2015 S3 Sway Bars.

[JsnMR2]

So who's got the H&R sway bars installed? I'm just wondering if they are worthwhile.

The OEM bars are 24mm Front, and 21mm Rear.

The H&R bars are 27mm Front, and 24mm Rear.

I auto cross my S3 locally once per month. I'm a pretty competitive driver, so I'm looking for any advantage I can get. I already have H&R Sport springs installed, and just got my new tires put on. The car was a rollie pollie out there, so I'd like to keep the car a little more flat, while minimizing or eliminating understeer. Honestly, understeer was not horrible (on the OEM tires) but I was purposely driving to avoid it.

The springs moved me from stock class, to street touring. In street touring, front and rear sway bars are allowed.

Are there other bars being developed? ECS? APR?

If you have aftermarket sway bars installed, I'd love to read everyones review.

[949]

im waiting for whiteline to make some.
hopefully some adjustables and their heavy duty versions.
had theirs in my sti subaru and it was freak in awesome. it felt like i was on rails and on the freeway it was so steady.

[mattchow]

I'm waiting for ST/KW.

[amd is the best]

I'm waiting for Neuspeed and Hotchkis to come out with their options.

[LOT4R]

And I'm just waiting... ;)'

[BlackAudi87]

lol me too

And I'm just waiting... ;)'

[949]

And I'm just waiting... ;)'

...but were all anticipating.

[ndk83]

Im intersted in knowing if a coilover upgrade would benefit from swaybars?

[949]

of course. when i did my custom setup on my sti i had a custom setup made for me. my advice is unless unhave super smooth roads daily or its a track only car, heavy suspension with stiff sway bars can be very harsh for a daily.

[JGreen76]

I'll let you know of you have not pulled the trigger yet. Ordered mine last night.


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[jgreer3746]

I was on the other forum and this guy has one:
http://forums.fourtitude.com/showthr...-thread!/page4

[S 3]

Let me know if I can answer any questions you have. Personally I love the new firmer and sharper feel. I have H&R's front (which are adjustable) and rear sway bars installed along with the sport springs and 10mm spacers.

[JGreen76]

S 3, did you get end links? For now I have only ordered (on backorder) the rear. Eurocode just released some links, so I might pick up the rear.

Also, did you install yourself? Wondering how challenging it is w/o a lift.

I will post a review once I've installed them. I am currently on stock suspension. Sure I'm not the only one curious to hear about how it effects the ride of stock suspension.

Shortly after the sway I plan to pull the trigger on some CoilOvers.


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[JsnMR2]

I'm interested in any reviews including auto cross or track experience with new sway bars. A very good and national winning auto crosser told me today, that sway bars MIGHT not be a good idea.

Which BTW, I took 4th in PAX and 1st in class (STX) at our local event today :)

[ModdedEuros]

Some more bars should be rolling out soon. We currently have the H&R ones or just check back for some updates

http://www.moddedeuros.com/audi/s3/8...sion/sway-bars

[slvrb7]

I have some h&r sways haven't installed yet. I'm going to start with the rear and see how it feels then move on to dropping the subframe to install the front.

[S 3]

S 3, did you get end links? For now I have only ordered (on backorder) the rear. Eurocode just released some links, so I might pick up the rear.

Also, did you install yourself? Wondering how challenging it is w/o a lift.

I will post a review once I've installed them. I am currently on stock suspension. Sure I'm not the only one curious to hear about how it effects the ride of stock suspension.

Shortly after the sway I plan to pull the trigger on some CoilOvers.


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JGreen, good question. I actually dnot have end links installed. Since H&R don't offer them and at the time there were no other options, we proceeded without them.

I also didn't install them myself. A friend of mine has access to a lift so it was a no brainer. Based on what he told me, install wasn't hard - just time consuming. I'll have a full review for it soon.

