Clattering in 3.2

[robd88]

2010 Audi Q5 3.2 with 142k miles

I replaced the valve cover gaskets and spark plugs. All went together without issue...so I thought. Upon initial startup there is now a clattering on driver side bank and is very noticeable with the oil cap off.

I towed it to Audi and they said all was ok...no problem found. No codes. No abnormal noise and test drive is ok.

We went to pick it up and while driving it home my wife said it feels heavy and sluggish. My guess is compression is lost in one of those cylinders.

Attached is a video of the noise.https://cloud.tapatalk.com/s/5d367a01...722_201454.mp4

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[SQive]

That kind of sounds like a valve is stuck open, which would also explain a compression loss.

[robd88]

That's what I was thinking too. Is compression test enough to diagnose? Or should the valve cover also be pulled to visually inspect?

Also, is piston damage guaranteed? Or can valve be stuck open enough to not interfere with piston but still cause this noise?

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[SQive]

A compressdion test will tell you which cilynder to look at, but you'll still need to pull the valve cover to really diagnose it.
I'm sure the piston is damaged, but whether you continue to use it or not is your call, although probably not advised.

[robd88]

Assuming camshaft lobe is damaged, possibly rocker arm, valve, piston.....what can I expect for repair costs at a dealer vs independent shop?


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[robd88]

Is it possible to have a stuck valve and not throw any codes or check engine light?

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[A U D I]

Is it possible to have a stuck valve and not throw any codes or check engine light?

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Not really.

I’m also not hearing what is a “stuck valve”. The engine would be running terrible all the time. The sound clip to me sounded normal, however after throttling the motor. I would double check over your valve cover work to see if something was damaged or not connected properly to start. I do think you might be over thinking this unless you dropped something into the motor that can be causing a issue. Try not to think the worst or mechanical problems because you just did the valve covers and spark plugs.
Also, did you use the factory spec plugs ? Or which ones did you use ?

[robd88]

I went back to my dealer today and after speaking with the technician at Audi, I had him listen to the sound as well and he said it was normal. He also said that during the time it took me to do the work, the oil drained down in the pan so it may have taken longer to get up to the top during the initial startup. And if a valve was stuck open with no compression, the engine would be shaking and the check engine light and/or codes would be seen.

I think I was trying to listen for any little abnormal sound during initial startup and got caught up in any sound at all. I took pictures throughout the process and did not remember anything broken or missing. Surprisingly no plastic connectors were broken either. It all went back together well.

For the plugs and the gaskets parts, I bought them at my local dealer. I prefer to use OEM dealer parts as I justify the higher cost because I do the work myself and save on the labor.

Thanks for everyone's input on this.

[SQive]

I swear. . .you could take an Audi into the dealer not running at all and they would say "that's normal." Over 99% of the time, that's the dealership's answer to every problem that comes through the door. That goes up to 100% if it might possibly be a warranty item.

[robd88]

Most likely I'll still pull the cover to visually inspect at a minimum. Then a compression test depending on what I see in the valvetrain.

And if anyone with a 3.2 is willing to post a video or audio recording of the engine running with the oil cap off for a comparison that would provide another data point of "normal".

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[A U D I]

I swear. . .you could take an Audi into the dealer not running at all and they would say "that's normal." Over 99% of the time, that's the dealership's answer to every problem that comes through the door. That goes up to 100% if it might possibly be a warranty item.

Lol. Funny although too many times true depending on the level of techs.

[robd88]

Or if anyone with a 3.2 Q5 can comment on the sound in my video. Is it similar to the sound in your Q5 3.2?

I would appreciate any feedback.

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[SQive]

Or if anyone with a 3.2 Q5 can comment on the sound in my video. Is it similar to the sound in your Q5 3.2?

I would appreciate any feedback.

I don't care what engine in what car. . .that sound is not normal, and sounds pretty bad if I'm honest.
Shame on them for giving you the brush-off, but it's what I've come to expect from my local Audi dealership as well.

[robd88]

If someone with a Q5 3.2 is willing to listen to their engine running with the oil cap off and verify if it does or does not make the same noise, that would be helpful and appreciated. Anyone??

[robd88]

While I agree that the sound does not sound normal, I cannot say with certainty that it is abnormal as I did not record the sound prior to servicing the vehicle. How many of us have actually did this ever? When you fill the engine with oil, the engine is usually off. The cap goes back on and the engine is started. Who keeps the cap off and starts the engine? Probably not many if any at all. So let's approach this as a matter of fact, and not opinion. I'm guilty myself, but trying to change my approach towards fact finding.

