Basic engine build cost

[unvmy996]

Looking to see what a basic engine build costs to do these days to handle the extra torque from tial 605 reliably .
So for rods , full refresh with gaskets bearings etc , machine work /balancing etc . Stock pistons , a light head port and cams.

Allready have the rods.

[2380S4]

I would venture to guess in the $3K - $4K range... Just depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go... You could spend $8K on this type of project pretty quickly...

[Yuppie]

Reach out to rockcandy about doing a build.

[unvmy996]

Oh I know it can become a slippery slope real quick , with the ... well while your in there .

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Reach out to rockcandy about doing a build.

Is he a member on here? Do you have his contact info

[Schtug]

Mine started out simple, like what you're talking about doing. Hell, it didn't even start as an engine build, it started as a turbo swap and ended up being around $16000 worth of "while I'm in there" and at the end of it I was scratching my head trying to figure out what in the hell I was thinking. Actually about mid way though was when I determined things were out of control, but I had to see it through. If I were going to do it over again I'd get a stock low mileage engine from a wrecking yard, stick a pjk04 setup on it and call it a day.

Best advice I can give you, other than don't do it if you enjoy being financially stable, is to make some phone calls and find a machine shop you can trust, take them the assembled long block, talk to them about what your power goals are and what parts you're thinking about upgrading and let them handle it from there. Supply them whatever parts you want to, pistons, rods, valves, ect., but let them guide you as to what should be done to give you a reliable setup for your intended power level.

[unvmy996]

Yea man I hear ya , I’ve been down that while your in there road also ... lol . My car has 90k on it and everything is up to date.

I’ve seen people talk about the pjko4’s .. I know what ko4’s are but what does the pj stand for?

[Schtug]

Yea man I hear ya , I’ve been down that while your in there road also ... lol . My car has 90k on it and everything is up to date.

I’ve seen people talk about the pjko4’s .. I know what ko4’s are but what does the pj stand for?

Plain Jane K04. OEM Borgwarner, not a chinese made hybrid.

[jballou]

3-4K will not cut it for a "simple Rebuild" unless you use cheap crap and the machine shop just bottle brushes the cylinder walls.

Rods, bearings, gaskets, TB stuff, One Time use Bolts, oil pump, Piston rings, machine work, head work.. Clutch, flywheel, easily 7-8K if not more. So easy to spend a ton of money.

[unvmy996]

Not talking about clutches or turbos or fueling strictly motor .

[jballou]

Yup...

- - - Updated - - -

$12K

[jballou]

Cause I forgot, this is a Honda, not some German car that costs a lot to maintain, so yeah, $3k should do it. Not sure what you are looking for? I have built plenty of motors for people, and without cheaping out, it will cost some money.

[jballou]

Sorry, I didn't mean Honda, I ment a Chebby Tree Fifty... Those are dirt cheap to build... Some Honda motors cost a lot to build...correctly.

[Schtug]

Cause I forgot, this is a Honda, not some German car that costs a lot to maintain, so yeah, $3k should do it. Not sure what you are looking for? I have built plenty of motors for people, and without cheaping out, it will cost some money.

Yupppp, if we’re literally just talking block and heads only I had around $10,000 tied up between parts and labor.

[CELison]

Whatever you figure, add 1-2K to that. I had the motor back in the car and just had "little things" to finish up. That got into the $1500 range quick. Just fittings, lines, fueling components, ect. Built motor, bigger turbos on real fuel is the way to go.

[ElementR]

I did full build (rods, pistons, supertech valvetrain, valve job, etc). I already had an upgraded trans, Tial 605's and supporting fueling/tune/exhaust/induction. Of course, with the engine build, I did the maintenance items as well like timing belt, water pump, all gaskets/seals, new oil pump and a new clutch. I ended up around $8-9k and I did all labor outside of machining the block, balancing the crank and valve job/valvetrain assembly. About $6k of that was parts and rest was the mentioned machine/assembly work. I don't even want to guess at my labor...

So, if you exclude the clutch, deduct $800 and the rest is what you're looking at.

[sxC]

I had a spreadsheet with every part on my build and the $ spent but unfortunately my computer was wiped out by the hurricane in August. From memory, the rough cost of the long block:

Machine Work (hone, crank balance, deck the heads etc.) $500
IE forged rods $1000
JE pistons (83mm) $1000
Coated Main Bearings $200
Thrust Washers $50
ARP Main Studs $200
Raceware head stud kit $200
Supertech valves & Springs $1000
Gaskets (compression-dropping head gasket, cam seals, crank seal front/rear, valve covers etc) $250
2.8 junkyard heads (including cams) from a Passat - $150
SAI delete $100
Heads, hot-tanked, decked, valves installed - $300
Timing belt, water pump, rollers & tensioners - $500
Powder coat oil pan, valve covers, paint block/heads - $400

So roughly $5,800 on just the basic long block. That does not include the engine mounts, turbos, fueling, intake piping, intercoolers, clutch/flywheel, coilpack upgrades, and a TON of other little things you really need to build a solid car... If you haven't already guessed I ended up spending tens of thousands on the total build when you include all the bodywork and suspension.

