Inspect oil pickup with scope?

[texadelphia]

My car intermittently makes a rattle noise for 2-3 seconds on start up coming from the timing chain area. I replaced the tensioner and chain a few months ago hoping that would fix the problem but it's still happening. So now I'm wondering if the tensioner isn't getting oil pressure quickly enough and if maybe my oil pickup is partially blocked with something like bits of failed cam follower or something. I don't have a place where I can pull the oil pan so I was wondering if I could get my boroscope in through the oil drain hole to inspect the pickup. Just wanted to see if anyone has tried this.

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[Theiceman]

From what I have read the pickup goes right to the floor. So can't see with a scope.
Have you checked your oil.pressure ?.might be a good start.
I think there is some screen sewhere in the timing cover too from what I have read

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[esandes]

Does the sound come from a cold start, hot start or both?

If you turn it off right after running it to normal temperature then turn it on again does it rattle?

[Cyrik]

My car intermittently makes a rattle noise for 2-3 seconds on start up coming from the timing chain area. I replaced the tensioner and chain a few months ago hoping that would fix the problem but it's still happening. So now I'm wondering if the tensioner isn't getting oil pressure quickly enough and if maybe my oil pickup is partially blocked with something like bits of failed cam follower or something. I don't have a place where I can pull the oil pan so I was wondering if I could get my boroscope in through the oil drain hole to inspect the pickup. Just wanted to see if anyone has tried this.

You can always try with your boroscope on the next oil change, however I don't think you have a clogged pickup tube. I had the same issue on my last engine and I'm pretty sure it was because my oil pump was worn out. Had something to do with oil not being able to reach the top of the engine fast enough on start-up.

FWIW I drove it with that issue for like a year and nothing happened, my engine was worn with scored bearings and a bad pump but it still ran with sub-par oil pressure. I think I'd be worth doing an oil pressure test on your car.

[EvolutionArmory]

Oil pressure test, plain and simple. Dont F around. Get a test and proceed from there.

[Kevin C]

Cold start noise can also be from poorly seating check valves in the oil filter adaptor. A check of the oil pressure is a good start, a quick acting gauge will show how quickly you build oil pressure. I'm not sure what the 2.0t has for filter screens in the head, but a clogging screen could also cause problems.

[Plxa4q7]

My car intermittently makes a rattle noise for 2-3 seconds on start up coming from the timing chain area. I replaced the tensioner and chain a few months ago hoping that would fix the problem but it's still happening. So now I'm wondering if the tensioner isn't getting oil pressure quickly enough and if maybe my oil pickup is partially blocked with something like bits of failed cam follower or something. I don't have a place where I can pull the oil pan so I was wondering if I could get my boroscope in through the oil drain hole to inspect the pickup. Just wanted to see if anyone has tried this.

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When you did you tensioner and chain did you replace the three seals for the cam adjuster (the ones on the timing chain cover)? I’ve done the timing chain job on two different cars an both times these carbon seals were done. Any additional leakage out of this seal due to deterioration will result in greater flow demand from the oil pump during start and thus increasing time for oil pressure to build for the tensioner

[texadelphia]

Does the sound come from a cold start, hot start or both?

If you turn it off right after running it to normal temperature then turn it on again does it rattle?

Cold start is more common but it also happens occasionally at temperature for half a second. If I start it within a minute or so of running it doesn't make the noise.

[texadelphia]

Cold start noise can also be from poorly seating check valves in the oil filter adaptor. A check of the oil pressure is a good start, a quick acting gauge will show how quickly you build oil pressure. I'm not sure what the 2.0t has for filter screens in the head, but a clogging screen could also cause problems.

I'm not familiar with the oil filter adapter? The oil filter housing was replaced a year ago.

- - - Updated - - -

When you did you tensioner and chain did you replace the three seals for the cam adjuster (the ones on the timing chain cover)? I’ve done the timing chain job on two different cars an both times these carbon seals were done. Any additional leakage out of this seal due to deterioration will result in greater flow demand from the oil pump during start and thus increasing time for oil pressure to build for the tensioner

I didn't replace the seals because they were still intact.

[texadelphia]

Haven't done an oil pressure test but I have wondered about this. Read it's a PIA trying to hook up a gauge...at least the cheap harbor freight gauge.

[Jayz691]

Haven't done an oil pressure test but I have wondered about this. Read it's a PIA trying to hook up a gauge...at least the cheap harbor freight gauge.

Yeah, better off just getting an oil pressure gauge for the car. I got a prosport one, and works good. $99 for set(with boost gauge) and like $15 for adapter to hook up gauge. That way you can always monitor. Great idea for these cars.0316201456_HDR.jpeg

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[esandes]

If the tensioner and chain aren't getting enough oil, the cam follower would also.

