Sound Deadening

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Hey guys,

Has anyone compare the benefits, in terms of road noise reduction, between doing the doors rather than floors of our cars?

I did trunk when installing subwoofer. Now I want to start with the cabin. Seems doors should be easy, but is that where the big benefits are?

Anyone use SoundSkin for doors?


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[OlyS6]

From my limited personal experience, I can tell you that I did the doors a few weeks after I did the floors. The floors were super painful, as the entire interior had to come out, but was a huge help in decreasing road noise, especially from the front wheel wells (with sound deadening behind the kick panels and all the way up to the glove box on the passenger side, and as far as I could get it above the pedals on the drivers side). That said, adding soundskins to the doors helped immensely in terms of lessening traffic noise. I placed sound skins on the interior portion of each of the door-cards, as well as against the outer shell of the door (wherever I could reach). Kind of cool, because now you can hardly hear any exterior traffic.
I've not done the roof liner.

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

From my limited personal experience, I can tell you that I did the doors a few weeks after I did the floors. The floors were super painful, as the entire interior had to come out, but was a huge help in decreasing road noise, especially from the front wheel wells (with sound deadening behind the kick panels and all the way up to the glove box on the passenger side, and as far as I could get it above the pedals on the drivers side). That said, adding soundskins to the doors helped immensely in terms of lessening traffic noise. I placed sound skins on the interior portion of each of the door-cards, as well as against the outer shell of the door (wherever I could reach). Kind of cool, because now you can hardly hear any exterior traffic.
I've not done the roof liner.

OlyS6 - thanks for the response!! Seems you’ve done everything I’ve considered.

I take it that the doors really aren’t more than an hour each AND that the benefits are huge; hence, it sound like a good use of “spare” time.

I’ll order-up the SS door package. Floors on the other hand, will wait.


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[subterFUSE]

Sound dampening by itself does nothing for reducing road noise. It is for preventing panel resonances that might occur from running a subwoofer.

If you are trying to reduce road noise inside the cabin, the ONLY product that works is mass loaded vinyl with a layer of closed cell foam under it.

You will have to remove all of your seats and all of the floor carpet to do the MLV + CCF option. It will take many hours of labor to be done correctly.



I suggest you read this website, which has some of the best information available on the subject of noise reduction in cars.


https://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/

[OlyS6]

Sound dampening by itself does nothing for reducing road noise. It is for preventing panel resonances that might occur from running a subwoofer.

If you are trying to reduce road noise inside the cabin, the ONLY product that works is mass loaded vinyl with a layer of closed cell foam under it.

You will have to remove all of your seats and all of the floor carpet to do the MLV + CCF option. It will take many hours of labor to be done correctly.



I suggest you read this website, which has some of the best information available on the subject of noise reduction in cars.


https://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/

I did exactly that for the floors, with CLD tiles, CCF, and MLV, after removing the entire interior of the car. Huge PITA. MLV is horrible to work with. All were obtained from sound deadener showdown.
I can assure you that there was a significant decrease in environmental noise after using soundskins in the doors as well. It uses a triple layer of butyl rubber, aluminum, and CCF, and is very easy to work with.


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[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Thanks for the comments guys... Doors first -- then (MAYBE) I'll consider floor!

I'm doing this largely to minimize road noise; and, I expect a very modest improvement in sound quality as well. I tested the tire noise/overall sound in my car again today at only 45 MPH and I'm averaging MORE THAN 70DB. When I first got the car and had NEW winter tires on it, sound was measuring around 60-63 DB at around 50 MPH. When I later swapped to the stock summer wheels and tires, it was measuring very much the same as the winter set-up (summer wheels/tires only had 200 miles on them as I only drove the car for two days after purchasing it before my winter gear as delivered) (Thanks to Tire Rack!)...

Once the front doors are done, I'll measure DB levels on same road to see if there's a measurable difference with just that change. I'll also measure once I swap back to winter wheels/tires too. All of this is clearly unscientific, but slightly more helpful than pure speculation.

