2016 Allroad-too much body roll.fix?

[bstroud]

love the car but too much roll into corners for the mountains.
Also have A3 cab s-line quattro and SQ5. not so much roll.

Stay bars?
Springs?

Thanks

[darbyfam]

I have an S3 and a TTS and found my Allroad floated like a boat. I purchased a set of ST Coilovers and find it to be one of the best riding cars i have driven. The ride is firm but not stiff and the suspension is compliant enough to make it a really good daily driver.

There is allot of posts about which ST kit works and which don't. I purchased this set: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1. I also purchased a set of the 30mm spacers for the rear.

Hope it helps.

[B6_Dolphin]

love the car but too much roll into corners for the mountains.
Also have A3 cab s-line quattro and SQ5. not so much roll.

Stay bars? Nope.
Springs?Nope

Thanks

It's your tires. Very early in the ownership of my '15 AR, I picked up some takeoffs - 20" S7 Black Optic wheels w/Yoko Advan 265/30-20 Summer tires.

The car stuck like glue in the (off-ramp) corners and very little roll. I was shocked, given it has 7" of ground clearance, I was expecting it to roll due to a higher COG.

Fast-forward to a few months ago, and the tires needed replacing after 35k miles. I switched to Conti DSW 06s, and the Conti sidewalls are much more compliant (it's the wife's daily transport, so she was happier with the Contis). Apparently, the Advans had 2 plys in the sidewall vs one in the Contis.

[COar]

20" wheels and low profile tires are going to kill any offroad utility the AR has. Aka the reason I bought it. I have DWS06s on the stock 18" wheels and the car definitely leans. Not terribly, but feels like it's more than just tire.

I think a sway bar would minimize roll and generally maintain ride comfort. That's how it worked on my last car, sway bar took care of, say 75%, of the body roll. Bilstein B8s completely eliminated body roll but the ride quality was terrible on everything but smooth roads. Not going down that route with the AR.

[makisupa]

20" wheels and low profile tires are going to kill any offroad utility the AR has. Aka the reason I bought it. I have DWS06s on the stock 18" wheels and the car definitely leans. Not terribly, but feels like it's more than just tire.

I think a sway bar would minimize roll and generally maintain ride comfort. That's how it worked on my last car, sway bar took care of, say 75%, of the body roll. Bilstein B8s completely eliminated body roll but the ride quality was terrible on everything but smooth roads. Not going down that route with the AR.

Upgraded sways and a CR-15 should reduce some of that roll. Top it off with an x-brace and you should be real good.

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[Depthcharge]

I installed an alu kreuz yesterday and it is absolutely worth it and will help with tramlining, body roll, and overall feel for the car.

[COar]

Upgraded sways and a CR-15 should reduce some of that roll. Top it off with an x-brace and you should be real good.

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Both sways or just the rear?

I looked at the CR15 earlier but it was out of stock. That's still the case but it says restock is on 5/6.

[darbyfam]

Neither the CR15 or an X Brace will prevent body roll. They are both designed to reduce flex in the chassis, which I would suggest that the B8.5 chassis doesn't have enough flex for anyone to notice the addition of stiffness on those attachment points.

You could try doing one sway bar at a time and see how it feels. But realize that only upgrading one will have an effect on the handling balance of the car. Whether you notice the difference or not will depend on how you drive.

[treginginco]

I installed an alu kreuz yesterday and it is absolutely worth it and will help with tramlining, body roll, and overall feel for the car.

^^^^^^^^^^^ WHAT HE SAID ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[darbyfam]

The only way to prevent body roll is to control weight transfer. Connecting the shock towers to each other (CR15) or connecting the lower subframe mounting points (Aul Creuz) does not prevent the transfer of weight. They simply add to the rigidity of the frame. You might feel the steering is more precise, but you will absolutely NOT feel any decrease in body roll. Not saying you shouldn't purchase them, just saying you shouldn't purchase either if your intent is to prevent body roll.

The only way you are going to prevent roll is through shocks, springs, or sway bars - all of which control weight transfer.

[makisupa]

The only way to prevent body roll is to control weight transfer. Connecting the shock towers to each other (CR15) or connecting the lower subframe mounting points (Aul Creuz) does not prevent the transfer of weight. They simply add to the rigidity of the frame. You might feel the steering is more precise, but you will absolutely NOT feel any decrease in body roll. Not saying you shouldn't purchase them, just saying you shouldn't purchase either if your intent is to prevent body roll.