My advice is don't do the build if you can't afford maybe 3x what you think it will cost. You can do it for cheap but you get what you pay for. Things WILL add up quickly when you do the "while I'm in here" thinking.

[ElementR]

Pulled out my old spreadsheet. For everything you're looking at (again, no turbos, exhaust, fueling, induction, tune, clutch or driveline upgrades), it totals about $4600 without any labor. Note these prices are from a couple years ago and I got some better deals with sales and such, but this ought to give you a good estimate.

I also purchased a used block and heads which I didn't include here. I wanted to build the motor on the side while I still drove my car. If you use yours, no need to add those in. There's probably a couple hundred in little odds and ends that I didn't note as well. Plus consider shipping costs. I think a good estimate in the end is about $5k for parts only. Figure another $2k +/- for machine work. Again, this assumes you are building the engine and R&R'ing it yourself.

Springs/Retainers - $750
Valves - $850
Main Bearings - $150
Rod Bearings - $125
Head Bolts - $125
Main Studs - $200
Turbo Gasket & hardware kit - $75
JHM Head gasket kit - $250
Front and Rear Crank seals - $150
Oil Cooler Seal - $25
Oil Pump - $250
JHM Timing Belt Kit - $275
Misc seals, o-rings, silicone, cam tensioner pads - $150
RPM H Beam Rods - $425
Flywheel & PP bolts, Crank Bolt - $50
Crankcase breather gasket - $50
Mahle Powerpack pistons - $700

[christianb5s4]

Mine started out simple, like what you're talking about doing. Hell, it didn't even start as an engine build, it started as a turbo swap and ended up being around $16000 worth of "while I'm in there" and at the end of it I was scratching my head trying to figure out what in the hell I was thinking. Actually about mid way though was when I determined things were out of control, but I had to see it through. If I were going to do it over again I'd get a stock low mileage engine from a wrecking yard, stick a pjk04 setup on it and call it a day.

That sentence in bold is so true. I spent the following on my build although I'm sure I'm missing some stuff:

- IE Rods: $700
- BEL low mile block/heads: $800
- Machine work: $1,735 (decked/ported/polished heads, hot tanked, block honed, etc.)
- Miscellaneous engine components: ~$3k (OE piston rings, glyco bearings, new oil pump, gaskets, new stock valvetrain, RS4 cams, etc.)

So all in, my long block amounted to a bit over $6.3K. That does not include all the new accessories, aftermarket parts, hoses, lines, supporting mods, etc. that will be at least the cost of the long block if not more. I only pursued this build because I have the financial means to weather unexpected items and still be very comfortable even in a worst case scenario. If I did not have that cushion, I suggest you do NOT start with a build. I spent over $20k on the car in the past 18 months because it's not a question of IF costs snowball, it's a guarantee they will.

[VR6Bomber]

I would venture to guess in the $3K - $4K range... Just depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go... You could spend $8K on this type of project pretty quickly...

3-4k...? for the bottom-end kit maybe. lol

10-15k for a legit built motor.

[unvmy996]

no reason to be a dick man.. I got this as my beater so I don’t put miles on my amg .12 k isn’t bad , considering my 1050 awhp 996 motor build was 40k engine only . 12k for gt3cup heads , gt3rs dual pick up oil pump Carrillo rods , built trans with gt2rs 1.2.3 gears, main shaft etc and all that jazz... add on top of everything 6k for tilton clutch so yea I know about German cars and builds.

You may build bad ass engines but be humble bro.
Here’s my shit box

[Mille Bornes]

That sentence in bold is so true.

For real. That's about where in at right now lol

[jballou]

Was just my late-night ramblings from being a new father and lack of sleep.

[AudiTechS4]

for me this was my setup and cost http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...ld-The-DIY-way

bought a bel bf block on craigslist complete with auto trans for $400
all my gaskets,seals and bearings cost me $940
stud kit for mains $200
maching work $580
-chemical clean - $120
-hone $60
-rotating assembly balance ,hone,check and polish crank $150 ( checked rod clearance and bearing clearance as well)
-balance $250

Total for pretty much all in - add $200 or so for stuff i missed - $1920 (not including spare engine)
I assembled it myself and running it today in my b6 s4 avant with srm k24's at 30 psi and rock solid

[MacDaddy]

Crank needs rebalanced with new rods.

