Uh Oh,"Engine Oil Pressure too Low" RED CEL/warning came on

[Ringsby4]

So driving wife to airport this morning running only just on time,The above warning came on....Was only a mile from home ,did a U turn ,cruised and coasted in neutral down the few small hills.At the start when throwing it into neutral,the warning went off but nearer home it stayed on in neutral.Jumped into other car and made check-in by minutes to spare.
I heard no rattles or noises.Checked oil- its full as I only just changed it.Also recently changed out the CF.
Ran Torque app and got P0011.
Was the CEL a generic CEL and the problem is related to something else other than oil ?
I'm tempted to start it and see the pressure on Torque but I feel I really need advice here.
PS - Before you jump on me with rule #22, pics of my lovely wife just don't matter at this stage of my concern about Wolfgang ! later,later....

[vce1232000]

I would mechanical oil psi gauge and if there's oil psi . If not . the oil pan and start for a sheared off sprocket on the oil pump indicating a seized balance shaft. Or mite be simple as a defective oil psi sender unit

[Ringsby4]

I would mechanical oil psi gauge and if there's oil psi . If not . the oil pan and start for a sheared off sprocket on the oil pump indicating a seized balance shaft. Or mite be simple as a defective oil psi sender unit

Great response,thanks so you think I should take a chance on starting it ?Wouldn't the oil pressure gauge on the Torque app show what I'm looking for ? ie reasonable pressure ?

[Jet08]

Oil pressure gauge on the Torque app uses the oil pressure sensor so if that is defective you will get a false read, what oil filter are you using I assume you replaced it when you changed your oil.

[Ringsby4]

Oil pressure gauge on the Torque app uses the oil pressure sensor so if that is defective you will get a false read, what oil filter are you using I assume you replaced it when you changed your oil.

Yeah of course you're right about the sender,but if I do start it and get pressure on Torque that eliminates two things being that its not the sender nor the oil pump giving me the code .Ive always used Mann oil filters for the 12 or so changes Ive done so far.....

[Ringsby4]

I'm still concerned about starting it,should I be ?
Googling has shown me that the code can be caused by a variety of things.
I'm still wondering if the CEL I got ( thread title ) is generic as IIRC when my PCV valve went it showed something totally unrelated on the display....

[vce1232000]

Imo Id just start and run just for a moment to if there's oil psi 1st to diagnose. I would try to limit the amount of start to a minimum # . So getting a mechanical oil psi gauge ed 1st will be 1 less start up if it not the sensor.

[Jet08]

You don't need to rev the engine and you have already had it running after the warning so it is unlikely you will do much additional damage checking pressure using the app. Pressure loss could have been a collapsed oil filter but unlikely with a Mann one. Going forward you may want to remove the value cover to check for evidence of sludge and foreign objects before moving to a sump removal if you discover you have low / no oil pressure via the Torque app.

[Van Black]

IIRC there's no oil pressure sensor, just a switch so you can't check oil pressure with Torque. Also, I've never seen
any oil pressure info in that app.

[tloft4]

Well clearly the car has a pressure sensor or it wouldn't be able to tell you it is low

edit just reread, dont know nearly enough to say no to that, but that makes it seem a lot less likely that its simply a malfunction

[Ringsby4]

Thanks all,night has fallen here,cars outside...
I'll keep looking on here if anyone else has any ideas

[Van Black]

It's just a simple switch:
https://www.onlinecarparts.co.uk/fae-2494835.html

Switch pressure 1.4 bar. Maybe you're lucky and it just went low and not gone completely.
My two cents would be to go straight for a mechanical gauge. Take out the switch near the oil cooler and fit the gauge.
Maybe take out the LPFP fuse and just turn the engine over and see if you're getting any pressure at all.

[Ringsby4]

It's just a simple switch:
https://www.onlinecarparts.co.uk/fae-2494835.html

Switch pressure 1.4 bar. Maybe you're lucky and it just went low and not gone completely.
My two cents would be to go straight for a mechanical gauge. Take out the switch near the oil cooler and fit the gauge.
Maybe take out the LPFP fuse and just turn the engine over and see if you're getting any pressure at all.