Which coil overs we you leaning towards? Also did you order with mag ride or without? I was doing to do coilovers but I couldn't find any that wouldn't render my drive select useless. Given I also paid $1500 for the performance package, I couldn't justify getting rid of it so quickly.

[reyoasian]

JGreen, good question. I actually dnot have end links installed. Since H&R don't offer them and at the time there were no other options, we proceeded without them.

I also didn't install them myself. A friend of mine has access to a lift so it was a no brainer. Based on what he told me, install wasn't hard - just time consuming. I'll have a full review for it soon.

Which coil overs we you leaning towards? Also did you order with mag ride or without? I was doing to do coilovers but I couldn't find any that wouldn't render my drive select useless. Given I also paid $1500 for the performance package, I couldn't justify getting rid of it so quickly.

I believe KW DDC coilovers are plug and play with the Magnetic Ride system.

[JGreen76]

JGreen, good question. I actually dnot have end links installed. Since H&R don't offer them and at the time there were no other options, we proceeded without them.

I also didn't install them myself. A friend of mine has access to a lift so it was a no brainer. Based on what he told me, install wasn't hard - just time consuming. I'll have a full review for it soon.

Which coil overs we you leaning towards? Also did you order with mag ride or without? I was doing to do coilovers but I couldn't find any that wouldn't render my drive select useless. Given I also paid $1500 for the performance package, I couldn't justify getting rid of it so quickly.

I went with the ST XTA, they're basically KWV2 with a galvanized body opposed to Stainless. I've grown to love them. Perfect with all the adjustability. RSB is chilling in my garage with EuroCode f/R sway end links,adjustable.


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[onequick4door]

Anyone run the Nuespeed F & R sway bars?

They have an adjustable rear, the only one on the market i'm aware of. I'd like to get some more rotation out of the car and reduce roll in the front. What's interesting is their front bar is 25mm vs H&R of 27mm. Now what really drives a bars performance is the thickness of the tubing, so you really can't go by the pure bar diameter. That said, Neuspeed publishes what their adjustments equates to vs the stock bar. Not sure on how they measure that, but we'll see. Where I'm going with this is, unless someone responds these bars are junk, I'll probably bite the bullet and run them set like this -

Front - Full stiff setting which they publish is a 71% increase in the rate
Rear - Full stiff setting which they publish is at 128% increase in the rate.
Should result in a 57% rate swing to the rear if their numbers are correct.

[afdavey]

H&R Rear only...
Somewhere in this forum I read that someone did both the H&R front and rear and felt the rear made the biggest difference and if he had to do it again - would only do the rear.
The recommendation was spot on - tamed the rear in tight corners - does not lift as much - very happy...
I don't autocross or track the car - big improvement if your into 'spirited ' everyday driving.
$298. shipped from TireRack...

[will13k7]

with just coils and alignment my s3 is flat in the corners and very balanced, but it doesn't feel planted with all the flexing going on. I'm looking forward to all the options that come out over the next year.

[onequick4door]

I agree, the goal is to get the rear firmer than the front. Key point to remember is that the factory doesn't want to mass produce a tail happy car. So assuming the stock bars are baseline of something like 0% - 0% in terms of flex, maybe 0 - 10% vs an aftermarket solution. The reason i believe the H&R set up (F&R) doesn't produce that effect people want(just guessing here) is that the rear rate of the H&R doesn't exceed( or maybe just barely) that of the front. The result is a decrease in the body roll, but because they're maybe an equal improvement(F&R) over the stock bars, you don't get additional rotation. I'm tying that assumption into the stock baseline % rates above. The stock front bar is 24 mm, the H&R rear is 25mm, so its easy to guess why the rear only would give a positive impression, the % increase in the rear rate went over the front. That's why i'm probably going to bite the bullet with the Nuespeeds and see if their numbers are accurate and results in my goal - less front roll and more rotation(on the track).

PS - I won't be on coils, H&R sports, so sways factor more into the equation vs. a good set of coils.