“I did it without it” i heard of guys re using head gaskets, just because you can doesnt mean you should.

[AudiTechS4]

i had the crank balanced - this was a copy and paste from my build. the whole rotating assembly was balanced minus the clutch and flywheel due to not having them at the time

fixed it

[unvmy996]

I feel you brother I have 2 year old that hasn’t slept through the night since day one

[jimmer009]

So I'm looking into building a block also. Can I get away with out messing the crank. I'm not gonna try to turn high rpms. Or should I just do it. So I can turn 8500rpms. I know you have ball hone the cyilender walls anyway.

[Mille Bornes]

Personally, I wouldn't build an engine without balancing, it just seems stupid not to balance when you're right there. Isn't that a slippery slope though 😉

[jimmer009]

So as this post goes where do you stop?? You might as well have the block dipped and bring a line boar machine. Then have it decked.

I am all about over building. But for a safe 600ish hp car it seems like a lot. Now a 900+ hp car I could understand. Im looking for advice I don't mean to argue as I won't pretend to be a engine builder. Or is the goal to erase all doubt???

[Schtug]

So as this post goes where do you stop?? You might as well have the block dipped and bring a line boar machine. Then have it decked.

I am all about over building. But for a safe 600ish hp car it seems like a lot. Now a 900+ hp car I could understand. Im looking for advice I don't mean to argue as I won't pretend to be a engine builder. Or is the goal to erase all doubt???

My recommendation is don’t even start, then you won’t won’t have to figure out when an appropriate time to stop is. Lol

See, I’ll tell you why trying to do a build on the cheap usually doesn’t work out. When you open up an engine you’re basically opening up a can of worms. Remember I said mine started out as a turbo swap? Well, I decided while I had the engine out I might as well pull the trans off and check the clutch. Then it was well, I guess I should clean it an reseal it while it’s out. So In the process of doing that I was going to reseal the upper and lower oil pans. Pulled the lower pan off and found a bunch of debris and a piece of a circlip in the oil pickup screen. Right there I should have stopped and just sourced another engine, but curiosity, stupidity, and some encouragement from a friend got the better of me. All of a sudden the heads were coming off and then I found that one of the Pistons has been beat up on the top real bad, like foreign object damage and the cylinder wall was pretty nicked up as well. So again this should have really been the point that I stopped and just bought another engine, but stupid me bought bigger pistons, rods, bearings, gaskets, seals, main studs, the whole lot. Everything to refresh and over build the block. So roughly $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor from the machine shop later the block was done. So I’m $5000 into the block and I’ve got a pair of stock heads with 170k miles on them. Definitely couldn’t stand to bolt them onto a block that was now worth more than the car it came out of. So roughly another $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor to fully redo the heads with new upgraded everything. So that’s the long block done, but let’s not forget everything that attaches to it. Replacing all the old crappy hoses, hardware, and other components ended up being around another $3000 and fuck it while we’re over doing everything else let’s rebuild the transmission that has literally nothing wrong with it for another $1800 parts and labor. $1000 for the fuel system, $1000 for intercoolers, it goes on and on and on.

[tate182]

My recommendation is don’t even start, then you won’t won’t have to figure out when an appropriate time to stop is. Lol

See, I’ll tell you why trying to do a build on the cheap usually doesn’t work out. When you open up an engine you’re basically opening up a can of worms. Remember I said mine started out as a turbo swap? Well, I decided while I had the engine out I might as well pull the trans off and check the clutch. Then it was well, I guess I should clean it an reseal it while it’s out. So In the process of doing that I was going to reseal the upper and lower oil pans. Pulled the lower pan off and found a bunch of debris and a piece of a circlip in the oil pickup screen. Right there I should have stopped and just sourced another engine, but curiosity, stupidity, and some encouragement from a friend got the better of me. All of a sudden the heads were coming off and then I found that one of the Pistons has been beat up on the top real bad, like foreign object damage and the cylinder wall was pretty nicked up as well. So again this should have really been the point that I stopped and just bought another engine, but stupid me bought bigger pistons, rods, bearings, gaskets, seals, main studs, the whole lot. Everything to refresh and over build the block. So roughly $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor from the machine shop later the block was done. So I’m $5000 into the block and I’ve got a pair of stock heads with 170k miles on them. Definitely couldn’t stand to bolt them onto a block that was now worth more than the car it came out of. So roughly another $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor to fully redo the heads with new upgraded everything. So that’s the long block done, but let’s not forget everything that attaches to it. Replacing all the old crappy hoses, hardware, and other components ended up being around another $3000 and fuck it while we’re over doing everything else let’s rebuild the transmission that has literally nothing wrong with it for another $1800 parts and labor. $1000 for the fuel system, $1000 for intercoolers, it goes on and on and on.

