CTS Turbo BOSS Turbo Kit

[Zach L]

I think it's about time this upcoming (Bolt-On Speed Solution) turbo kit has its own thread.

I aggregated the posts I found about it, and posted the date at the top of each quote...

This is something we've been working on for B8 that can house a turbo substantially larger than a K04:

Target price for the hardware will be just below $3000.00, keep in mind software and fueling would be additional. As you can see this setup has internal DV/BOV right now, internal WG, and the idea is plug and play with an OEM+ look.

Most likely the low pressure fuel pump and fuel injectors will have to be upgraded.

It is our next big project to cast. Rome wasn't built overnight guys.

May 10 I messaged them and they told me they were working on prototypes

I've been messaging them over the last couple weeks. Expected timeline late summer, will be able to use factory location downpipe and FMIC. So, could be big savings for those of us who have already put in a HFC and FMIC. It's expected to work with Garrett Turbos.

We're still working on the hardware at this point. The Compressor housings are complete and ready to go, the hot side is in casting along, and our wastegates are in the works. This project will be released later this year after our MQB (VW MK7/8V Audi kit - pics below)





Not B8 Related, but this is what we are wrapping up before the BOSS (Bolt On Speed Solution for B7 & B8 platform), as you can see it's pretty OEM+ looking when installed, expect the same for the B8 BOSS kits.

They posted the following on their FB page on 11/23/16...

Gary Parga R - Hello I have a Audi A5 2.0 2010, I want a bigger turbo for my car comes out and if they send guadalajara mex
CTS Turbo - Then you may want something like this, we're working on one for the B8's too



I recognize that as an EA113 2.0T FSI engine (Mk5 GTI, Mk6 R), but hardware for our EA888.2 engines is very similar. Makes me wonder if a K04 tune could be utilized until a tune calibrated specifically for the turbo comes out. United Motorsports installed the similar Mk7 MQB version of the BOSS kit, so I assume they might be an initial source for software. The Mk7 EA888.3 MQB kits shipped in October 2016, but the exhaust housing is completely different from the EA113 and our EA888.2 engines.

These CTS BOSS kits are utilizing a Garret GTX2867R or GTX3071R turbo installed into a CTS proprietary exhaust housing. I'm pretty stoked for this.

[wxsgt]

You do know rai has a big turbo kit that doesn't integrate the turbo to exhaust manifold so you can run different turbos.

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[Zach L]

You do know rai has a big turbo kit that doesn't integrate the turbo to exhaust manifold so you can run different turbos.

Yes, and I think this turbo would slot between a K04 and the RAI kit in terms of power capabilities. CTS has said their intention was to offer a plug and play solution with an OEM+ look. Any exhaust/downpipe/HFC that works with the factory turbo or K04 would bolt up to it, and factory and FMIC would connect.

[wxsgt]

Yes, and I think this turbo would slot between a K04 and the RAI kit in terms of power capabilities. CTS has said their intention was to offer a plug and play solution with an OEM+ look. Any exhaust/downpipe/HFC that works with the factory turbo or K04 would bolt up to it, and factory and FMIC would connect.

Gotcha

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[neveret]

Yes, and I think this turbo would slot between a K04 and the RAI kit in terms of power capabilities. CTS has said their intention was to offer a plug and play solution with an OEM+ look. Any exhaust/downpipe/HFC that works with the factory turbo or K04 would bolt up to it, and factory and FMIC would connect.

Having a factory fit seems like a novelty since taking advantage of that turbos power capability would likely require at the least a minor engine build. At that point what's the big deal about having a v band welded on your existing downpipe? And if you'd say just use it at safe power levels, you'd just end up with k04 power delivered with increased lag.

I considered piecing together a t25 manifold setup with a gt2871r which seemed like a nice setup but full spool after 4000 is just too laggy for my taste.

[Zach L]

Having a factory fit seems like a novelty since taking advantage of that turbos power capability would likely require at the least a minor engine build. At that point what's the big deal about having a v band welded on your existing downpipe? And if you'd say just use it at safe power levels, you'd just end up with k04 power delivered with increased lag.