I still would love to know if anyone in an S3 has tried them out.

Good article on sway bars in general -

http://www.vikingspeedshop.com/the-t...out-sway-bars/

[salvadorik]

H&R Rear only...
Somewhere in this forum I read that someone did both the H&R front and rear and felt the rear made the biggest difference and if he had to do it again - would only do the rear.
The recommendation was spot on - tamed the rear in tight corners - does not lift as much - very happy...
I don't autocross or track the car - big improvement if your into 'spirited ' everyday driving.
$298. shipped from TireRack...

Yeah- I remember writing a long response trying to explain how replacing the front bar (from stock to h&r) won't yield same "feel" in improved handling. http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...3-Thread/page2

It has been 10months (odo at about 9K miles) now I own the S3. I totally forgot how it felt right off the box but it sure does feel very stiff now, especially after adding unibrace UBQ. erocode tuning's rear strut bar. One last bar that I think my car is missing is the proper front strut bar. I think it may even be a more preferable choice over front sway bar. Does anybody know where I can get good quality front strut bar for S3 8V? Eurocode tuning has one but it is for A3/GTI only, wont fit S3 (at least according to Eurocode).

[EmmanueleDesign]

We have been working on our rear bar for a number of months now and are very close to release. It is designed to pair with the factory front, while reducing the slight understeer present in the factory setup. The goal was to have as small of an increase in stiffness as possible, while keeping the rear planted and allowing "point and shoot" turn-in. We have a number of beta testers in here that can chime in. It's 100% made in the USA with CNC billet brackets, at a lower price point than the current options on the market.

FWIW our MK7 GTI has both front and rear ST sway bars with similar other mods, and the S3 honestly has crisper turn-in.

[onequick4door]

I would throw this comment in as well on end links. If you get a bar get adjustable end links. Emmaunele and Eurocode sell rears and EC sells fronts. They are important for two reasons. One, they take out the preload of the bar and also have a lot less deflection therefore ensuring that bar works as designed. When I changed my front brake pads for the track, I was quite shocked at how pitful the front end links were. Stamped steel in a u bend. I could easily flex them with little effort. I can only imagine what they looked like when ran over any of the gators at the track.

[phillyquattro]

Like onequick4door noted: if you lower your car you should change the end links so that at a minimum you avoid the preload that would then be placed on the sway bars. The front end links are particularly crappy too. Spulen and 034 also make front end links for our cars.

List of available end links (to my knowledge, as of this date)

Front End Links:
034 Motorsport
Spulen
Eurocode
Whiteline
VWR

Rear End Links:
Neuspeed
Emmanuele Design
Eurocode

[EmmanueleDesign]

Like onequick4door noted: if you lower your car you should change the end links so that at a minimum you avoid the preload that would then be placed on the sway bars. The front end links are particularly crappy too. Spulen and 034 also make front end links for our cars.

List of available end links (to my knowledge, as of this date)

Front End Links:
034 Motorsport
Spulen
Eurocode

Rear End Links:
Neuspeed
Emmanuele Design
Eurocode

The front end links are actually the same as the older cars (MK6, 8P, etc.) so we have been using Whiteline as well.

[phillyquattro]

The front end links are actually the same as the older cars (MK6, 8P, etc.) so we have been using Whiteline as well.

Thanks for the tip! Updated my list

[onequick4door]

Anyone have a DIY on dropping the front subframe to be able to change out the front sway bar? I haven't looked under the car particularly hard, but was wondering.

[salvadorik]

I would throw this comment in as well on end links. If you get a bar get adjustable end links. Emmaunele and Eurocode sell rears and EC sells fronts. They are important for two reasons. One, they take out the preload of the bar and also have a lot less deflection therefore ensuring that bar works as designed. When I changed my front brake pads for the track, I was quite shocked at how pitful the front end links were. Stamped steel in a u bend. I could easily flex them with little effort. I can only imagine what they looked like when ran over any of the gators at the track.