[arjun90]

This comment made my day, LOL ROFL

It's so true


Edit: Heck, Audi recommends their customers to change oil "at least" once a year or every "10,000" miles

Guess what? We (us Audizine members) change the oil every 5,000 miles for the obvious reasons

I swear. . .you could take an Audi into the dealer not running at all and they would say "that's normal." Over 99% of the time, that's the dealership's answer to every problem that comes through the door. That goes up to 100% if it might possibly be a warranty item.

[robd88]

Anyone with a 3.2 Q5 willing to check their engine running with oil cap off to compare to the sound in my video?

[A U D I]

Anyone with a 3.2 Q5 willing to check their engine running with oil cap off to compare to the sound in my video?

My opinion I gave was actually based on knowing these 3.2 motors well. It sounds okay to me and the parts you used does not make concerned. Maybe you want to check the spark plug gaps on that side of the motor in case you bumped one and closed the gap some ? Let us know if you find anything else

[m3ma420]

Sent you a PM a few days ago. Here's a video of normal 2012 Q5 3.2 engine noise, with oil filler cap removed, etc. Knock on wood, but our car has been running strong since Day 1 -- looks, feels and drives like new... 80K miles. I wind it up through 4th gear a few times a week on a quiet freeway and to date no signs of carbon buildup, etc.

Good luck.

[SQive]

Sent you a PM a few days ago. Here's a video of normal 2012 Q5 3.2 engine noise, with oil filler cap removed, etc. Knock on wood, but our car has been running strong since Day 1 -- looks, feels and drives like new... 80K miles. I wind it up through 4th gear a few times a week on a quiet freeway and to date no signs of carbon buildup, etc.

Good luck.

Yeah, that's normal injector noise.

[robd88]

Thanks for posting the video! I just received the PM that you were planning on sending me a video, but I never got it. I still haven't had a chance to get in there again...too busy with work and family stuff. I'll post back once I do. The direct injectors sure make a loud noise, but it doesn't sound like you have the same noise I'm hearing on mine with the oil cap off.

If there was/is scoring on the camshaft or lifter, what should I look for or should expect to see?

[Turbo510]

Yeah, that's normal injector noise.

From my limited experience, the direct-injection motors just make more noise. We've got a 3.2 Q5, and a 3.0 A4. The A4 with 215,000 miles ticks over much quieter than the Q5 with 120K. My guess is that you never really listened that close until after changing the VCGs and thought it was abnormal.

[robd88]

From my limited experience, the direct-injection motors just make more noise. We've got a 3.2 Q5, and a 3.0 A4. The A4 with 215,000 miles ticks over much quieter than the Q5 with 120K. My guess is that you never really listened that close until after changing the VCGs and thought it was abnormal.

That's what I'm still thinking. Did you listen to the video I posted in my original post #1? That clattering noise has me guessing if it's normal. I still feel I should get in there and check it out. I'll have time this weekend.

[m3ma420]

That's what I'm still thinking. Did you listen to the video I posted in my original post #1? That clattering noise has me guessing if it's normal. I still feel I should get in there and check it out. I'll have time this weekend.

When you pop the oil cap something sounds off -- valve not seating just right, etc.?

Good luck -- keep us 3.2ers posted.

[robd88]

I've got the cover off now and inspecting. The only thing I can see is a very slight mark on the exhaust cam lobe on the front driver side. The plugs look good...all even carbon burn since the recent change.

The marks on the cam lobe cannot be felt with my nail.

Any feedback? Ideas?20190803_094458.jpeg

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[A U D I]

The marks are normal wear marks. Nothing to be concerned about. Did you find anything else odd ?

[robd88]

I see nothing else. All springs look good and not broken. No mysterious parts or fragments. There is a good gap between the cam position follower and the sensor...no interference.

Not sure what else I can do besides put it back together and consider it all normal.

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[A U D I]

I see nothing else. All springs look good and not broken. No mysterious parts or fragments. There is a good gap between the cam position follower and the sensor...no interference.

Not sure what else I can do besides put it back together and consider it all normal.

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See if your noise is still the same after you do reassemble it.

[robd88]

See if your noise is still the same after you do reassemble it.

I just put it all back together and the noise is the same.

I really wish I checked this noise before I started any work at all. But lesson learned for the next time.

Thanks for your help...I appreciate it.

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[SQive]

I wonder if this could have anything to do with the cam stepper. These engines use Audi's version of VVT, where the cams can shift forward or back to a diferent cam lobe. Can you setup an oil damn on the bottom edge of the head and check it while running?