I considered piecing together a t25 manifold setup with a gt2871r which seemed like a nice setup but full spool after 4000 is just too laggy for my taste.

It is not uncommon for big turbo 2.0T engines to have stock internals. What breaks internal components (i.e., rods) is high torque at low RPMs. Maxing out a K04 is less safe than producing even more power/torque at a higher RPM using a larger turbo. This is not theory, it's done often on the Mk5/6 platform. Yes, of course there is still a limit, but you'd be surprised. My assumption is this BOSS turbo will be 370-420 awhp capable on 93 pump gas (no w/m). The power band of this turbo is likely going to feel much more linear than the K04; not peaky and then falling off a little at higher RPMs.

Arin has mentioned that 2 of the 3 APR Stage 3 test mules are running stock internals and 1 is running a built engine... that didn't surprise me at all. Likely there will be version of the kit to be ran at lower boost levels on stock internals. Then there will be a 'Plus' version likely with higher boost, requiring upgrades to the low pressure fuel system and maybe intended to run with aftermarket rods.

I got my first 2.0T 11 years ago and have watched it evolve from the EA113 to the EA888 and its various generations. One thing consistent I've seen with larger turbos for these cars - you will get to the limits of the stock low pressure fueling system and the stock injectors before you reach the limit of rods AT HIGHER RPMs (this is different from a maxed out K04 with higher torque spikes at lower engine speeds, which will snap rods).

[neveret]

so why not just use one of these? these? Additionally, why would you want to connect to the factory intercooler with a turbo this size? Pardon me for being confused by the appeal of oem+ fit/look. It seems to me the car would likely be moved from the daily driver column to current projects after the clutch and fuel system fall short and like I said you end up with car with marginal power gain over k04 variant systems with a less usable power band.

I've been playing this game a long time myself but am relatively new to the 2.0t. I've done lots of modding, and my feeling is that small displacement engines with big turbos make crummy daily drivers because they don't have any grunt when you want it, and by the time you finally get it you're on the limiter. Obviously, you should follow you're heart, but since this is a discussion forum I'd just argue that the k04 variant turbos hit the sweet spot with these cars for power/fun/reliability/money invested. Maybe you're thinking about making your car into a race machine and in that case again, pardon me.

[Lambda13]

Additionally, why would you want to connect to the factory intercooler with a turbo this size? Pardon me for being confused by the appeal of oem+ fit/look. It seems to me the car would likely be moved from the daily driver column to current projects after the clutch and fuel system fall short and like I said you end up with car with marginal power gain over k04 variant systems with a less usable power band.

I think what is meant by OEM+ fit is not having to get custom piping to hook up an existing FMIC. I figure they mean stock location more so than an actual stock IC.

[Militant-Grunt]

Pag Parts Turbo has a kit that utilizes a slew of EFRs and Garretts if anyone is looking for more meat.

[Zach L]

so why not just use one of these? these?

That ATP stock location turbo is not bad, but the 'kit' has been out for a long time and it's the cast, log style manifold that has caused issues for a bunch of the Mk5 BT guys. It doesn't flow evenly and creates some kind of pulsation. Something to do with uneven runner length since the turbo doesn't mount in the center. It's cheap too at $2250, but the GT2871 turbo is outdated and is going to flow less than the turbos in the CTS kit. The GTX series is good for 20% more power than a GT series turbo of the same size, and the GTX will spool up about 400 RPM sooner too. The $800-1000 extra for the CTS kit would be worth it IMO just for the better turbo, plus you get a better manifold, and wouldn't have to create your own turbo outlet pipe. The ATP kit is made for a transverse (GTI, A3, TT) so it doesn't come with the TOP.

Additionally, why would you want to connect to the factory intercooler with a turbo this size? Pardon me for being confused by the appeal of oem+ fit/look. It seems to me the car would likely be moved from the daily driver column to current projects after the clutch and fuel system fall short and like I said you end up with car with marginal power gain over k04 variant systems with a less usable power band.

Not the factory intercooler, just factory location, meaning you don't have to manufacture custom charge piping between the turbo and intercooler. This also includes the turbo outlet pipe, which is not included with the ATP kit.