Thanks and If I understand correctly,you're suggesting the switch throws when it senses low pressure.Or if I'm lucky it may have failed.I wonder if its n.c. or n.o. with the engine at normal pressure.If I had a gauge or didn't live in a rural area ( meaning I could get one easily ) it would be logical to do what you suggest but for now I've just gotta sleep on it !

[Okedokey]

sludge issues, cam chain tensioner?

[Ringsby4]

sludge issues, cam chain tensioner?

Nope,no sludge internals as clean as a whistle.What symptoms should I be looking for with tensioner Okey?
though I've gotta ask the question again-could the low oil pressure warning be generic as it was with my PCV ? Is this "generic" warning system usual and then analysis with Vagcom or Torque details the code ? Haven't got an answer to this yet,because if I did it might relieve some of my stress about it being low oil pressure....

[aluthman]

Do not start it. You have an issue with your oil pump. Most likely a mechanical failure of some variety. If it was the sensor that failed, it would say so in the DIS. It's a different warning than the low pressure warning. If you start it, you run the chance of ruining your head, cams, and the main and rod bearings. Get it fixed now while it's just the oil pump or your parts bill will more than double.

[canadianA4B7]

Save yourself some trouble and pull the Ecu fuse. You should still crank and see oil pressure. Pulling the fuse will stop you from starting it.

Install mechanical gauge before you do this. If you don't, and you've sheared the gear or damaged the oil pump you'll be in a whole world of repair. Rather then cause yourself more $$$$ pull the damn fuse out and don't start it. If your pressure is still low then assume you've got material plugging the pick up tube (likely common on a 10+ year old car so let's not by pass this with know oil pump and pick up tune issues)

Oil issues are not something we should be suggesting starting a car to solve. Starting the car now is a sure way to cause yourself some serious coin. If suggested above is offering a replacement motor then have at her. If you plan on keeping the car find another way to troubleshoot.

I'll just say this, listening to bad advice has not served me well in the past. Low oil pressure light should be red red flag that you have oil issues. No point in learning the hard way what low oil can do. I'd say grab a new switch at this time. Remove the one from you car and check both for ohms. Install a T with m10 threads on one side and 1/8 NPT on the other. A m10/1/8 NPT fitting will be handy here too. Install mechanical oil gauge and run it up so you can see it sitting in drivers seat. On the hood or sitting on your wiper arm is fine temporarily.

[Okedokey]

what do we think?

[Okedokey]

DIY

[SykoraA4]

I have a spare pump I had purchased to address my oil pressure issues, but opted to swap the motor instead and have no need for it now. PM me if you're interested in it, it's a used pump but in solid shape.

[aluthman]

I'd just like to point out that the chances of sludge blocking the oil pickup are probably <1%. I've pulled apart a few of these motors now and the only thing I have ever seen on the pickup screen are bits of metal from mechanical failure. I can't say I've ever seen a person get the low pressure warning and they solved it by cleaning the pickup. Don't kid yourself into thinking it's a sensor or a dirty pickup issue. Just suck it up and address the elephant in the room.

[AudiKilla]

How many miles on the car and is it tuned?

[Ashtonts]

I'd just like to point out that the chances of sludge blocking the oil pickup are probably <1%. I've pulled apart a few of these motors now and the only thing I have ever seen on the pickup screen are bits of metal from mechanical failure. I can't say I've ever seen a person get the low pressure warning and they solved it by cleaning the pickup. Don't kid yourself into thinking it's a sensor or a dirty pickup issue. Just suck it up and address the elephant in the room.

Are you cutting out the balance shafts on your new motor? Or were you just going to run a brand new pump?

I'm still seriously considering either grabbing a used, good condition pump and deleting them, or just deleting the ones on my current pump. I'm definitely not in the market for rebuilding my motor should they seize.

[Ringsby4]

Do not start it. You have an issue with your oil pump. Most likely a mechanical failure of some variety. If it was the sensor that failed, it would say so in the DIS. It's a different warning than the low pressure warning. If you start it, you run the chance of ruining your head, cams, and the main and rod bearings. Get it fixed now while it's just the oil pump or your parts bill will more than double.