[robd88]

I thought about the VVT too when it was apart. None of the cam areas of contact looked worn and the cam followers the VVT uses looked fine too. How does the VVT work? Does it shift the cam at a certain high rpm to change the intake valve lift timing?

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[robd88]

Here is a better video of the noise if anyone is interested.

https://youtu.be/dIl84qoRk7U

[Audifahren11]

I have a 2011 Q5 with 3.2L engine as well, it has 135k miles. I recently switched to Mobil One 0w40 euro spec oil, and the engine started to burn a little oil as it was lighter than the 5w40 Castrol Synthetic. I found it to be half quart low on oil after driving about 3k miles. When I went to fill the oil level back up, I removed the fill cap while it was running and noticed loud ticking, like yours. After I topped it off it seemed a little less noisy.
What type of oil are you using? Do you fill it all the way up to the tippy top? Do you use the dipstick or the MMI sensor to check oil level?

Also about 15k miles back, my car threw a misfire cylinder 1 code. I replaced the plug and coil. Code came back the next day. Bummer. I did some research and found that most Direct Injection engines run the fuel lines at a very high pressure. It is critical that the injectors are clean. I ran some Techron fuel injection cleaner, cleared the code. Code has not come back since. Woot woot. I put a bottle of Techron in the tank once every three months. If you search Youtube for "Loud fuel injectors" you will find a few videos covering the subject. These direct injection engines seem to be known for loud injectors across lots of different brands.

Sorry for the rambling post, hope you get it fixed soon!

[robd88]

I have a 2011 Q5 with 3.2L engine as well, it has 135k miles. I recently switched to Mobil One 0w40 euro spec oil, and the engine started to burn a little oil as it was lighter than the 5w40 Castrol Synthetic. I found it to be half quart low on oil after driving about 3k miles. When I went to fill the oil level back up, I removed the fill cap while it was running and noticed loud ticking, like yours. After I topped it off it seemed a little less noisy.
What type of oil are you using? Do you fill it all the way up to the tippy top? Do you use the dipstick or the MMI sensor to check oil level?

Also about 15k miles back, my car threw a misfire cylinder 1 code. I replaced the plug and coil. Code came back the next day. Bummer. I did some research and found that most Direct Injection engines run the fuel lines at a very high pressure. It is critical that the injectors are clean. I ran some Techron fuel injection cleaner, cleared the code. Code has not come back since. Woot woot. I put a bottle of Techron in the tank once every three months. If you search Youtube for "Loud fuel injectors" you will find a few videos covering the subject. These direct injection engines seem to be known for loud injectors across lots of different brands.

Sorry for the rambling post, hope you get it fixed soon!

I just changed the oil before replacing the valve cover gaskets and spark plugs. I usually use Mobil 1 or Castrol but this time I used Pennzoil Platinum Euro 0W-40. It runs smooth, no vibration, just this noise when removing the oil cap. I'm still not convinced there is something wrong aside from my opinion that it is just not sounding right. I use the MMI to check the oil level and always have checked it that way. After the recent oil change I put in 6.5 quarts and it showed full.

Would it be possible for you to post a video of your 3.2 running with the oil cap off? I'd like to listen to the noise yours makes as a comparison.

[A U D I]

FYI
0w-40 is not lighter then 5w-40. It’s just the cold fluid flow ability.

The 3.2 oil change should be at 7 quarts. If you only put back in 6.5 you might want to be draining it longer or pumping more out. Penzoli Euro got good level ratings also.

[robd88]

FYI
0w-40 is not lighter then 5w-40. It’s just the cold fluid flow ability.

The 3.2 oil change should be at 7 quarts. If you only put back in 6.5 you might want to be draining it longer or pumping more out. Penzoli Euro got good level ratings also.

I put in 6.5 because I overfilled it once and I'm not gonna go through that again. It burns about 3 quarts every 10k miles anyways so I'm always checking the level and adding as needed to keep it in the correct range on the MMI.

[Audifahren11]

I just changed the oil before replacing the valve cover gaskets and spark plugs. I usually use Mobil 1 or Castrol but this time I used Pennzoil Platinum Euro 0W-40. It runs smooth, no vibration, just this noise when removing the oil cap. I'm still not convinced there is something wrong aside from my opinion that it is just not sounding right. I use the MMI to check the oil level and always have checked it that way. After the recent oil change I put in 6.5 quarts and it showed full.

Would it be possible for you to post a video of your 3.2 running with the oil cap off? I'd like to listen to the noise yours makes as a comparison.

Here is a video- https://youtu.be/TV8HaCM5aYA

[robd88]

Here is a video- https://youtu.be/TV8HaCM5aYA

Thank you! I can hear the same noise. Another data point for normal.

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