CREC 3.0T water pump failures (yes, plural - as in multiple)

[C-Wrecked]

EDIT: Final outcome/comments in post #12

Hi, yeah I'm super new here but not new to anything having to do with any aspect of any car - my specialty being research.

With that out of the way, would any of you say it's a bit odd to have a water pump failure on a crec 3.0t in a 2016 A6 with less than 30k miles?

I am 2nd owner. Bought it in June from an Audi dealership with 26k miles. Completely out of warranty

First pump replaced under warranty at a whopping 9k miles

I go size up the car - get the list of crap the dealer replaced. All brakes, wonderful. Oil change, great. Go down the list....*tech notes coolant leak* - "thermostat removed and reinstalled"

Ok that one I'm curious of. I visually check the thing until my eyes are blurry. I beat the tar out of it on a test drive. All is good. I can smell the stink of a coolant leak from a mile away. Leave it with the dealer for a week so they can finish prepping it. Go pick it up...before I start my journey home, I linger around the dealership town and drive the car for a good 2 or 3 hours straight, just running it...AC on, AC off, all drive modes, you name it. Basically a 2+ hour test drive. And I OBDeleven'd it. I wasn't leaving the area until I was certain they didn't band-aid fix anything. I live about 2 hrs away, so then I rip it on home. All is good

Now here we are. Maybe a few weeks ago I start smelling it. Can't see anything, level is obviously unchanged but I know it'll show itself soon enough. Maybe if I'm lucky I have a benign trickle from somewhere or one of the expansion tank lines is breaking down. Then the white splatter starts showing up on the front pipe, at first mostly near the thermostat side, then it's obvious that its being flung all around. I can see it's running down the front of the block and sitting on that ridge above the oil pan. I stick my hand in behind the water pump pulley and it's pretty wet.

Anyway, I'm working with the dealer to see if they'll cover it since they laid hands on it last. They pulled the SC off and did something with the t-stat and there is a small leak from that housing as well, but the pump is definitely involved. Hopefully since it was replaced by them less than 20k miles ago, the part will carry its own warranty.

This is not the norm. If this were the first time the pump failed I'd be angry but I'd bite the pillow and take it. Crappy technician work? It is a Florida car and that's where the first pump was replaced. It's not exactly Audi country down there. But still, the dealer up here wouldn't have been able to fleece me on any failed component. I was eyeballing the cooling section hard.

Well, just wanted to tell my story and document it here as MY 16 and 17 C7.5 come into the price range of the many. The water pump is a different part # for CREC engines vs the prior version - probably in the range of MY 13-16 3.0T engines..

Any comments or experiences are welcome. If not I'll continue talking to myself as I get it sorted out.

[gk1]

If not I'll continue talking to myself as I get it sorted out.

LoL.
You are not crazy a water pump failure at 9k miles and again at 26k miles is odd.
The part that would concern me is "*tech notes coolant leak* - "thermostat removed and reinstalled"" to me that does not denote that anything was repaired.
Something like... thermostat was removed, found leaking gasket, replaced gasket, test drove, no signs of leak...sounds more reasonable at least, but to just remove and reinstall the thermostat with no other details seems weak.
Unfortunately a lot of plastics are used in the coolant system and can fail or break during surgery of another part. The crossover pipe between the heads comes to mind and the plastic PCV/oil separator in the valley has coolant running through it on the 3.0T I believe, which can be the source of leaks. You are right in hoping they will cover it since it is such a short time ago, but they may offer only a 1 year 12k mile warranty on work...who knows. Good luck.

[430hps4]

The crossover pipe between the heads comes to mind and the plastic PCV/oil separator in the valley has coolant running through it on the 3.0T I believe, which can be the source of leaks.

I've done 4 PCV/Thermostat jobs in the past year. Each and every one had issues with that crossover pipe being cracked, just inside the thermostat housing.

[C-Wrecked]

Thanks for the comments, these are the exact thoughts going through my head.

I'll give credit where it is due, and will name the dealership and how this transpires when concluded. They were very cool, fair and transparent during the sales process...and now, 3 months later, the car is out of every possible warranty, but they are taking the car, have expressed coverage of the thermostat specifically, are giving me a loaner and will arrange delivery of the car to me since I live a few hrs away. So that's cool.