Advice taken-thanks

Save yourself some trouble and pull the Ecu fuse. You should still crank and see oil pressure. Pulling the fuse will stop you from starting it.

Install mechanical gauge before you do this. If you don't, and you've sheared the gear or damaged the oil pump you'll be in a whole world of repair. Rather then cause yourself more $$$$ pull the damn fuse out and don't start it. If your pressure is still low then assume you've got material plugging the pick up tube (likely common on a 10+ year old car so let's not by pass this with know oil pump and pick up tune issues)

Oil issues are not something we should be suggesting starting a car to solve. Starting the car now is a sure way to cause yourself some serious coin. If suggested above is offering a replacement motor then have at her. If you plan on keeping the car find another way to troubleshoot.

I'll just say this, listening to bad advice has not served me well in the past. Low oil pressure light should be red red flag that you have oil issues. No point in learning the hard way what low oil can do. I'd say grab a new switch at this time. Remove the one from you car and check both for ohms. Install a T with m10 threads on one side and 1/8 NPT on the other. A m10/1/8 NPT fitting will be handy here too. Install mechanical oil gauge and run it up so you can see it sitting in drivers seat. On the hood or sitting on your wiper arm is fine temporarily.

Advice taken-thanks as well

I have a spare pump I had purchased to address my oil pressure issues, but opted to swap the motor instead and have no need for it now. PM me if you're interested in it, it's a used pump but in solid shape.

I may need to do that,if so I probably have a way to get it over here via CT -thanks


Its 5 am here and just awake trying to come to terms with this.Wolfgang has never missed a beat,regular oil changes at 5k miles-I even flush some oil down to get any remnants of old oil out before the fill.As said the internals are clean as a whistle and for these reasons I totally agree with you Adam as regards sludge chances.When this happened I was not thrashing......
I think I'll investigate the pressure by cranking using a guage and get on with this today.
Really worried now about the mile I drove home but whats done is done.It was a dumb move for sure.

[aluthman]

Are you cutting out the balance shafts on your new motor? Or were you just going to run a brand new pump?

I'm still seriously considering either grabbing a used, good condition pump and deleting them, or just deleting the ones on my current pump. I'm definitely not in the market for rebuilding my motor should they seize.

As of right now, I plan to run the brand new pump I have without modifying it.

[Ringsby4]

Do not start it. You have an issue with your oil pump. Most likely a mechanical failure of some variety. If it was the sensor that failed, it would say so in the DIS. It's a different warning than the low pressure warning. If you start it, you run the chance of ruining your head, cams, and the main and rod bearings. Get it fixed now while it's just the oil pump or your parts bill will more than double.

I know its probably impossible to say,but whats the chance I've damaged the engine with that drive I did in your opinion ?

[Ashtonts]

I know its probably impossible to say,but whats the chance I've damaged the engine with that drive I did in your opinion ?

That would most likely depend on how much pressure was there. The light will go off once the pressure falls under a certain threshold, but there's no way to tell how much pressure really is there unless you have a mechanical gauge. If there was zero pressure, I'd say there's about a 99.9% chance its toast.

The fact that your motor didn't seize and that there was presumably no issues or sounds running it back is a good sign, but there could definitely be (and very likely is) damage under the surface. There really would be no way to realistically tell aside from opening that sucker up and looking at it though.

[Ringsby4]

That would most likely depend on how much pressure was there. The light will go off once the pressure falls under a certain threshold, but there's no way to tell how much pressure really is there unless you have a mechanical gauge. If there was zero pressure, I'd say there's about a 99.9% chance its toast.

The fact that your motor didn't seize and that there was presumably no issues or sounds running it back is a good sign, but there could definitely be (and very likely is) damage under the surface. There really would be no way to realistically tell aside from opening that sucker up and looking at it though.

Okay,okay ( he says with lots of concern ).........
I can buy a mechanical guage at my nearest town today with a fitting kit so good on that front.
I have a new valve cover gasket that I intended fitting soon-is there any value in pulling the cover off first to have a look whats going on in there before the cranking pressure test as IIRC ,the engine can even be started without oil going everywhere with this off ?

