Unexpected RS3 shifting behavior in manual mode

[GreenDice]

Have been driving my RS3 for a few months now. It is not my first car with DSG and something is puzzling me when driving in manual mode.
I know about the so-called feature that automatically shifts to highest or lowest possible gears if you hold the paddle or the gear selector momentarily.
I really don't like this "feature" but I can live with it.

However, I have noticed that it also upshift automatically in manual mode without holding the gear selector in place.
It happened more than once and still could not pinpoint the exact triggers.
I might have lift my foot off the throttle but I don't expect that it would upshift in that situation.

Did anyone experience this? Is this another "feature"?

Thanks in advance.

[Potatohead_RS3]

I am still waiting for my car but my understanding is manual mode is full on manual, the only thing it will do is shift from 2-1 when you slow to a stop. Are you getting to manual mode by moving the stick over or just by pulling on a paddle?

[GreenDice]

I use the stick.

[TZilla]

My car has never held first but otherwise holds second up

[Potatohead_RS3]

My car has never held first but otherwise holds second up

Interesting

I know in the recent episode of TGT with the TTRS, Clarkson did bang it off the limiter for a while at one point so it seems like it should definitely do it (maybe not in first).

[TZilla]

I should have said 2-4, I can't speak for 5-6 yet

Now that I am thinking about it though, i posted elsewhere that I thought I experienced it not holding second in manual mode and it may have been that I entered manual mode from normal mode instead of sport. Make sure you go to sport mode first and then manual mode and try to hold 2nd gear. I need to try it from drive again to see if I can reproduce it not holding 2nd). You will also notice the idle is lower going into manual mode from normal vs sport.

[jl87]

Even in manual + dynamic mine doesn't hold/bounce off the limiter. Very possible North American spec cars have different transmission tuning than Euro cars.

[fastolsen]

Mine bounces on the limiter

https://instagram.com/p/Bcp5aRZhPvI/


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[Potatohead_RS3]

Even in manual + dynamic mine doesn't hold/bounce off the limiter. Very possible North American spec cars have different transmission tuning than Euro cars.

If that's the case I will be pretty disappointed. Maybe something that can be altered in VCDS.

[HWCN]

Have been driving my RS3 for a few months now. It is not my first car with DSG and something is puzzling me when driving in manual mode.
I know about the so-called feature that automatically shifts to highest or lowest possible gears if you hold the paddle or the gear selector momentarily.
I really don't like this "feature" but I can live with it.

However, I have noticed that it also upshift automatically in manual mode without holding the gear selector in place.
It happened more than once and still could not pinpoint the exact triggers.
I might have lift my foot off the throttle but I don't expect that it would upshift in that situation.

Did anyone experience this? Is this another "feature"?

Thanks in advance.

I have had the exact same issue. It seems to randomly upshift prematurely when letting off the gas.

This is my third Audi/VW with an automatic and this is my least favorite to run in manual mode. I’m looking forward to a transmission tune when available.

[GreenDice]

I have had the exact same issue. It seems to randomly upshift prematurely when letting off the gas.

This is my third Audi/VW with an automatic and this is my least favorite to run in manual mode. I’m looking forward to a transmission tune when available.

Good to hear someone else have the same issue. Same sentiment here. Other than some minor quirks people already documented, RS3 has been great so far.

[Canvasoso]

Mine would not upshift unless I shift. It will bounce off the rev limiter. It would also hold the high gear even if I'm going at 1500 RPM's. The only time it downshifts to 1st on its own is when I come to a complete stop.

Worth noting that I drive the transmission in "S" mode. Even though you are in manual, there is a difference it seems if you were in "S" mode before you switch over to manual, or in "D" mode. Perhaps the ones having this behavior were in "D" mode before switching to manual?

[GreenDice]

Mine would not upshift unless I shift. It will bounce off the rev limiter. It would also hold the high gear even if I'm going at 1500 RPM's. The only time it downshifts to 1st on its own is when I come to a complete stop.

Worth noting that I drive the transmission in "S" mode. Even though you are in manual, there is a difference it seems if you were in "S" mode before you switch over to manual, or in "D" mode. Perhaps the ones having this behavior were in "D" mode before switching to manual?

I am almost certain that it happened in both D and S mode. Perhaps the trigger is letting off the gas pedal?

[dazed1]

The only reason it will upshift in manual mode is if the oil is not up to operating temperatures.

[jl87]

Mine is always in dynamic, so when I change over to manual it's coming from "S". Still does not bounce off the limiter in 2nd+, it will auto upshift. Also my foot is down past kickdown, not lifting, so it's not caused by pedal release. For those NA guys who say it won't auto upshift, are you past kickdown or before it? Wonder if that has something to do with it?