I'd just argue that the k04 variant turbos hit the sweet spot with these cars for power/fun/reliability/money invested. Maybe you're thinking about making your car into a race machine and in that case again, pardon me.

The k04 is great, but I'm sure some people would like to hit that magic 400 awhp number, which hasn't happened yet on a K04, not even with w/m or E85 I believe. Slowone11 made 410awhp (corrected for elevation), but that's on a Loba LO400 hybrid turbo and custom UM software.

Pag Parts Turbo has a kit that utilizes a slew of EFRs and Garretts if anyone is looking for more meat.

I'd put the PPT in a league above hybrid turbos like the Loba and even this CTS BOSS turbo. Also comes in at $4,200 not including software. It also says it's only for transverse, FWD configurations. I'm sure the kit is built to the best standards and highly capable though.

[Militant-Grunt]

That ATP stock location turbo is not bad, but the 'kit' has been out for a long time and it's the cast, log style manifold that has caused issues for a bunch of the Mk5 BT guys. It doesn't flow evenly and creates some kind of pulsation. Something to do with uneven runner length since the turbo doesn't mount in the center. It's cheap too at $2250, but the GT2871 turbo is outdated and is going to flow less than the turbos in the CTS kit. The GTX series is good for 20% more power than a GT series turbo of the same size, and the GTX will spool up about 400 RPM sooner too. The $800-1000 extra for the CTS kit would be worth it IMO just for the better turbo, plus you get a better manifold, and wouldn't have to create your own turbo outlet pipe. The ATP kit is made for a transverse (GTI, A3, TT) so it doesn't come with the TOP.

Not the factory intercooler, just factory location, meaning you don't have to manufacture custom charge piping between the turbo and intercooler. This also includes the turbo outlet pipe, which is not included with the ATP kit.

The k04 is great, but I'm sure some people would like to hit that magic 400 awhp number, which hasn't happened yet on a K04, not even with w/m or E85 I believe. Slowone11 made 410awhp (corrected for elevation), but that's on a Loba LO400 hybrid turbo and custom UM software.

I'd put the PPT in a league above hybrid turbos like the Loba and even this CTS BOSS turbo. Also comes in at $4,200 not including software. It also says it's only for transverse, FWD configurations. I'm sure the kit is built to the best standards and highly capable though.

I inquired with Ppt the other day about a longitudinal B8 kit, he quoted me 3695 for the hardware kit with a EFR 6758. Comes with intake and a cat delete pipe along with all hardware. He told me he has a inhouse B8 currently in production, he will be publishing build photos in the near future but he mentioned its already availble for order now.

I had one of his kits on my usp avant, Im playing around with the idea of doing a b8 allroad now.

[Zach L]

I inquired with Ppt the other day about a longitudinal B8 kit, he quoted me 3695 for the hardware kit with a EFR 6758. Comes with intake and a cat delete pipe along with all hardware. He told me he has a inhouse B8 currently in production, he will be publishing build photos in the near future but he mentioned its already availble for order now.

That's great, you should make a thread for the PPT kit. Or make a general 'Big Turbo' thread, if one doesn't already exist for our platform. This thread is intended to be for this specific turbo upgrade, production updates, and discussion once it's on the road, hence the thread title.

[KFizz]

Hopefully this turbo kit is made to higher standards than their exhaust components. What prices of shit those things were...... Unreal.

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[Zach L]

Hopefully this turbo kit is made to higher standards than their exhaust components. What prices of shit those things were...... Unreal.

Their products over the years have been generally high quality, including their exhausts. There are a ton of people running their K04 kit on the B8 A4 without any issues II'm aware of. Nonetheless, sometimes things can be overlooked in quality control, just as we often do with misspelling words ;-)

[KFizz]

Their products over the years have been generally high quality, including their exhausts. There are a ton of people running their K04 kit on the B8 A4 without any issues II'm aware of. Nonetheless, sometimes things can be overlooked in quality control, just as we often do with misspelling words ;-)

Ha! Touche. :)

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[Brandon K.]

I emailed CTS today to see if they are willing to give a rough ETA for the release on the B8 platform. I doubt they will give one but I figured I would try. With the APR kit not released after almost a year and a half from 1st photos, maybe they will push it through development quickly.