Second Skin has a MLV product w/foam fused to it; LuxuryLiner pro if I recall correctly. If I look into the doing floor, I may go that route, but WOW what an effort that would be. I did my trunk, rear wheel wells and deck with MLV, CCF, and H-66 cement from Sounddeadenershowdown.com, and it was a PITA. As I get older, I'm looking for more efficient (or EASY) processes because "spare" time is so, super limited.

[subterFUSE]

Doors are not the problem. It's the tire wells. Unless you do a full, single piece layer of mass loaded vinyl on the entire floor of the car, floated with a layer of closed cell foam, you will get almost no road noise reduction.

Just being perfectly honest, but if you want a quiet car.... buy a Mercedes S class. That's what I did. ;)

[digdah]

Doors are not the problem. It's the tire wells. Unless you do a full, single piece layer of mass loaded vinyl on the entire floor of the car, floated with a layer of closed cell foam, you will get almost no road noise reduction.

Just being perfectly honest, but if you want a quiet car.... buy a Mercedes S class. That's what I did. ;)

That car (s class) is so quiet inside. Almost unreal. It just not fit me right now. I need to be about 10 years older

[subterFUSE]

That car (s class) is so quiet inside. Almost unreal. It just not fit me right now. I need to be about 10 years older

I got an S63 AMG with performance package. Top speed 186 mph. The only noise you hear is the whistle of the turbos. Half the time I think a cop is trying to pull me over, but it's just the turbos.

[digdah]

I got an S63 AMG with performance package. Top speed 186 mph. The only noise you hear is the whistle of the turbos. Half the time I think a cop is trying to pull me over, but it's just the turbos.

That's one hell of a machine! And it looks the part as well. My neighbors would hate me though.

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Doors are not the problem. It's the tire wells. Unless you do a full, single piece layer of mass loaded vinyl on the entire floor of the car, floated with a layer of closed cell foam, you will get almost no road noise reduction.

Just being perfectly honest, but if you want a quiet car.... buy a Mercedes S class. That's what I did. ;)

Thanks for the comments subterFUSE.

• I'm curious if you agree that doing SoundSkin throughout the front door will likely improve audio and, as a result, even if it doesn't combat tire noise, the effort wont be "wasting money."

• I'm also curious if you think lining the wheel wells (on the back, or interior facing side) would be helpful. That seems very easy compared to removing the entire interior of the car... And, i could do it when swapping to winter wheels/tires.

As always, thoughts are appreciated!!

[subterFUSE]

Thanks for the comments subterFUSE.

• I'm curious if you agree that doing SoundSkin throughout the front door will likely improve audio and, as a result, even if it doesn't combat tire noise, the effort wont be "wasting money."

• I'm also curious if you think lining the wheel wells (on the back, or interior facing side) would be helpful. That seems very easy compared to removing the entire interior of the car... And, i could do it when swapping to winter wheels/tires.

As always, thoughts are appreciated!!

Yes, SoundSkin will help the audio performance because it dampens resonances in the door. You only need about 25% coverage of the metal surface to get almost maximal benefit. Covering every inch is overkill and a waste of material. Make sure not to cover any factory wires or cables because you want the car to still be serviceable.


There is not much benefit to attempting to treat the tire wells without treating the rest of the floor. Sound will always find the holes in the barrier and go around it. That's why they say you need to seal the mass loaded vinyl into a single large piece for the entire floor to be covered, because even using 2 pieces of MLV on the floor would lead to sound entering the opening between them. I'm just trying to save you a lot of effort for what would be very minimal, if any, results.

I have no idea if treating the outside of the car in the tire well would do anything. Never heard of anyone trying that.

[subterFUSE]

Now that I own both an Audi S6 and a Mercedes S63, I can honestly tell you that the Mercedes is so much quieter on the road.

Both cars have 20" wheels and very new Michelin Pilot Sport 4S tires on them. The Merc is probably 20 dB less road noise on the highway. The engine noise is louder than the road.



The Audi always has this tire hum on the highway. So annoying. It is highly unlikely that my next car would be an Audi. I'm probably going back to BMW after the S6.

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Now that I own both an Audi S6 and a Mercedes S63, I can honestly tell you that the Mercedes is so much quieter on the road.