[dazed1]

Mine is always in dynamic, so when I change over to manual it's coming from "S". Still does not bounce off the limiter in 2nd+, it will auto upshift. Also my foot is down past kickdown, not lifting, so it's not caused by pedal release. For those NA guys who say it won't auto upshift, are you past kickdown or before it? Wonder if that has something to do with it?

I dont have my RS3 yet, but in the RS5, past kickdown or before kickdown, it won't upshift.

[meticulist]

Mine is always in dynamic, so when I change over to manual it's coming from "S". Still does not bounce off the limiter in 2nd+, it will auto upshift. Also my foot is down past kickdown, not lifting, so it's not caused by pedal release. For those NA guys who say it won't auto upshift, are you past kickdown or before it? Wonder if that has something to do with it?

Also, not saying this is the case, but being in dynamic doesn't mean the trans is necessarily in "S". Yes, if you cycle through the drive select into dynamic while driving it defaults to "S", but it is possible to be in "D" and dynamic and the shifting is noticeably different. And as others have said, manual mode is noticeably different when put into "S" first than switching to manual from "D".

[Potatohead_RS3]

I was doing some reading on this last night. Apparently on the R8, when you enter manual mode it will actually also show if you are in S mode, by displaying 'M3S' instead of M3. I bet the RS3 has the same type of deal, just not displayed.

If someone can put the car in dynamic, put the trans in S mode, then flip over to manual and try it, that should answer the question.

[fastolsen]

Mine doesnt show "M3S".

I have MTM exhaust valve controller so my flaps are open, allways. If I then start the car in dynamic (with flaps open) I still have to cycle the drive select back to dynamic to get the pops and bangs. Starting in dynamic and putting the gearbox in «S» isnt good enough. Strange and stupid that I have to to this everytime I start...




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[Potatohead_RS3]

Mine doesnt show "M3S".

Right, I think there are two maps, but they don't display it. Like you say there are some quirks. Will yours bang the limiter if you leave it in regular D and then go to manual?

[Potatohead_RS3]

I posted this question on Facebook and two different guys in the US said it will shift for you 1-2, and 2-1 if you stop, but that's it. Everything else full manual.

[GreenDice]

The issue identified in the original post has nothing to do with the limiter. I have to pay attention to the engine oil temp. It is certainly a possibility.

[TZilla]

I posted this question on Facebook and two different guys in the US said it will shift for you 1-2, and 2-1 if you stop, but that's it. Everything else full manual.

Yes, ^ that is my experience.

[timzcat]

An R8 will bounce off the rev limiter in just S if you are driving it hard. It will downshift, even at high RPM, when rolling back on the throttle even though it will bounce off the rev limiter almost immediately.

[Leonitus86]

Reviving old thread here-
So tonight, I tested out launch control after getting my car tuned with apr's e85 file, and well this has never happened before and it shocked me, in a bad way. Basically during launch, it burned out all four wheels, lost traction to the point where it bounced of the rev limiter on first, and I was in manual mode, I tried to shift into second gear (paddle shifter) and it wouldn't. Super odd behavior. So after that I let off the throttle and then it let me shift into second gear. Honestly it freaked me out. It seemed like a computer glitch or something. Next time I launch it I will try it in sport mode with the transmission doing all the shifting. I don't thing bouncing off the rev limiter is a good thing in my opinion. Has anyone else experienced this? Thoughts?

[Aramze]

How much gas was in the tank?

[Leonitus86]

Almost a full tank.

[mezgermischief]

Ever since new my car (stock) occasionally bounces off the rev limiter (usually first or second) and as describe by Leonitus86 gets almost stuck and wont shift, and then engages the next gear very slowly and harshly. Happens in both D and S, aswell as manual and auto. Bad video but its all I could find that ive taken: https://imgur.com/a/925FwWD

[Leonitus86]

Great video iStig, that's exactly how mine happened and I personally didn't like it. It's only happened once to me and kind of making me not wanting to launch the car anymore. I don't have a tcu tune and figured that was the root cause, but you are completely stock and it's still acting up so makes me wonder if this is just how the transmissions act during a launch. My main concern is I don't want to cause engine damage by bouncing of the rev limiter like that. I mean I've seen these motors being revved with tunes all the way up to 8500 rpms which is nuts to me so that makes me think it's OK. Still a cause for concern though.

[steve111b]

In the video the car is doing over 6000 rpm in 2nd gear and there are no colours in the rev counter. There should be green, yellow, and then the whole thing turns red. Why are you not getting the colours? It looks like the car is not setup correctly. The dash should say M1,M2,M3. If you are shifting with the paddles and leaving it Sport there are two masters running the DSG. With two masters (you with the paddles and the DSG auto shifting in Sport) trying to do the same thing at redline it is not going to end well. The Golf R drivers have this problem, but the RS allows for one master. Selecting M instead of S should solve your problem.

