Apr stage 2 b8 s4 vs f80 m3/m4

[s4boost]

How do we measure up in a straight line? I can find no videos. Apr claims about 460-470hp with tune pulley and intake.

[treejs4]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...aced-a-2015-M3

Happy reading

[GRUMPY-S4]

Quarter the tuned S vs a stock F80... S

On the street from a Roll to 120... F80

[Loe]

They have the advantage as you go up in elevation, but here at near sea-level they are trapping about 114-116mph stock at my track (but normally in the mid-low 12's), which puts its right in stage II terrority on pump gas, and slightly behind on race or an E85/93 mix in terms of trap speeds.

However, get a piggy or flash on an M3/M4 and we are behind to where it makes you wonder why bother even modding an S4/S5

[s4boost]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...aced-a-2015-M3

Happy reading

I've read through most of this. It's nauseatingly long. And most of the contents are before apr's revision. So I wanted a bit more current information since the hp increase.

They have the advantage as you go up in elevation, but here at near sea-level they are trapping about 114-116mph stock at my track (but normally in the mid-low 12's), which puts its right in stage II terrority on pump gas, and slightly behind on race or an E85/93 mix in terms of trap speeds.

However, get a piggy or flash on an M3/M4 and we are behind to where it makes you wonder why bother even modding an S4/S5

Yea I know. I looked at the JB4 numbers and was like WHOAAAAAA. Haha. That's insane.

[AmrS4]

That's the beauty of a turbo engine + burger tuning !!

[andthen]

I did a pull with a friend, brand new F82 M3 2015, stock. From a 20 Roll I had him by a car or so up to 120. Then he drove right by.

This was with stage 2 EPL E85 before I went double pulleys. Should be similar results with APR 104 tune. YMMV.

He has since gone jb4 and I have gone double pulley still running E85. Rematch soon. ;)


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[firstars]

Im APR Stage 2. Did a 50-120 pull with friends JB4 M4 (only other mod he has is AWE nonres). Was car or two behind by 120 but wasn't a complete slaughter at all!

[AudiTFSI3o3]

Raced n F80 M4 a week ago from a dig. I had him till 3rd then i let off.

also at 5280 elevation lolol

[Luna's S4]

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...aced-a-2015-M3

Happy reading

That was cruel. Lol!

[s4boost]

Raced n F80 M4 a week ago from a dig. I had him till 3rd then i let off.

also at 5280 elevation lolol

How do you like the dl501 tune? Was he gaining on you? I'd imagine 120+ the m will be faster

[Whitee]

Im APR Stage 2. Did a 50-120 pull with friends JB4 M4 (only other mod he has is AWE nonres). Was car or two behind by 120 but wasn't a complete slaughter at all!

So you kept up with a car that is lighter and makes over 500whp, something doesn't add up here. Not to mention it would rip a stage 2 car a new asshole from a roll.

An avg 1/4 mile trap for a tune only M4 is over 120mph, unless you are in the top couple 1/4 mile times for S4s you wouldn't stand much of a chance, especially from a roll.

I love my S4 and it's a powerful machine for what it is but I don't compare it to an M4 that if I put a piggyback tune and E85 on I would make close to 550whp and be deep into the 11s, possibly 10s with a tire....

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[AmrS4]

Those cars with a tune and downpipes are doing high 120s with traps . Even an upgraded blower car will get beat!! Just saying , I came from a 550whp 335xi with upgraded turbos and was all around those cars . Different level

[saxon]

having owned both i would say i could give some insight...

from a dig a stock s4 will pull out on the m3 but lose in a 1/4 mile
from a dig with stage 2 s4 on race gas will beat a stock m3 in the 1/4 mile

from a roll a stock s4 will get pulled on very easily by a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 will be pretty even with a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 on race gas will get pulled on pretty easily by a tuned pump gas m3

i think the s4 is better in 90% of situations especially with the dual pulley tunes that are available

[Sudz]

having owned both i would say i could give some insight...

from a dig a stock s4 will pull out on the m3 but lose in a 1/4 mile
from a dig with stage 2 s4 on race gas will beat a stock m3 in the 1/4 mile

from a roll a stock s4 will get pulled on very easily by a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 will be pretty even with a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 on race gas will get pulled on pretty easily by a tuned pump gas m3

i think the s4 is better in 90% of situations especially with the dual pulley tunes that are available

I agree 100%, the Audi is quick from a dig but not a roll.

Now if it's wet out, I'm betting on the S4.

[ENV²]

I love these comparisons. If people want fast there is always something else faster out there. I may go for the best bang for the buck car next. C6 Z06 so I can run tens with just tires. Run low tens high 9s with bolt ons. And make better noises than the M3 or my old b8 s4.

Truth is the F8x M3/4 are faster than the B8 S4/5 its pretty cut and dry. B8s can keep up with full mods to a stock M, but then a slightly modded F8x M will always win.