Both cars have 20" wheels and very new Michelin Pilot Sport 4S tires on them. The Merc is probably 20 dB less road noise on the highway. The engine noise is louder than the road.



The Audi always has this tire hum on the highway. So annoying. It is highly unlikely that my next car would be an Audi. I'm probably going back to BMW after the S6.

I'd bet that S63 is a sweet ride! FWIW, I have had a few BMWs over the years, and my impression is that my A6 and my wife's Q7 are pretty quiet in comparison. That said, I don't doubt one bit that BENZ is even quieter still.

Taking the lazy path; called local installer and they're doing front doors on Monday. Im just to busy right now to do it. That said, I'll get to the rear doors over the winter, and consider floor in the spring. That seems like a several day ordeal with interior of the car all over the entire garage while I work at it...

[Phantom75]

You want to use sound absorbing material for sound insulation, like a MLV (mass loaded vinyl) not a sound dampening material for vibration used for stereo systems.

You can use a combination of both but you need mass to shield the inside from road noise. MLV work great in the wheel wells, floor boards for that. The sound mat I typically see in the doors and other panels to reduce vibration from music and general vibration within the car. The MLV in the wheel wells makes a HUGE difference in every car. I've done it, and my brother has done this on 3 cars. Its absolutely noticeable. If you want a cocoon though, you would need to the door the floor and the doors as well.

I didn't find my RS7 to be loud at all, other than some tire noise on certain surfaces. I think the wheel wells is where I would start because its easy and guaranteed to help some.

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

You want to use sound absorbing material for sound insulation, like a MLV (mass loaded vinyl) not a sound dampening material for vibration used for stereo systems.

You can use a combination of both but you need mass to shield the inside from road noise. MLV work great in the wheel wells, floor boards for that. The sound mat I typically see in the doors and other panels to reduce vibration from music and general vibration within the car. The MLV in the wheel wells makes a HUGE difference in every car. I've done it, and my brother has done this on 3 cars. Its absolutely noticeable. If you want a cocoon though, you would need to the door the floor and the doors as well.

I didn't find my RS7 to be loud at all, other than some tire noise on certain surfaces. I think the wheel wells is where I would start because its easy and guaranteed to help some.

Thanks for the comment Phantom. Are you saying you and your bro have done MLV in wheel wells; and, if so, do you also use CCF? Which way do you face the CCF?

I could see CCF on the car facing side with MLV stuck to factory wheel well by Velcro possibly working..


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[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Thanks for the comment Phantom. Are you saying you and your bro have done MLV in wheel wells; and, if so, do you also use CCF? Which way do you face the CCF?

I could see CCF on the car facing side with MLV stuck to factory wheel well by Velcro possibly working..


So, I’d take the wheel well line out of the car, Velcro MLV to it and glue CCF to that. Then, I’d put it back together, with the CCF facing toward car and MLV facing tires.

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Hey guys- I’m reviving this thread as I have a nice new roll of SoundSkins ready to go. My front doors were done by an audio installer who did the custom work for my sub, and I’ve noticed a bit more mid out of the front of the system. Also, road noise is now more noticeable from the rear. So, I suspect a bit of benefit in terms or road noise too.

My next steps are (1) remove rear door cards and speakers, (2) Dynamat Extreme at 25-30% coverage on outside door (from inside, of course), and (3) SoundSkins on inside metal portion of the door facing the door card.

If that doesn’t help in the rear with road noise too, I’ll add MLV when doing MLV on the floors..



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[Pabla]

Digging up this old thread, cause I was planning on insulating the doors on my RS7, were you pleased with the final result? What portions of the door did you end up insulating?

[07S6]

Similar topic, so figured i'd ask you sound experts :) Is there anything i could consider to reduce the low rpm exhaust resonance/drone in the cabin. I have an A7 with the AWE Touring and there's more "drone" than i'd like around the dreaded 2K rpm range. I believe the A7 chassis with the open cargo area makes this more noticeable in the cabin. Wasn't sure if lining the trunk floor with something will help muffle some of it. It's glorious once you get to 3K rpm and above!