Now, they were about to just send me into my local dealer since the t-stat is covered under 12k/1 year...not sure if that's for the part that they actually replaced but didn't specifically note, or just the "work" they did on the area. I told the SA that I'm pretty sure the water pump is involved and that there are other known failure points that maybe deserve a look. His response being something like - if you could get the car to me, I think that we can do much more to help than another dealer that isn't familiar with the situation. I really try to not sound too familiar with various platforms when I deal with service people, I don't think they like it and especially in this case where I'm not covered, I need to tread lightly and get as much stuff replaced without running up my bill too much. The fact that I'm hopefully getting labor coverage for access and reassembly of the area is of great assistance.

I almost didn't even want to involve the dealer and just have my own mech who is trusted and a little familiar with the car handle it so I could replace plastic pieces to my heart/wallet's content. But even though he's trusted and throws a slight discount, I know him well enough to know he's not into charity work...he's about his business and his business stays busy, so it's get it in, get it out, get paid, get the next one going. So maybe not quite the attention to detail, but I have intimate knowledge of the work process and ultimate say over everything. I'm nervous about running up a bill with the dealer, but they know damn well that if anything starts leaking again then it's back in their lap.

So we'll see. If they'll be fair and not try to charge repeat labor then I'll change the front pipe too. Not sure how the water pump will shake out. I want to say the PCV system was revised in this motor so I don't know if that smaller line that runs along the valley of the right bank or passenger side head, is a threat anymore. It's the little hose that enters the rear of the t-stat housing where the flared end cracks or the o-ring fails right? I worry about sounding like I know too much or have done too much research for my own good.

I guess if we look on the bright side, it's better to have leaks than part failures. A leaking pump or t-stat is better than failed one.

[Spitfire007]

My 2016 has been through 2 water pumps and 2 thermostats. Second leak also involved a crossover pipe or some part of it. First leak/water pump was around 18k before I owned it, second was within a month of buying it, around 39k....
It's absurd.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[C-Wrecked]

My 2016 has been through 2 water pumps and 2 thermostats. Second leak also involved a crossover pipe or some part of it. First leak/water pump was around 18k before I owned it, second was within a month of buying it, around 39k....
It's absurd.

Well that's just lovely to hear

[5000S]

Well, so much for the newer CREC engine being a better choice than the earlier 3.0T.

[430hps4]

I dont think its a measure of the engine itself, rather the quality of replacement parts used and proper diagnosis of the issue at hand.

[Valpo A7]

I can see 1 pump with early failure because of the lack of 100% quality control. 2 water pumps dieing an early death? The odds of that are against you. If you have a 1 in 1,000 chance of getting a single bad pump then it’s 1 on 1,000,000 of getting 2 bad pumps. I mean it is possible but unlikely. More troubleshooting is needed. A bad pump is more likely a symptom of a problem and not the root cause of the problem.

[wootwoot]

Well, so much for the newer CREC engine being a better choice than the earlier 3.0T.

You're right 1 or 2 bad reviews on a forum and we should write-off all the benefits of Audi's new engine...

[chydog]

my CREC motor had water pump done under cpo warranty at 38 k, they said it was leaking, i was unaware, did stage 2 apr tune/pulley last week all seems ok

[C-Wrecked]

Ok, this episode is wrapped up for now.

Fist of all, I'll give due credit to the dealership. Audi Nyack, downstate NY...this is the little town that connects the jungle to the rest of civilization via Tappan Zee bridge (I'll never refer to that wonderful bridge by the name it was changed to). Relatively small dealer so unfortunately don't carry a huge inventory, but anyone who's down that way and isn't getting treated well by their dealer in the city, if you can make the drive over the bridge I'll vouch for them as a stand up organization.

It turned out to be the water pump. Back in June when I bought the car, after I placed the deposit (having not even seen the car yet except in pics), they said give them a week to go over the car since it was fresh on the lot. See original post for some of the work they did. They found a coolant leak. It was the thermostat. In their notes of what work was done to the car prior to turning it over to me, there was lack of detail regarding the remedy (again, see original post). It turns out they replaced the t-stat with a new unit. I did not know this until I brought the car to them after having a conversation with the SA. I told him it was difficult to tell where exactly the leak was coming from, but I was very sure the water pump was weeping...