[esandes]

What's the mileage? The oil pump craps out quite often at 100k.

[Ringsby4]

I would mechanical oil psi gauge and if there's oil psi . If not . the oil pan and start for a sheared off sprocket on the oil pump indicating a seized balance shaft. Or mite be simple as a defective oil psi sender unit

Ive got this far today,took a lot of today..
1.Borrowed pressure gauge,removed P.switch,fitted gauge
2.Removed plugs to make spinning-over easier on everything
3.Spun engine over-nothing .
4.Checked gauge with air pressure just to be sure ,weirdly read exactly the same as my shop air pressure gauge ,weirdly considering the one I borrowed was ancient -brass case etc Would be ~40 yo at a guess
5. Blew compressed air into the p.switch aperture just to check if any blockage (forever hopeful lol )- air could be heard rushing through turbo side? Hard to tell as I couldn't squirt and listen over there.When air was rushing in,no evidence of oil gurgling curious as sump is full ?
6.Spun over with no guage to see even a little trickle-nothing
7. Got mate's 4WD and did a series of 3 point turns ,him dragging me in reverse this way and that into the shed.
8.Having cold beer now ..

VCE,I t'm thinking that the middle part of your post above is whats going to happen next...( any further advice from your self or others always ! )

I had the thought the other day-Wolfgang is just running like a dream-what could POSSIBLY go wrong !! I'm obviously not up to speed with all of Murphy's laws read as : rules for life !

Whats next for tomorrow

Oh,and yes OP, mileage is just that-100,000 miles.Is that true they crap out that early ? , I might've missed it but I haven't really heard that about our cars...Anyone want to chime in about that ?

[vce1232000]

Since the valve cover is easy to . Id do that and take a for any signs of oil starvation on the cams or anything in there. You said you did drive the car for about a mile after the lite came on. Even thou it was probably at less then 2000 rpm and coasting some of it. It still didnt have oil psi. So I would that before the oil pan. If you have cylinder head oil starvation damage. No need to go further as your engine is pretty much toast. But I have a feeling it okay because you didnt hear any noises and nothing seized up.

Just for the record my oil pump in my 1st motor was still going strong @ 220,000 miles, Before I ed out the engine for a 80,000 mile one. My old shortblock was into a MK5 GTi and that dude is still around with it without issue's

[Ringsby4]

Since the valve cover is easy to . Id do that and take a for any signs of oil starvation on the cams or anything in there. You said you did drive the car for about a mile after the lite came on. Even thou it was probably at less then 2000 rpm and coasting some of it. It still didnt have oil psi. So I would that before the oil pan. If you have cylinder head oil starvation damage. No need to go further as your engine is pretty much toast. But I have a feeling it okay because you didnt hear any noises and nothing seized up.

Just for the record my oil pump in my 1st motor was still going strong @ 220,000 miles, Before I ed out the engine for a 80,000 mile one. My old shortblock was into a MK5 GTi and that dude is still around with it without issue's

Okay,that's a good call-as stated I was going to pull it off anyway.
What exactly am I looking for to identify damage in the cam/valve area ? I probably couldn't see much of the cam journals anyway. What about maybe pulling the fuel pump to see the CF- wouldn't that indicate the lack of oil film on bearing surface ?...I'd look at that anyways,I guess..
And yes,no obvious noises even when coming up the driveway meaning little road noise and believe me,I was listening

Have you heard of many of this failure in comparatively low mileage cars ? - I know you've had a great run ( I was hoping for the same ! )

[B7OrangeA4]

My oil pump went out at 125k miles. The balance shaft in the pump became worn so pressure was fine once started but once warmed up got the oil pressure warning. Got a brand new pump with a lifetime warranty going on 40k miles on it


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Ringsby4]

My oil pump went out at 125k miles. The balance shaft in the pump became worn so pressure was fine once started but once warmed up got the oil pressure warning. Got a brand new pump with a lifetime warranty going on 40k miles on it


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

Oh,..thanks,these failures must have gone under my radar....( or I was pretending not to notice ! )

[vce1232000]