[Leonitus86]

In the video the car is doing over 6000 rpm in 2nd gear and there are no colours in the rev counter. There should be green, yellow, and then the whole thing turns red. Why are you not getting the colours? It looks like the car is not setup correctly. The dash should say M1,M2,M3. If you are shifting with the paddles and leaving it Sport there are two masters running the DSG. With two masters (you with the paddles and the DSG auto shifting in Sport) trying to do the same thing at redline it is not going to end well. The Golf R drivers have this problem, but the RS allows for one master. Selecting M instead of S should solve your problem.

I thought I was in manual mode, but there is a chance that I left it in sport mode and then tried to shift it myself on top of that. I can definitely see that being a problem since the sport mode(auto shifting) is trying to do it's thing and then me trying to shift manually with the paddle shifters. It felt like a glitch when it happened to me, like the car didn't know what to do etc. I will try again a launch in sport mode and see how it goes, see if it acts up again.

[steve111b]

The colours do not happen in 1st gear because the car will auto shift to second (at redline) even if you are in Manual. Once the car is in 2nd gear the car will hit the limiter if the driver fails to shift (no more auto shift). If the driver and the auto shift into 2nd gear happen too close to one another I suspect there could be a problem. That said, I have never experienced any odd shifts. Another thing to consider is that launch control puts the car in AMAX, which gives more rapid shifts. There are options to try. Shift well before the redline in 1st, let the car auto shift, or experiment and find another solution. The car is not acting up, it is doing what it is designed to do. Drivers have to fit their expectations into the design that is already there. Good luck.

[mezgermischief]

I should note that this issue happens almost once a day. Happened this morning commuting to work, I feel like one day it’s going to happen and there will be a catastrophic drive train failure. I even showed that video to Audi and their response was “as normal, customer did not shift this rev limiter hit”... the car is in auto and I even engaged the paddle to shift up with no avail.

[mezgermischief]

Anyone have any thoughts?

[Dominick's S4]

You can tell in the video posted yesterday that the RS3 was in Sport/Auto mode and as Steve111b mentioned above the DSG should shift on its own from 1st to 2nd in D, S, M or AMAX whether it's tuned or not tuned.

I've experienced a similar issue (bouncing off the rev limiter) in Auto S mode when using launch control in AMAX mode when switching from 2 to 3 and 4 to 5 but it was some sort of glitch in the original APR TCU file I was running at the time and since have moved to Unitronic. At the time APR initially felt it might have been the aftermarket wheels/tire size but that was proven to not be the case.. For what it's worth APR also said (which I'm not sure is accurate and I have not verified) that the shift points are initiated by actual speed and not rpm's.. Maybe someone can verify this.. If you were spinning your tires while taking off in first gear that can also cause the DSG to act funny but in your video the wheels did not appear to spin.

Given that you are 100% stock we can't blame this one on APR or a TCU tune. The issue you are experiencing is different than mine but if it's happening daily now it will probably only get worse...mine did... I'm sorry I don't have a resolution for you but I would take your service manager for a ride so he/she can witness it firsthand. If your dealer does not want to help or continues to claim you are not shifting in manual mode then go to another dealer.

Below is a video of what I experienced...

[Leonitus86]

That video is a perfect representation of what happened to my car, except from first to second gear. What exactly does AMAX stand for anyways?

[mezgermischief]

The weird thing is this happens to me while daily driving, and not when engaging launch control; however, I have had it happen in launch control a couple times. Ive taken it to 2 dealers now...

[steve111b]

The first thing that comes to mind is are your cars in Dynamic? If you take the car out of Park after a restart and put it into gear it must go to Sport mode, not Drive. If you are pushing the gear selector into Sport mode (because the car was in Drive) and thinking the car is in Dynamic, you are incorrect. If you already know this, please do not take offence.

The second thing I wonder about is the problem the engine and not the DSG. On my old A3 the car shifted much like the videos, but it turned out to be the engine that was at fault. The engine was going into self protection mode which looks a lot like hitting the rev limiter. All the faults that I thought were DSG were something else, but they appeared at first to be shift problems which should indicate the DSG. The DSG was way more reliable than the engine.

[itsjustjed]

That video is a perfect representation of what happened to my car, except from first to second gear. What exactly does AMAX stand for anyways?

AMAX = Acceleration Maximum. Here's background on it.

[Leonitus86]

AMAX = Acceleration Maximum. Here's background on it.

Thank you for that information, that clears it up. It seems to me by reading that description that the engine basically can accelerate faster than the transmission can keep up at any given point during full throttle which will lead to "free rev" and cause it to hit the rev limiter. That makes me think that some cars with the AMAX/DSG transmissions such as our cars, can experience this based on differen factors like tunes, d.a. temperature and who knows what else.