It’s so sad that this happens to so many of us my original plan was turbos exhaust clutch and inter coolers then it exploded from there.


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[unvmy996]

Who is rockcandy?

[jimmer009]

Thanks for explaining that. I see how fast it turns from just rods to a engine build. Your right about not knowing what your going to find. And your not going to leave just one thing alone once you get in there. So the answer is you don't stop. Why spend any money unless your going to spend it all

[Perth_RS4]

My recommendation is don’t even start, then you won’t won’t have to figure out when an appropriate time to stop is. Lol

See, I’ll tell you why trying to do a build on the cheap usually doesn’t work out. When you open up an engine you’re basically opening up a can of worms. Remember I said mine started out as a turbo swap? Well, I decided while I had the engine out I might as well pull the trans off and check the clutch. Then it was well, I guess I should clean it an reseal it while it’s out. So In the process of doing that I was going to reseal the upper and lower oil pans. Pulled the lower pan off and found a bunch of debris and a piece of a circlip in the oil pickup screen. Right there I should have stopped and just sourced another engine, but curiosity, stupidity, and some encouragement from a friend got the better of me. All of a sudden the heads were coming off and then I found that one of the Pistons has been beat up on the top real bad, like foreign object damage and the cylinder wall was pretty nicked up as well. So again this should have really been the point that I stopped and just bought another engine, but stupid me bought bigger pistons, rods, bearings, gaskets, seals, main studs, the whole lot. Everything to refresh and over build the block. So roughly $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor from the machine shop later the block was done. So I’m $5000 into the block and I’ve got a pair of stock heads with 170k miles on them. Definitely couldn’t stand to bolt them onto a block that was now worth more than the car it came out of. So roughly another $3500 in parts and $1500 in labor to fully redo the heads with new upgraded everything. So that’s the long block done, but let’s not forget everything that attaches to it. Replacing all the old crappy hoses, hardware, and other components ended up being around another $3000 and fuck it while we’re over doing everything else let’s rebuild the transmission that has literally nothing wrong with it for another $1800 parts and labor. $1000 for the fuel system, $1000 for intercoolers, it goes on and on and on.

This is exactly why I did not open the engine yet with my build. I figured I should get every part of the car sorted before opening the engine. Sorted the fueling, cooling, clutch, gearbox, suspension, chassis. Once this is all sorted and reliable for 12 months. Then would be a good time to pull the engine to do the rods and what ever else I find needs doing.

[julex]

My advise is to not open the block and simply slap the turbos on it and get fueling, tune, clutch + whatever else is needed. I also went down the rabbit hole with my built years ago (tial 770) and I don't even want to think how much money went into this but let's say that I could have gotten almost new real nice car for the amount.

From perspective of time, my previous set up with K04 was more fun on streets anyway.

[jimmer009]

I'm my situation (sorry if I'm hijacking) but I got a buddy who works at scrap yard so I am getting a apb motor.(long block) The plan is build it as I get time and money. This way I have no down time with my car. But my current motor is gonna need a new timing belt soon. So hence just swap it out with a built fresh motor. But yes swap a 5-7000$ motor into a car worth 3000$ I see the irony but racecar ??????

[AudiTechS4]

Who is rockcandy?

Marshal , he doesn't really come on here anymore . if your looking for a big engine build though i can get you in contact with him . not sure if he is still building engines right now. last i heard is he was building a rock crawler

[jaychen]

From perspective of time, my previous set up with K04 was more fun on streets anyway.

bigger isnt always better.

[julex]

bigger isnt always better.

I should have said "From perspective of time, my previous set up with K04 was more fun for the money on streets anyway".

My current set up is fun on streets but that's only because everything is custom now... Money for money, sticking to stock block (disposable!) with power bolt-ons is the way to go. You break the block, oh well, used ones are dirt cheap. Get a BEL one and it will probably hold anything 605 can throw at it.

[jaychen]

I should have said "From perspective of time, my previous set up with K04 was more fun for the money on streets anyway".

My current set up is fun on streets but that's only because everything is custom now... Money for money, sticking to stock block (disposable!) with power bolt-ons is the way to go. You break the block, oh well, used ones are dirt cheap. Get a BEL one and it will probably hold anything 605 can throw at it.

i agree.

cant beat pjk04 on stock block, both for fun, drivability and the price. it's the best combo for our cars imo.