Okay,that's a good call-as stated I was going to pull it off anyway.
What exactly am I looking for to identify damage in the cam/valve area ? I probably couldn't see much of the cam journals anyway. What about maybe pulling the fuel pump to see the CF- wouldn't that indicate the lack of oil film on bearing surface ?...I'd look at that anyways,I guess..
And yes,no obvious noises even when coming up the driveway meaning little road noise and believe me,I was listening

Have you heard of many of this failure in comparatively low mileage cars ? - I know you've had a great run ( I was hoping for the same ! )

Id near the cam girdle at the edges where the cam journals for discoloration. Or the top of the girdle on top of the can journals also. Also you can smell burnt metal and oil near the area's .

The cause of my original engine failure was a burnt exhaust valve on #1 cylinder. I was to lazy @ the time to take to what exactly had happen. I had quick access to a complete low mileage engine to it with. When I got bored then I took it apart to what had happened. Thats when I the burnt valve. I got the valve from member aluthman(Adam). If I had ed this. Id I still be running my original engine today. I sold my old engine is 2 components. Engine short block & the cylinder head to recoup my $$$$.

I think the oil pump failures mite be from lack of maintenance during its early lifetime of the engine. You mite have taken care of it in your possession. How about the original or previous owner . Or could have been oil change intervals was too long in between or low quality oil

[esandes]

My oil pump died at 100k. When I did some research on it a lot of people had it happen around 100k. I will have mine replaced before it hits the next 100k.

Stupid pump design. There are conversion kits to the previous generation indestructible design.

[JorisRS6]

This just happened to me before i sold my a4. The first time the light came on i right away got a mechanical pressure test done. Pressure was just below specs. At first there was no sound but that got real bad real quick. Found out it was the oil pump worn out. The balance shafts. It seems to ve a more common problem. I put in a good used pump. You can also get a 1.8 oil pump conversion kit. New pumps are very expensive. I ended up paying 1200 CAD. Hope this helps


Sent from my iPhone using Audizine

[Ringsby4]

Id near the cam girdle at the edges where the cam journals for discoloration. Or the top of the girdle on top of the can journals also. Also you can smell burnt metal and oil near the area's .

The cause of my original engine failure was a burnt exhaust valve on #1 cylinder. I was to lazy @ the time to take to what exactly had happen. I had quick access to a complete low mileage engine to it with. When I got bored then I took it apart to what had happened. Thats when I the burnt valve. I got the valve from member aluthman(Adam). If I had ed this. Id I still be running my original engine today. I sold my old engine is 2 components. Engine short block & the cylinder head to recoup my $$$$.

I think the oil pump failures mite be from lack of maintenance during its early lifetime of the engine. You mite have taken care of it in your possession. How about the original or previous owner . Or could have been oil change intervals was too long in between or low quality oil

All understood and appreciate on what to look for I'll be into it at sun-up and post back.I bought the car with v.low kms and had full service history and all detailed invoices so I feel I know what went on.The owner was as zealous as me with servicing and loved the car as much.The Saab 9/5 we owned made it to 350.000 kms and I over serviced the auto trans but,guess what,that was what failed and it was the demise of the car as uneconomic to replace-I don't know,sometimes there's just no logic to life.
I guess when I pull the pan,all will be revealed re the cause.

My oil pump died at 100k. When I did some research on it a lot of people had it happen around 100k. I will have mine replaced before it hits the next 100k.

Stupid pump design. There are conversion kits to the previous generation indestructible design.

Okay,its all becoming clear now about these pumps,I still don't know how I missed that.Can you detail about the conversion ?

[vce1232000]

Can you detail about the conversion ?

When you do the 1.8T conversion pumps a few members experienced problems with high oil psi and inconsistent oil psi's. You also loose you balance shafts. Which means your engine's ability to cancel out high end vibrations. Also some have done the balance shafts delete. Which you cut a gear and leave the shafts dead. Some feel that worn shafts are the cause of seized or low oil psi issue's.

[Theiceman]

so what exactly is involved in a pump replacement ?

is it "just" dropping the sub frame, the pan and then unbolting and bolting on an oil pump ? or is there more to it ?