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[VNA4]

I talked to them today as well..
"Hello, the B8 BOSS kit is in development stages. Currenty we do not have any updates as we're working on 2 other vehicles before we start on Audi. Please stay tuned as we will release updates as soon as we can!"
They claim 450-600 hp depending on supporting mods.
Where you at APR?


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[awdconnor]

I talked to them today as well..
"Hello, the B8 BOSS kit is in development stages. Currenty we do not have any updates as we're working on 2 other vehicles before we start on Audi. Please stay tuned as we will release updates as soon as we can!"
They claim 450-600 hp depending on supporting mods.
Where you at APR?


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if this is true, my dreams of owning a 500+awhp a4 could become a reality.. cheaper insurance FTW..

[Brandon K.]

Maybe the fact that today alone, at least two people emailed them about the B8 kit should tell them they need to redirect their focus to Audi! Lord knows that the GTI needs yet one more stage 3 kit to complete with all the others already out and the throngs that are under development.


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[Brandon K.]

Clearly the B8 is chopped liver...


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[Castro_ny]

I talked to them today as well..
"Hello, the B8 BOSS kit is in development stages. Currenty we do not have any updates as we're working on 2 other vehicles before we start on Audi. Please stay tuned as we will release updates as soon as we can!"
They claim 450-600 hp depending on supporting mods.
Where you at APR?


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just happen...


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[Zach L]

I talked to them today as well..
"Hello, the B8 BOSS kit is in development stages. Currenty we do not have any updates as we're working on 2 other vehicles before we start on Audi. Please stay tuned as we will release updates as soon as we can!"
They claim 450-600 hp depending on supporting mods.
Where you at APR?

That's not actual power figures one can count on. Since starting this thread, my assumption has always been 370-420 awhp on 93 pump gas without using water/meth. It's common for companies to write the maximum power capabilities of a specific turbocharger then say "depending on supporting mods". The limiting factor is never the turbocharger. For this car, it will be the fueling system (that has ALWAYS been the case since people started putting large turbos on direct injection engines). The only way someone will get to 600 is if they're running an alternative fuel, or have extensively upgraded the factory fueling system. The factory pumps and injectors are not capable of delivering enough pump gas to create that much power, doesn't matter the turbo.

That said, I'd still be really damn happy knowing I could fill up my A4 with pump gas and drive off with 400+ awhp.

[SleeperCar]

i hopped off the CTS train long ago...ive heard horror stories with their customer service (cracked HFC at welds...blamed it on owner)

[AllroadCorbin]

i hopped off the CTS train long ago...ive heard horror stories with their customer service (cracked HFC at welds...blamed it on owner)

I saw those threads with the cracks. Looked scary. Hope my CTS test pipe and turbo hold up


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[hyperunion]

i hopped off the CTS train long ago...ive heard horror stories with their customer service (cracked HFC at welds...blamed it on owner)

And their intercooler pipes welds breaking!

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[majerrahim]

I saw those threads with the cracks. Looked scary. Hope my CTS test pipe and turbo hold up


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I've been running cts k04 with test pipe for almost 3.5 years and no issue

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[Zach L]

And their intercooler pipes welds breaking!

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i hopped off the CTS train long ago...ive heard horror stories with their customer service (cracked HFC at welds...blamed it on owner)

I saw those threads with the cracks. Looked scary. Hope my CTS test pipe and turbo hold up


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Each of you heard or read about a problem someone else had. If forum members boycotted a company everytime someone else had an issue, there would be no company you could buy products from.

[SleeperCar]

Each of you heard or read about a problem someone else had. If forum members boycotted a company everytime someone else had an issue, there would be no company you could buy products from.

No, I was referencing customer support.... I am a big believer in supporting companies that provide the same support in return to their customers, and one of the guys that had an issue handled it perfectly and CTS didn't seem to provide any positive solutions.

My .02, take it or leave it.

[Zach L]

No, I was referencing customer support.... I am a big believer in supporting companies that provide the same support in return to their customers, and one of the guys that had an issue handled it perfectly and CTS didn't seem to provide any positive solutions.