[Theiceman]

Haven't done an oil pressure test but I have wondered about this. Read it's a PIA trying to hook up a gauge...at least the cheap harbor freight gauge.

i can confirm this to be true . my back hurt for a couple of days after , just a lot of leaning and working blind.
also remember your switch is a 10mm thread, the gauge is likely an 1/8 npt . you may need an adapter.

[esandes]

Is there an oil pressure sensor available that can be read with ross tech?

[Cyrik]

Is there an oil pressure sensor available that can be read with ross tech?

Don't think so, oil pressure is purely mechanical on our cars other than the basic switch our cars come with. You'll have to buy a kit.

[texadelphia]

Has anyone installed a P3 vent gauge with an aftermarket oil pressure sensor? If I'm going to drop some money on an oil pressure gauge, I might as well be able to read boost too. I'm assuming there's some sort of adapter that allows you to hook up the stock oil pressure sensor and an aftermarket sensor so that the car doesn't throw a code.

[Theiceman]

Has anyone installed a P3 vent gauge with an aftermarket oil pressure sensor? If I'm going to drop some money on an oil pressure gauge, I might as well be able to read boost too. I'm assuming there's some sort of adapter that allows you to hook up the stock oil pressure sensor and an aftermarket sensor so that the car doesn't throw a code.

yes there is, its called a 42DD relocation kit. it allows a gauge as well as the switch hook up.



im building my own.

to answer the question about vcds reading oil pressure. the answer is no . It would have to be parsed into the data stream as that is what vcds is analysing.

[Jeevan]

mine started doing low rubbing like noise on cold startups below 40F recently. This started after I did Intake valve cleaning. I am not entirely sure if this is caused by bad intake gasket or flapmotor or something. Its hell of a coincidence and yet to diagnose. I will end up replacing tensioner anyways as the car hit 162k miles now.

sound is uneven and not in sync. I can only hear if my drivers window is rolled down and radio is off.

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[texadelphia]

yes there is, its called a 42DD relocation kit. it allows a gauge as well as the switch hook up.



im building my own.

to answer the question about vcds reading oil pressure. the answer is no . It would have to be parsed into the data stream as that is what vcds is analysing.

Came across this DIY.

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...ssure-Read-Out

Unfortunately it doesn't look like 42DD sells that kit anymore. How are you building your own adapter?

ECS sells an adapter to pick up oil pressure at the turbo supply line but I'd prefer to pick it up from the OEM sensor location. I read that there is sometimes a blank port on oil filter housing. Can anyone confirm if this is the case and where it is?

[texadelphia]

mine started doing low rubbing like noise on cold startups below 40F recently. This started after I did Intake valve cleaning. I am not entirely sure if this is caused by bad intake gasket or flapmotor or something. Its hell of a coincidence and yet to diagnose. I will end up replacing tensioner anyways as the car hit 162k miles now.

sound is uneven and not in sync. I can only hear if my drivers window is rolled down and radio is off.

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Here's a video of the cold start. Pay attention to the first 2-3 seconds upon starting:



And here's a video after shutting off the engine and restarting 15 seconds later:

[Older_not_Wiser]

Unfortunately it doesn't look like 42DD sells that kit anymore. How are you building your own adapter?

Might be a few places with it still in stock. Worth a check

https://germanoem.ca/oil-pressure-se...ns-42-022.html

https://e1motorsports.com/products/4...gle%20Shopping

Not sure if they actually have them.

[Cyrik]

Here's a video of the cold start. Pay attention to the first 2-3 seconds upon starting:

Sounded EXACTLY like my old engine. Get an oil pressure test!!

[texadelphia]

Oil pressure gauge will be here Friday.

[Jeevan]

I think you are being paranoid here, first 1 or 2 secs that sound from your video is normal


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[pezgoon]

I was just wondering the same thing (him being paranoid) cause mine does that and has always done it since the 39k I got it at (74k now) I just figured it was a bit of valve train noise until the oil gets to it

I think you are being paranoid here, first 1 or 2 secs that sound from your video is normal


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[texadelphia]

I was just wondering the same thing (him being paranoid) cause mine does that and has always done it since the 39k I got it at (74k now) I just figured it was a bit of valve train noise until the oil gets to it

Mine has also done it for as long as I've had it...so about a year and a half now.

I've gotten different stories as to whether it's a problem. Some people say it's a minor flaw inherent to the engine and nothing to worry about. I've also seen the Audi TSB that says it's a normal noise and that they don't recommend trying to do anything to fix it.
Then other people say it's just Audi covering their ass and it shouldn't be making that noise and that I either have a clogged pick-up or an oil pressure problem.