I understand that you need to get adjustable links if the car is lowered to take out the preload. Now what about only for those who changed the bars but still riding on stock suspension (meaning did not change anything but bars)? I have H&R front and rear sway bars but I didn't change the links though and other suspension components. The car drives great but I am not sure if I change the links it will make a difference.

[onequick4door]

For every day street driving I think it would be minimal, but any spirited driving it would make a difference. More so in the front than the back in my opinion. The front link is pitiful and will flex like crazy even just pushing it hard on a back road. The rear would be negligible from what I observed. It's some kind of hard composite, so the only deflection I think would be in the bushings. If you autocross or go the road course, I would do both so you get 100% of the gain from the bar.

[salvadorik]

For every day street driving I think it would be minimal, but any spirited driving it would make a difference. More so in the front than the back in my opinion. The front link is pitiful and will flex like crazy even just pushing it hard on a back road. The rear would be negligible from what I observed. It's some kind of hard composite, so the only deflection I think would be in the bushings. If you autocross or go the road course, I would do both so you get 100% of the gain from the bar.

Thanks for quick response. Yeah I agree regarding the front links. They indeed seem to be weak especially compared to the beefy 27mm H&R front bar. That was my concern when I asked the shop who installed the bars. They said the stock links may seem weak but they are strong enough to tolerate the stress from the upgraded bar so that is why I did not do it. Another thing that I am also concerned about is if I upgrade the front links it will add additional front stiffness, which in effect will increase understeer.

[salvadorik]

Thanks for the tip! Updated my list

I guess one more option that we have but they are kinda pricy. In return I guess you get a highly researched and developed front links.
VWR adjustable front end links. They do fit S3 8V:

http://www.uspmotorsports.com/Steeri...FY17fgod5h8CKQ

[onequick4door]

Dang that's expensive.

[phillyquattro]

Damn, those are super expensive. They sure do look fancy though.

[salvadorik]

I wonder what is the difference between the most expensive ones (VWR - $299) and the cheapest links (Spulen - $104). The price difference is substantial, $195. Generally all of them seem to be similar, i.e. all of them are adjustable and have spherical bearings, as apposed to stock rubber bushings. The next most expensive pair of front links is from 034Motorsport. 034 claims that their front links are the only options with high misalignment sphericals, whatever that means. Anyway what I wanna know is if the price difference is truly due to the superior quality (better materials used, built quality etc) and better performance. Or is it mostly due to the name/brand, VWR in particular.

[EmmanueleDesign]

I wonder what is the difference between the most expensive ones (VWR - $299) and the cheapest links (Spulen - $104). The price difference is substantial, $195. Generally all of them seem to be similar, i.e. all of them are adjustable and have spherical bearings, as apposed to stock rubber bushings. The next most expensive pair of front links is from 034Motorsport. 034 claims that their front links are the only options with high misalignment sphericals, whatever that means. Anyway what I wanna know is if the price difference is truly due to the superior quality (better materials used, built quality etc) and better performance. Or is it mostly due to the name/brand, VWR in particular.

A lot of the cost is in the bearings. There is a pretty wide spread in quality and each bearing manufacturer also has differing price brackets. A cheap bearing is going to wear out quickly, while a more expensive option is designed to handle multiple seasons of motorsport and off-road conditions.

The next main cost would be the use of misalignment spacers. Depending on the factory design, they aren't always needed but they do provide additional range of motion. Most spacers are machined from 303 stainless, which can add up quickly.

[rs200z]

Need some advice here, I am currently running upgraded sway bars (both front and rear) with H&R Sport springs. With the addition of adjustable end-links which removes the preload, what kind of changes in handling and ride comfort can I expect? Is it going to be an improvement in handling but ride comfort might suffer more as it's stiffer now?

[13B]

Just spit balling and reading the comments, but I wonder if downsizing the front sway bar would be another option to installing a stiffer rear bar.