My .02, take it or leave it.

So what I said is true then.

[SleeperCar]

So what I said is true then.

Yep, it's sort of like reviews on Amazon, shitty reviews? I'm not buying the product, plain and simple

[Zach L]

Yep, it's sort of like reviews on Amazon, shitty reviews? I'm not buying the product, plain and simple

There are shitty reviews for every company in your signature. Even deceitful business practices for some. But I can relate - I won't buy APR.

[SleeperCar]

There are shitty reviews for every company in your signature. Even deceitful business practices for some. But I can relate - I won't buy APR.

Fair enough bro, if you roll with CTS, I hope it works out for you.

I guess I've had good experience with customer support with every company in my signature so it helped in my decision making for all my upgrades

[IHave2Turbos]

I'm not loyal to anyone but if you spend enough time doing anything on the Internet you will realize that people are generally 10x more likely to write bad reviews and almost never write good reviews unless asked specifically for their opinions.

[Roadtrippn]

lol yeah I've seen all those issues with the CTS exhaust. I'm running their K04 and HFC with no issues for a few months now. I thinking of throwing on a USP downpipe soon.

[MoonlightBlue]

Looking at the length of each tube in the manifold, I think the sound is going to be somewhat like a Subaru... I'm liking

- John

[Zach L]

More updates from CTS and United Motorsport for this kit. UM has been doing tuning and has a fueling kit. If this kit is making 475 awhp on the EA888.3, I think 370-420 awhp or more is a reasonable expectation for our cars. There's something magic about that 400 mark.



This is it mounted to an EA113 (Mk6 Golf R), but the manifold and turbo are the same for the EA888.2 (B8 A4).

[Brandon K.]

Fyi: for anybody that is interested in knowing, this was the response I got from Arin when I asked him about what problems APR had with their stage 3 upgrade that made them decide to abandon it.

Could you please add some additional information related the the problems APR ran into? I believe it would be helpful for the community to get some background on what people will be up against if the wait for the CTS Boss kit or try and build one themselves. I am not asking you to tell them it's a bad idea or try to dissuade them, just outline the problems that APR ran into that made them decide to cancel the project.


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There were a lot of limitations on this platform. Based on what we were seeing, we didn't feel comfortable continuing on with the kit. Assuming you have a manual transmission, you'll be the best suited for a bigger turbo, but if you don't properly build the engine with an overbore, with new rods, better pistons, better rings, etc, some, perhaps a lot, may run into longevity issues.

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[2010b8a4apr2]

Well tell Arin, "no shit" that's why they suggested to add those power on, same with the golf r stage 3 builds, they all recommend internals. omg seriously. I was wondering what their deal was. there was a rumor one of their cars grenaded..... I bought all internals too just for that kit. they should just come out with it anyways, they already have most of the parts and tune done. I hate their "b8 a4s are mostly autos and no one wants aftermarket parts for their car" attitude. I really hope someone comes out with a better (higher hp) kit than the k04.

[MoonlightBlue]

Well tell Arin, "no shit" that's why they suggested to add those power on, same with the golf r stage 3 builds, they all recommend internals. omg seriously. I was wondering what their deal was. there was a rumor one of their cars grenaded..... I bought all internals too just for that kit. they should just come out with it anyways, they already have most of the parts and tune done. I hate their "b8 a4s are mostly autos and no one wants aftermarket parts for their car" attitude. I really hope someone comes out with a better (higher hp) kit than the k04.

This. VAG has been making turbo 4's for years and people like us are willing to play with our engines to make big power. Literally everyone (in the car community) with a 4 cylinder VW, Audi, or Porsche wants to mod his/her car. Audizine would die if this were untrue. I mean, you look at the WRX/STI, EVO, and all these other AWD 4 cylinder cars and they can get parts new for cheaper prices than we can buy shift knobs. It's crazy that only 2-3 tuner packages have been developed for these platforms, especially with such spacious engine bays.

I'll gladly wait and save for a built motor and CTS kit.

- John

[2010b8a4apr2]

until 2 years later they say the same thing......lol

idk I think apr should just come out with the kit and see how much money they actually make from people who want this kit