I can't help but feel like it shouldn't make that noise. But maybe that's just the engineer in me wanting something to work perfectly every time and not make intermittent weird noises. I cringe a little every time I hear it.

[texadelphia]

I totally agree that I could be being paranoid, but this car hasn't give me much reason not to be paranoid.

[Jeevan]

I totally agree that I could be being paranoid, but this car hasn't give me much reason not to be paranoid.

either way, get oil pressure checks on startup and idle to get some closure. I know flushing the engine is terrible idea but you could try it and see if it helps. This can create new problems or solve the problem you have





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[texadelphia]

either way, get oil pressure checks on startup and idle to get some closure. I know flushing the engine is terrible idea but you could try it and see if it helps. This can create new problems or solve the problem you have





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I already have a can of Liqui-Moly Pro-Line engine flush waiting for my next oil change.

[texadelphia]

What about the cam adjuster?

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...solution/page2

Post #46

Maybe I should have replaced the adjuster seals when I did my tensioner.

[Jeevan]

What about the cam adjuster?

https://www.audizine.com/forum/showt...solution/page2

Post #46

Maybe I should have replaced the adjuster seals when I did my tensioner.

doing timing chain without doing adjuster ring is a terrible idea.


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[texadelphia]

doing timing chain without doing adjuster ring is a terrible idea.


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You mean the seals? Yeah, hindsight is 20/20 on that one. They looked to be OK when I had it apart and at the time I was paranoid I was going to break them if I tried to replace them. After all the problems I ran into with that job I really just wanted to get it back together without f'ing anything else up. I suppose it wouldn't be a big deal to get another timing cover gasket and pop it off and replace those.

[esandes]

Yeah I think it's fine. When I do some cold starts it sometimes briefly rattles hard like the engine cover is vibrating against something. I keep the engine cover off but...

It's just a sign of a healthy and robust start.

I lost oil pressure before due to a completely fucked up oil pump. I had a flashing CEL go off when it happened. As some here said, oil pressure is apparently not monitored but if that's true why did I get the flashing CEL?

[esandes]

Maybe check to be sure.

BTW judging by my cam followers there's definitely no oil pressure issue to that area (timing chain housing).

[Theiceman]

Yeah I think it's fine. When I do some cold starts it sometimes briefly rattles hard like the engine cover is vibrating against something. I keep the engine cover off but...

It's just a sign of a healthy and robust start.

I lost oil pressure before due to a completely fucked up oil pump. I had a flashing CEL go off when it happened. As some here said, oil pressure is apparently not monitored but if that's true why did I get the flashing CEL?

oil pressure is monitored via a go /no go ( good or not good ) switch, 1.1 bar, there is no oil pressure "feed" to the ecu so it can constantly measure it.

[oVeRdOsE]

I totally agree that I could be being paranoid, but this car hasn't give me much reason not to be paranoid.

you make me paranoid now. My engine make 10x more funny noise than that ! Mine sounds like a diesel.

But its like this since I bought it, and I ran 45k km without issues.

[esandes]

oil pressure is monitored via a go /no go ( good or not good ) switch, 1.1 bar, there is no oil pressure "feed" to the ecu so it can constantly measure it.

Thanks. A switch does explain that.

[pezgoon]

you make me paranoid now. My engine make 10x more funny noise than that ! Mine sounds like a diesel.

But its like this since I bought it, and I ran 45k km without issues.

That’s semi normal because of the cam follower and the high pressure injectors, it’s mostly the injectors you’re hearing and it’s because it works just like a diesel does so that’s why it sounds like one (injecting at a super high pressure at TDC) although if it’s super loud it can be timing chain issues that’s why I say “semi-normal”

Like you said if it isn’t progressively getting worse over a long period then it isn’t the timing chain, the timing chain progressively gets worse as it gets looser

[oVeRdOsE]

That’s semi normal because of the cam follower and the high pressure injectors, it’s mostly the injectors you’re hearing and it’s because it works just like a diesel does so that’s why it sounds like one (injecting at a super high pressure at TDC) although if it’s super loud it can be timing chain issues that’s why I say “semi-normal”

Like you said if it isn’t progressively getting worse over a long period then it isn’t the timing chain, the timing chain progressively gets worse as it gets looser

also because I removed the PCV and put a cone filter. I did leave the cranck case check valve, and this valve clicking on idle.

[Jeevan]

As you said, did you run flush thru the car to find whats causing this? worn control rings, worn camlobge on hpfp, adjuster or clogged tensioner screen?


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