The only way you are going to prevent roll is through shocks, springs, or sway bars - all of which control weight transfer.

I agree with everything you've said. The first mod I did to my AR was a CR15 and you most certainly could feel a difference. It felt a little more planted, but did not reduce body roll.

My suggestions were merely to help garner that rigid, stiffer response he may be looking for. Because, as you stated, the only true way to get these wagons to be more responsive and reduce that roll is upgrading many of those suspension components. They all work in harmony together, even down to the tires.

My current set up:

Hotchkis front and rear sways
034 end links
CR15
034 x brace
SPC adjustable control arms
Airlift 3P w/performance struts on all 4 corners
Riding on MPSSs

This has significantly reduced that roll and she feels like she's on rails now. Reminds me of my old Golf R.

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[bstroud]

Thanks to all for the good info.

Car came with stock 18x8 wheels.
Thinking larger wider wheels might help reduce dipping?
Any other ideas?

Great forum.

Stroud

[darbyfam]

The wheels will not prevent body roll. The smaller profile tires might make the car feel more "planted", but it's not going to reduce weight transfer.

I am only suggesting these things to prevent you from spending money and being disappointed. I agree with makisuppa that it's a package thing to make an allroad feel "right" (to me anyway).

I found the issue with the allroad being more that it "floated" rather than the issue with body roll. I first did ST coilovers, then wheels and tires. To me, the car now feels perfect for a daily driver, with some spirited trips to work now and then. It's firm but not harsh at all and the shock/springs are perfect for the weight of the car. I have not done sway bars or any other body stiffening mods and I don't think I will (as I don't think I need to for my use).

To me, my Allroad feels better than my S3 or my TTS. The S3 has EMD springs on stock shocks and sway bars. To me, that car suffers from under damping and needs a good set of shocks to feel right. To TTS is the wife's and the suspension is all stock. The wheel base on that car is it's comfort downfall IMHO.

[bstroud]

The wheels will not prevent body roll. The smaller profile tires might make the car feel more "planted", but it's not going to reduce weight transfer.

I am only suggesting these things to prevent you from spending money and being disappointed. I agree with makisuppa that it's a package thing to make an allroad feel "right" (to me anyway).

I found the issue with the allroad being more that it "floated" rather than the issue with body roll. I first did ST coilovers, then wheels and tires. To me, the car now feels perfect for a daily driver, with some spirited trips to work now and then. It's firm but not harsh at all and the shock/springs are perfect for the weight of the car. I have not done sway bars or any other body stiffening mods and I don't think I will (as I don't think I need to for my use).

To me, my Allroad feels better than my S3 or my TTS. The S3 has EMD springs on stock shocks and sway bars. To me, that car suffers from under damping and needs a good set of shocks to feel right. To TTS is the wife's and the suspension is all stock. The wheel base on that car is it's comfort downfall IMHO.

Thanks for the honest advice.
Do you mean coilovers and springs?
Probably going for larger wheels and tires. Just like the look.

Bstroud

[JLAllroad]

The question is on road vs off road use. Stock height vs lowered.

Off road-new shocks (for stock height) Bilsteins? Stock, as others have mentioned, the car is under dampened, this will reduce some of the roll. I would not upgrade your sways for “off road” as it limits suspension articulation. My car at 26.5 on coils with an 034 RSB picks the inside rear wheel off the ground entering my relatively steep driveway at an angle.

Another note on sways and body roll. You will notice a huge difference by just adding the rear, but, if you want to eliminate most of the roll “feel” you will want the front as well. This is not necessarily the best for all out handling (on a track) as it increases understeer, but gives a “controlled feel” for a street driven car.

Wheels & tires....you could also get away with a 19” wheel which would reduce some of the sidewall flex and give you some of the look. Anything larger and you will want shock adjustability to dial out the harshness of the shorter sidewalls aside from the fear of damaging them off pavement.

Just know that the Allroad at stock height has 8.1” of ground clearance, lowering an inch and a half, as many do, still gets you the ground clearance of a stock A4, which isn’t low and has the potential of reducing body roll.


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[darbyfam]

You could do a shock and spring combination or go with a coilover set. I went with the ST coilovers because they were budget conscience and had the only featured I wanted. I wasn't looking for rebound or compression adjustment, just wanted a nice shock and a well-matched springs. You can get the ST coilovers cheap on Amazon. These are the ones I purchased: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1.

I agree on the larger diameter rims and smaller profile tire for looks and handling.

