand time on E85 conversion forum in France. I did not see one guy in the last 10 year reporting a problem with fuel line from a car made after 2000. Almost no fuel pump damage, injector damage.... I took the injector of my R32 engine out after 90000km with E85 to put bigger one's they looked brand new. I still have those if you want picture.

[gsxr_wrx]

I’d be interested!!!!


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[Brandon K.]

I have searched and there are no E85 stations near me and only 2 or 3 listed online in our metro area of about 2 million people. It is not much of an option around here.


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[Perry01]

I have searched and there are no E85 stations near me and only 2 or 3 listed online in our metro area of about 2 million people. It is not much of an option around here.

I’ve found that an E30 blend made a huge difference in my flex-fuel CPMA motor. I plan to fill four 5 gallon containers with E85 whenever I’m in the city to keep in my garage.

5 gallons of E85 mixed with 14 gallons of premium per fill up should be a good blend.

[Audi 4 Life]

You don't need all that.
I did now 85.000km only 100%E85 on this EA888.2, on My R32 engine before I did 100.000km only E85, on MY FRS/BRZ I did 60.000kmonly E85, without all that.
Non of my car ever see pump gas.
Here in France E85 is so cheap compare to gas ( 2 time cheaper) that many convert their car to 100% E85. Government even agree on that and give the opportunity to make it legal on your car registration.
Some have done 400.000km only E85 with non of all the above. just a remap to have E85 fueling right or a E85 Piggy back box for right AFR with E85.

All fueling component can get E85 on any car since 2000. This has been cover a thousand time on E85 conversion forum in France. I did not see one guy in the last 10 year reporting a problem with fuel line from a car made after 2000. Almost no fuel pump damage, injector damage.... I took the injector of my R32 engine out after 90000km with E85 to put bigger one's they looked brand new. I still have those if you want picture.

Interesting

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[Traptalk]

I didn’t realize that 034 stole iroz motorsport’s lead calibrator... very interesting

How much to have my car custom tuned by nick?

[Busto 77]

Yes!!!!

[bb-tt]

I suggest reading SSP 439. It discusses the changes made to the gas only CDNx engine (Euro version of our CAEx engine) to create the flex fuel CFKA engine. The CFKA was around before the CPMx engines in the NAR B8.5 models. I'm not sure what more or less of the CFKA changes the CPMx incorporated.

But I notice it mention the stronger conrods for the E85 handling. The CAEB changed on May 30 2011 to the stronger rods and larger pins which would carry through the B8.5 CAED/CPMB engines. So if you have stock on a pre-May 30 '11 engine, you might have to give that some thought.

There's also the different, E85 resistant, fuel pump. And details like: "A different material exhibiting higher wear resistance was required for the valve seat rings due to the lower lubricating action of the ethanol."

Damn you smac and your research. now you got me looking for engine manufacture date!