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Digging up this old thread, cause I was planning on insulating the doors on my RS7, were you pleased with the final result? What portions of the door did you end up insulating?

I was pleased with the results of the doors in that the stereo sounds better and traffic noises seemed to be lessened. That said, I then heard more tire/road noise, particularly at the rear of the car.

I have since done the area beneath the rear seat bench and the side bolsters with a combination of Dynamat, SoundSkin and Luxury Liner (MLV and Foam). This helped noise at the rear tremendously.

If I purchased a C7 again, I’d do the area under rear seat and the side bolsters on day 1. I’d then evaluate trunk (most likely as part of a sub upgrade). Lastly, I’d move to do the doors if warranted. Doing whole “floor” of the car seems like (1) big $$ or (2) huge effort.

The C63 AMG seems like a good option


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[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Similar topic, so figured i'd ask you sound experts :) Is there anything i could consider to reduce the low rpm exhaust resonance/drone in the cabin. I have an A7 with the AWE Touring and there's more "drone" than i'd like around the dreaded 2K rpm range. I believe the A7 chassis with the open cargo area makes this more noticeable in the cabin. Wasn't sure if lining the trunk floor with something will help muffle some of it. It's glorious once you get to 3K rpm and above!

Trunk and seat area may help. But you may need to consider entire floor…. Frankly, after doing trunk, doors and rear seat area, I’m not willing to spend the time to do the whole floor too. Image1674604913.567261.jpg


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[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Trunk and seat area may help. But you may need to consider entire floor…. Frankly, after doing trunk, doors and rear seat area, I’m not willing to spend the time to do the whole floor too. Image1674604913.567261.jpg


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Above is a picture of the Dynamat as a base layer in trunk, SoundSkin on Dynamat on rear seat. And, below is the LLP before cut and install.

Image1674605110.900731.jpg


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[Pabla]

I was pleased with the results of the doors in that the stereo sounds better and traffic noises seemed to be lessened. That said, I then heard more tire/road noise, particularly at the rear of the car.

I have since done the area beneath the rear seat bench and the side bolsters with a combination of Dynamat, SoundSkin and Luxury Liner (MLV and Foam). This helped noise at the rear tremendously.

If I purchased a C7 again, I’d do the area under rear seat and the side bolsters on day 1. I’d then evaluate trunk (most likely as part of a sub upgrade). Lastly, I’d move to do the doors if warranted. Doing whole “floor” of the car seems like (1) big $$ or (2) huge effort.

The C63 AMG seems like a good option


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Excellent! I am taking the door panels off to do a colour ambient light upgrade so I may as well sound insulate them with some Dynamat while at it. Will see how I like the results and go from there

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

Excellent! I am taking the door panels off to do a colour ambient light upgrade so I may as well sound insulate them with some Dynamat while at it. Will see how I like the results and go from there

When doing the doors, consider roughly 25% - 35% of the interior side of the exterior skin to load weight onto the metal so it vibrates less. I’d also consider placing something like SoundSkins Pro on the interior of the door with the “foam” facing the interior of the car. Image1674684479.188380.jpg



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[Pabla]

When doing the doors, consider roughly 25% - 35% of the interior side of the exterior skin to load weight onto the metal so it vibrates less. I’d also consider placing something like SoundSkins Pro on the interior of the door with the “foam” facing the interior of the car. Image1674684479.188380.jpg



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I see some people just do the cavity of the door and then seal that cavity with something like what you've shown above. Is that what you did then?

[JWebb_C7_Comp]

I see some people just do the cavity of the door and then seal that cavity with something like what you've shown above. Is that what you did then?

Yes, I believe so. Just to be clear, I used Dynamat Inside the door cavity on the door skin at about 25-35% of the surface area. Then, between the “door card” and metal skeleton of the door, I used SounsSkins Pro so that the material is stuck to the metal and the foam side is facing toward the door card.

That treatment seemed to do two things: (1) reduce traffic noise and (2) make the sound system’s mids seem tighter and louder w/o adding any buzz or rattles.


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