[AudiTFSI3o3]

How do you like the dl501 tune? Was he gaining on you? I'd imagine 120+ the m will be faster

Yeah he started to gain when I was ahead maybe 3 cars ahead. I definitely know if we kept going he would've pulled ahead easy.

as for the DL501, i'm happy with it. It's buggy every once in a while but I can live with it. and even LC at 6000k rpm I can't complain lol.

[s4boost]

having owned both i would say i could give some insight...

from a dig a stock s4 will pull out on the m3 but lose in a 1/4 mile
from a dig with stage 2 s4 on race gas will beat a stock m3 in the 1/4 mile

from a roll a stock s4 will get pulled on very easily by a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 will be pretty even with a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 on race gas will get pulled on pretty easily by a tuned pump gas m3

i think the s4 is better in 90% of situations especially with the dual pulley tunes that are available

/thread

Thanks Saxon!

[S4_Pilot]

Here you go. Raced my buddy's modified M4 4 times and went 4 and 0. Owned him at the line, but he was making up a lot of ground in the back half.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1vPHsaoSYEs

[roadawg]

Only chance the s4 has is off the line, traction advantage. Otherwise any other real world scenario they are faster cars and making a lot more power stock or tuned.

It's like saying you'll beat a novice driver in any high powered rwd car. It's non sense, the new m cars are easily over 500 whp with a simple tune. What exactly are we talking about here?

Maybe revert to the first thing I said.

[pdqgp]

having owned both i would say i could give some insight...

from a dig a stock s4 will pull out on the m3 but lose in a 1/4 mile
from a dig with stage 2 s4 on race gas will beat a stock m3 in the 1/4 mile

from a roll a stock s4 will get pulled on very easily by a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 will be pretty even with a stock m3
from a roll a stage 2 s4 on race gas will get pulled on pretty easily by a tuned pump gas m3

i think the s4 is better in 90% of situations especially with the dual pulley tunes that are available

^^ find the above to be pretty accurate. I ran one on the freeway and it was pretty even until we past 120mph then he started pulling but not hard. I shut down at 135'ish he kept going. Rare in my world that I'd take it that high on the freeway for many reasons thus overall, they may have the edge up top, I'll take ours where we have it, down low. Most fun I find on public roads are from lights or lower speed rolls both of which allow our cars to do very well or excel against quite a bit out there.

In the end both are respectable and fun. I'll take AWD all day though as it's fun in nearly 100% of weather conditions. I find it more fun in rain or on cold roads Overall the S4 to me is a better Daily Driver than an M-Series would be thus why I chose to go with it.

[Whitee]

Here you go. Raced my buddy's modified M4 4 times and went 4 and 0. Owned him at the line, but he was making up a lot of ground in the back half.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1vPHsaoSYEs

So you beat a car that spun through 2 gears, congrats.


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[Tuneman7]

So you beat a car that spun through 2 gears, congrats.


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Power means nothing if you can't put it to the ground.

[dansjuice]

A car pulling a head of me at 120MPH means nothing to me. Beating nearly any car off the line and being quicker in the low speeds on the street means everything to me. I can enjoy this all the time rather then a tough to find felony 120MPH roll with someone.

[LINDW4LL]

i think the s4 is better in 90% of situations especially with the dual pulley tunes that are available

Yes. Hard to disagree.

The real question is, which is more fun?

[jokingjimmy]

Yes. Hard to disagree.

The real question is, which is more fun?

The real question is what are you using the car for. Weekend driver? Daily driver? Drag racing? Tracking?

An Ariel Atom would be more fun than both these cars, but I'll be damned if I'm driving one to work every day.

Saxon's post is pretty spot on, imo.

[MrFunk]

Yes. Hard to disagree.

The real question is, which is more fun?

Exactly...

[Whitee]

Power means nothing if you can't put it to the ground.

If an inexperienced driver drives a car with 500whp and goes WOT of the line of course it's going spin. The driver was beat here, not the car. Winning is winning, but in reality I don't think our cars are faster, they are quicker.


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[Tuneman7]

If an inexperienced driver drives a car with 500whp and goes WOT of the line of course it's going spin. The driver was beat here, not the car. Winning is winning, but in reality I don't think our cars are faster, they are quicker.


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Yes, that's not to say of course the M3 faster but I think something can be said for a car with that much power that's controllable and accessible.

The M3 already puts down nearly 500 hp - 500 lb/ft at the crank stock and is a power sliding machine, I'm sure that JB4 tune isn't helping the cause without wheel/tire upgrades. Maybe some of the M3/M4 owners on here can chime in on this.

[MaX PL]

i wish bimmerpost had a dedicated subforum for performance info, but last i remember, most stock cars were running 11.9 to 12.1 stock last summer with the fastest stock car running 11.7.

so yeh, the tuned car above was either lacking tire, driver, or something else. most JB4 cars are running low 11s and not 12.4 or whatever he ran.

fastest tuned car now is 10.7 I think. pretty good for such a young platform.