Being that they only performed service to the thermostat, which turned out to be completely fine, they were under no obligation to replace the water pump as part of the 12kmi/12mo parts/labor warranty. They replaced it anyway, free of charge...

On the invoice it clearly states that this was a "one-time goodwill" service and that it will not fall under the typical parts and labor warranty, which is fair enough. I got a free water pump replacement on a 100% out-of-warranty car, and they aren't stupid enough to put themselves in a position where they have to fix leak after leak for free. I don't know if they knew it was the water pump prior to digging in, or had to dig in regardless to rule out a t-stat leak...at which point they would be complete dicks if they charged me for the whole thing, so they tossed a "goodwill" fix my way. Either way, it's solid customer service.

So including the original pump, this is # 3. Original was changed between 9-10k miles, this one right at about 31k. I've checked around and this is not the only CREC car to have a very early water pump failure. I saw a Q7 thread where people were mentioning pump failures at 10-20k miles. A select few had a 2nd failure by the time 40-50k rolled around.

For those who are curious, an "H" designation pump was installed, i.e. 06E121018H, which is appropriate...even though the engine has killed 2 already.
I checked the belts, they are not super tight at all.
It's funny that some cars with this variant of the 3.0T have no problems at all...typical cooling parts service lifespan.

I'm a gatherer of information. I'm collecting info on my next car years before I even think of starting to legitimately shop for it. This was the case here...not necessarily for the chassis, but the motor. When it came time to buy, I wanted the larger car, I wanted the ZF8 over the DQ just due to ZF generally being one less thing to worry about, I really liked the facelifted headlights on the 16-17 A6, and as I researched the CREC, I liked the changes but was weary of it being "new" until I realized it's been in Euro S4/5 since 2014 or 2015. I was sold on the multipoint fuel injection. How ironic that in avoiding carbon cleaning (maybe once or twice in a car's life span), I may have to trade that for complete cooling parts refresh every 20kmi lol. I'm a realistic person, and I know there's enough junk engines out there with far worse problems to deal with...let alone an engine such as this, that actually has some balls AND the ability to very easily grow even bigger balls, and not fall apart. If the cooling parts have a short service life in trade for and otherwise solid platform, I can live with that.

My Evo takes up my "service" area in the garage, otherwise I'd be doing these repairs myself. I may try it myself one day. I don't mind digging in, it's the coolant mess I can't stand.

For now I'll just drive the car and watch for the next leak. Big thumbs up for Audi Nyack. They're 2 hours away from me but I'll be a customer of theirs whenever possible. Highly recommend.

Thanks for the comments dudes

[Alabama]

Fist of all, I'll give due credit to the dealership. Audi Nyack, downstate NY...this is the little town that connects the jungle to the rest of civilization via Tappan Zee bridge (I'll never refer to that wonderful bridge by the name it was changed to). Relatively small dealer so unfortunately don't carry a huge inventory, but anyone who's down that way and isn't getting treated well by their dealer in the city, if you can make the drive over the bridge I'll vouch for them as a stand up organization.

For now I'll just drive the car and watch for the next leak. Big thumbs up for Audi Nyack. They're 2 hours away from me but I'll be a customer of theirs whenever possible. Highly recommend.

Interesting to learn about their service department. I've dealt with their parts department and echo your opinions, especially Phil Becker the Wholesale Manager.

[mpressive6]

Well I'm going to add my 2 cents to this thread. I purchased a 2016 A7 prestige with 9k miles period my car now has a little over 33k miles and I've probably had a slight coolant leak for period of time. to be honest it's probably my fault I didn't look at it more closely before now because I would always smell something but then I would look underneath the car and I wouldn't see any evidence of something leaking. The other day one of my accessory belts started making noise and it was from coolant dropping on the belt so I took it to my Indy and he recommended taking it to the nearest dealership because it was definitely leaking coolant.