This is my Allroad

[bstroud]

Thanks for the info. I will check it out.
Your AR is a looker. Wheels look great. I am looking for Audi 8T0601025DG but hard to find like new.

I see that you made quite a few other upgrades as well.
Have you improved the lower end torque?

My wife thought it was a station wagon and gave me grief before I bought it.
Now she loves it. Go figure!

Stroud

[beantownb8.5]

love the car but too much roll into corners for the mountains.
Also have A3 cab s-line quattro and SQ5. not so much roll.

Stay bars?
Springs?

Thanks

my advice-









dont buy a station wagon to take corners on a mountain?

[darbyfam]

Thanks for the info. I will check it out.
Your AR is a looker. Wheels look great. I am looking for Audi 8T0601025DG but hard to find like new.

I see that you made quite a few other upgrades as well.
Have you improved the lower end torque?

My wife thought it was a station wagon and gave me grief before I bought it.
Now she loves it. Go figure!

Stroud

I get allot of grief from my wife about the "wagon". I have typically owned very sporty cars (Porsche Cayman with 3.8 swap, Audi S4, the S3, M3, etc). She thinks this one is quite out of character for me :).

The mods I have done made a huge difference in the car. Going Stage 2 is a big bang for the relatively little work it takes to get there. The only "downside" to the car now is the transmission. Used to a DSG or PDK type and this one feels sluggish compared to them. BUT, as a daily driver it's a great vehicle.

[bstroud]

I have a long background with fast cars. Ferrari Daytona (wife loved it until she tried to push the clutch down).
Ferrari 365GTB. Porsche 60SC, 911 Targa, Macan.
Lotus Elite and Elan.
Maseratti.
MB 1990 500E AMG. Was my wife's car.
4 MB SL. Several other MB.
Many Audi but the SQ5 is my wife's car now.
I'm keeping the Allroad for me.
We share the A3 cab Quattro.

Live in the mountains of NM. Love to drive fast.

Surprised by the AR speed and comfort. Just the performance and handling is not what I am used to.

Thanks to your help, I will improve it.

Bstroud

[kvitrafn]

Reading thread with interest, as I just went from a 2010 A4 avant to a 2015 Allroad. Both 2.0t quattro s-tronics.

The avant was on the 1BE intermediate sport suspension (20 mm; S-line in the US) and while I liked the handling and ride height, the ride itself was not that great.

The Allroad rides pretty well, but the handling is surprisingly poor. I just want my all weather interceptor back, the avant was excellent at maintaining a nice clean curve on a tired bumpy and off camber road. You'd think that the extra suspension travel would be a bonus here, in stead the Allroad needs to be steered precisely and digs into cambers and ruts I didn't even notice before. (yes, I have a cabin in the mountains and I may enjoy driving back and forth at speed).

So far, the recommendations have been ST coilovers and Hotchkiss bars. Has anyone looked into oem parts? I noticed axle weights are quite similar between the avant and Allroad (30 lbs more in the front of the Allroad) so which stock sways can we use to get more stability and a proper balance front to rear?

I think I have bought a project... ;)

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[bstroud]

Reading thread with interest, as I just went from a 2010 A4 avant to a 2015 Allroad. Both 2.0t quattro s-tronics.

The avant was on the 1BE intermediate sport suspension (20 mm; S-line in the US) and while I liked the handling and ride height, the ride itself was not that great.

The Allroad rides pretty well, but the handling is surprisingly poor. I just want my all weather interceptor back, the avant was excellent at maintaining a nice clean curve on a tired bumpy and off camber road. You'd think that the extra suspension travel would be a bonus here, in stead the Allroad needs to be steered precisely and digs into cambers and ruts I didn't even notice before. (yes, I have a cabin in the mountains and I may enjoy driving back and forth at speed).

So far, the recommendations have been ST coilovers and Hotchkiss bars. Has anyone looked into oem parts? I noticed axle weights are quite similar between the avant and Allroad (30 lbs more in the front of the Allroad) so which stock sways can we use to get more stability and a proper balance front to rear?

I think I have bought a project... ;)

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I think a "project" is an understatement.
Would have bought a new AR but can't stand the MMI screen on the dash and don't like the look as well.
I would like to stick with OEM also. Always had no problems that way.
Handling and more low end Torque will be my first pursuits.
There must be an OEM suspension solution.
One of my friends is Service Manager at Audi in PHX. I will ask him and let you know what I find out.

B Stroud