[S4_Pilot]

Someone asked for real world comparisons and I posted mine. You can clearly see the BMW makes more power, and is trapping significantly faster. Traction is a significant problem though. In slicks the BMW wins every time. In summers, it's much closer. The fact remains, my buddy ran mid 11's in a modified 135, and the best he could do in a DSG M4 was 12.22. Is the car capable of more - absolutely. On the same day, same track and same tires (Pilot Super Sports) I ran 4 times between 11.82 to 12:16; he ran 12.22, 12:44 and then 2 embarrassing times.

I'm not saying the S4 is better or faster, but I wasn't racing my grandmother either. With a good driver in both cars - the BMW wins. With an average driver in both cars its anyone's race as the S4 is much more consistent.

So you beat a car that spun through 2 gears, congrats.


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[s4boost]

So what if you destroy a v8 vantage getting on the interstate. Cause that happened. And he was not happy when my Audi sedan walked by.

[jokingjimmy]

i wish bimmerpost had a dedicated subforum for performance info, but last i remember, most stock cars were running 11.9 to 12.1 stock last summer with the fastest stock car running 11.7.

so yeh, the tuned car above was either lacking tire, driver, or something else. most JB4 cars are running low 11s and not 12.4 or whatever he ran.

fastest tuned car now is 10.7 I think. pretty good for such a young platform.

The fastest tuned S4 right now was on summers (not slicks), no weight reduction with bolt ons, Stage 2 beta on E85, 1/4 @ 11.4. AWD really is the deal changer here. Hellcat would embarrass all of our cars straight line, but it just can't get all that power down.

For me, I'm not interested in beating anyone after 120. I just want to be able to get away from the assholes. This means zero to XXmph, from 20 roll, etc. and in all conditions, especially in rain. Seen way too many examples of RWD cars lose it when punching it on dry asphalt, like Bimmers, 'Murican muscle, etc.

It's still crazy (but awesome) that we can still even compare the S to the M. Supposed to be an RS to an M lol.

[doug97gxe]

Here you go. Raced my buddy's modified M4 4 times and went 4 and 0. Owned him at the line, but he was making up a lot of ground in the back half.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1vPHsaoSYEs

2.1 and 2.2 60ft? good lord.. he needs to either invest in better tires or get better at launching that car

[Ze_Nardo6]

As the previous owner of a 500+rwhp Saleen, power isn't shit without traction. I rode around on street legal DR's and still didn't have a 1st gear, barely a 2nd. Even though the Saleen was lighter and had more power than my S4, the S4 would still edge it out from a dig or anything under a 30 roll. I would gladly take a 450awhp car over a 500rwhp car all things being equal.

It seems that the only cars that can truly make use of 600+ crank horsepower engines are very high end models. i.e. mclaren, ferrari, etc. They can actually put that power down with RWD.

[doug97gxe]

As the previous owner of a 500+rwhp Saleen, power isn't shit without traction. I rode around on street legal DR's and still didn't have a 1st gear, barely a 2nd. Even though the Saleen was lighter and had more power than my S4, the S4 would still edge it out from a dig or anything under a 30 roll. I would gladly take a 450awhp car over a 500rwhp car all things being equal.

It seems that the only cars that can truly make use of 600+ crank horsepower engines are very high end models. i.e. mclaren, ferrari, etc. They can actually put that power down with RWD.

As previous owner of a 550 whp rwd car.. i had no problem with street tires .. i actually had more trouble when i bought the car with 240ish whp learning to drive it than i did with 550 whp ..

[Ze_Nardo6]

As previous owner of a 550 whp rwd car.. i had no problem with street tires .. i actually had more trouble when i bought the car with 240ish whp learning to drive it than i did with 550 whp ..

I have driving skills, I'll leave it at that. My point stands.

[doug97gxe]

I have driving skills, I'll leave it at that. My point stands.

wasn't discrediting that.. i'm sure a 500 whp v8 has way more violent power delivery than a 500 turbo 6 .. just saying with enough seat time the m4 driver will get better with the car

[Ze_Nardo6]

wasn't discrediting that.. i'm sure a 500 whp v8 has way more violent power delivery than a 500 turbo 6 .. just saying with enough seat time the m4 driver will get better with the car

100% agree

[pdqgp]

At the end of the day both cars are great, close in performance but meant to serve different audiences for some simliar but not nearly the same purposes overall. The M3/4 are great cars and no doubt can move out but they have limitations too. IMO a Stage II S4 is darn near the perfect Daily. Priced well, moves out just fine, has AWD capability, creature comforts, etc. and again, I can't stress enough that it's nearly as fun in rain and cold as it is in when dry. Not so with the M series.