My car is now at Audi of Rockville and I'm sitting here nervously waiting for a diagnosis that I think will align with the experiences many are mentioning on this thread. I'm really pissed at the moment that my car has so few miles, and it's growing seemingly more apparent that coolant issues have been an issue with the 3.0t engine. My car is out of warranty and I'm waiting to hear back from the dealership. I will report back here once I get the diagnosis. Can anyone provide any suggestions on how I can maybe try to petition for some Goodwill from Audi USA or the dealership considering the low mileage on my vehicle?

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

[mpressive6]

Well I'm going to add my 2 cents to this thread. I purchased a 2016 A7 prestige with 9k miles period my car now has a little over 33k miles and I've probably had a slight coolant leak for period of time. to be honest it's probably my fault I didn't look at it more closely before now because I would always smell something but then I would look underneath the car and I wouldn't see any evidence of something leaking. The other day one of my accessory belts started making noise and it was from coolant dropping on the belt so I took it to my Indy and he recommended taking it to the nearest dealership because it was definitely leaking coolant.

My car is now at Audi of Rockville and I'm sitting here nervously waiting for a diagnosis that I think will align with the experiences many are mentioning on this thread. I'm really pissed at the moment that my car has so few miles, and it's growing seemingly more apparent that coolant issues have been an issue with the 3.0t engine. My car is out of warranty and I'm waiting to hear back from the dealership. I will report back here once I get the diagnosis. Can anyone provide any suggestions on how I can maybe try to petition for some Goodwill from Audi USA or the dealership considering the low mileage on my vehicle?

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

Wanted to provide an update to everyone in this threat. The dealership return to diagnosis and my water pump indeed was the cause of my coolant leak at just under 34k miles. I went back and forth with Audi of USA as well as my dealership because I thought it was just absolutely ridiculous that at 81k car would need a brand new water pump with such low mileage. I'm happy to share that my dealership was willing to work with me and essentially split my bill in half and while they were in there I had them replace my thermostat as well so I'm back on the road and a happy camper. Due to this experience I am more strongly considering purchasing and extended warranty to reduce my future exposure.

Thanks to all who participated in this thread.

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

[2k16A6]

Add me to the list, 2016 A6 3.0T CREC with 33k miles, I've had a faint coolant smell a few times after a hard pull, and this past weekend while changing the oil I noticed that the coolant level in the reservoir was right at the minimum line. I made a mental note to keep an eye on it. Fast forward to today, car is in the shop for APR Stage 2 SP tune, they noticed a small leak from the water pump while installing the new sc belt/pulley.

[Spitfire007]

I understand it's quite common on these cars. I think the water pump was replaced on mine within the first two years of its life (before I bought it).
Mine had a coolant smell right AFTER I bought it. Got diagnosed as water pump and thermostat, they were replaced under original warranty.
Within 30 days, smell came back and a weird sound could be heard on very cold start, like the accessory belt slipping or chirping.
Took it in, and they found a leak in either an o-ring in the coolant crossover pipe, or the pipe itself leaking, I don't remember.
Regardless, this car's been looked at a fair bit for this within its life!
So far so good however.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[shirkin]

If it helps, just had mine replaced @ 27,500 miles. 2017 7.5 A6 3.0T (CREC.) Leaking coolant from the water pump. Would pool on the garage floor every other trip out. Not a huge amount, enough to notice, but not enough to refill for about two weeks at a time.

[mdoli]

Hi all, just another data point for this thread:

Have only owned my 2017 A6 3.0t for ~2 months (currently at 44k mi) but haven’t noticed any slow losses in coolant (I did later find a few drops of coolant in the Audi’s garage spot after this incident). Then as I was leaving work the other evening the dash lit up with a low coolant alarm. Upon inspection I found coolant all over the engine compartment and pooled on the bottom plastic cover. The coolant reservoir was nearly empty. I had the car towed to nearest Audi dealership and they replaced the water pump under warranty the next day. The service advisor said that he doesn’t see this type of replacement often but that it’s not completely unusual. Cost to me was $0. Cost to Audi was ~$500. I asked what it would have been outside of the warranty and was told ~$900.

Honestly as a guy who has turned his own wrenches for years and never owned a car with factory warranty this was a pleasant experience for a fairly catastrophic end to that water pump. I was really surprised that it went so quickly...

MikeIMG_0434.jpg
IMG_0435.jpg
IMG_0436.jpg
IMG_0438.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine Forum