Oil Additives

[mistral cytz]

Does anyone use oil additives with their S4? I don't think a single vehicle manufacturer will have an owners manual that does not state to avoid the use of any oil additives but I've looked at the Liqui Molly synthetic oil additive and it says that it can enhance lubrication and quiet engine noise. I know a high quality synthetic engine oil recommended for our cars is normally more than enough and that change interval is very important, but if this Liqui Molly synthetic oil stabilizer has better lubricating properties that keeps timing components quiet and lubricated during start up I'd be willing to give it a try to see if it has an effect on start up rattle.

[Slow4]

Why don't you just go up in oil weight, 0w-40 to 5w-40?

I originally put M1 0w-40 until recently when I switched to Rotella 5w-40 @99,5. The engine definitely quieted down from the normal noise.

Perhaps DPARM could answer your question and mine for better clarification.

[dparm]

Not really necessary. Most of those additives use dubious ingredients that just thicken things up a bit (because everyone of course thinks that thicker = better protection). Feel free to try them, though I think you won't notice any difference. I've not really seen any oil analyses that definitively proved there was a huge improvement.

Are you certain that something is inadequate about what's in there now? Lubricants do not fix mechanical problems, they just mask them. In other words, an additive or heavier oil is not going to magically solve a timing chain issue, though it might hide the noise. And noise is not really anything to be worried about. Some oils are just noisier than others, for whatever reason. If you are topping the oil off over the course of a change interval, that's a good thing since the additive pack is getting replenished.

My opinion is that if you are using a quality oil and changing it at a reasonable interval, that's the best you can do.

I suppose if you are curious you could try it and get it analyzed afterward.

[Guitarmageddon]

Not really necessary. Most of those additives use dubious ingredients that just thicken things up a bit (because everyone of course thinks that thicker = better protection). Feel free to try them, though I think you won't notice any difference. I've not really seen any oil analyses that definitively proved there was a huge improvement.

Are you certain that something is inadequate about what's in there now? Lubricants do not fix mechanical problems, they just mask them. In other words, an additive or heavier oil is not going to magically solve a timing chain issue, though it might hide the noise. And noise is not really anything to be worried about. Some oils are just noisier than others, for whatever reason. If you are topping the oil off over the course of a change interval, that's a good thing since the additive pack is getting replenished.

My opinion is that if you are using a quality oil and changing it at a reasonable interval, that's the best you can do.

I suppose if you are curious you could try it and get it analyzed afterward.

I would do two intervals without additive and get them tested, then do one with and see the change

[mistral cytz]

I currently use motul xcess 5w-40 and have also ran Mobil 1 0w-40 and Liqui Molly 5w-40 in the past with no difference it start up rattle or engine noise. I've read that the additives thicken up the oil but also have properties that help an oil film adhere to engine internals better which could possibly maintain better start up protection to the timing components. Again, I'm not assuming this to be the case and I'm only wondering if others have given these a try and had results to share. Perhaps either way I'll give it a try.

[dparm]

I currently use motul xcess 5w-40 and have also ran Mobil 1 0w-40 and Liqui Molly 5w-40 in the past with no difference it start up rattle or engine noise. I've read that the additives thicken up the oil but also have properties that help an oil film adhere to engine internals better which could possibly maintain better start up protection to the timing components. Again, I'm not assuming this to be the case and I'm only wondering if others have given these a try and had results to share. Perhaps either way I'll give it a try.

No, they won't make the oil "sticky" for long periods of time. There are some plating effects that happen with the molybdenum disulfide (MoS2) additive.

Oils with esters can have a similar sticky effect because the oil has a polar attraction to the metal. We are talking an extremely thin layer of oil (a few molecules), and it probably doesn't linger for a very long time, such as overnight.

The amount of oil in the timing system after the car has been sitting is very little. It always takes a few seconds to build full oil pressure in a cold motor, and no additive is going to suddenly fix that. I think you are barking up the wrong tree here.

[mistral cytz]

No, they won't make the oil "sticky" for long periods of time. There are some plating effects that happen with the molybdenum disulfide (MoS2) additive.

Oils with esters can have a similar sticky effect because the oil has a polar attraction to the metal. We are talking an extremely thin layer of oil (a few molecules), and it probably doesn't linger for a very long time, such as overnight.

The amount of oil in the timing system after the car has been sitting is very little. It always takes a few seconds to build full oil pressure in a cold motor, and no additive is going to suddenly fix that. I think you are barking up the wrong tree here.

I'm not barking up any tree and I'm also not an idiot that believes everything I read on the back of a bottle! I was simply asking if anyone has used or uses synthetic oil additives and noticed any reduction in start up noise since the manufacturers of some of these products claim that they can quiet engine noise and provide enhanced lubrication/protection etc.. I will consider trying the Liqui Molly additive on my next oil change and have an oil analysis done to compare with a plain used oil sample from my car.

[0396]

I use two pints of Swepco Oil Improver when I do an oil change. As for this oil improver, it contains moly in it along with many other oil fortifiers. As a company, Swepco main target audience is the heavy machinery industry where as these run 24/7.
In the 70/80 when Porsche was running their 934/935 race cars, the trans ring and pinion would be toast after a race. Some tried Swepco 210 ( trans fluid ) and the rest is history in the Porsche circles.
As for oil, I run M-1 0/40 with Swepco...my S/4 runs quite as the day I bought it in 2004. Noise...yes with the hood up, I can hear some injectors / valve noise.- no start up noise too

Everyone's experience will differ. But that's what I've used all these years.

[mistral cytz]

I use two pints of Swepco Oil Improver when I do an oil change. As for this oil improver, it contains moly in it along with many other oil fortifiers. As a company, Swepco main target audience is the heavy machinery industry where as these run 24/7.
In the 70/80 when Porsche was running their 934/935 race cars, the trans ring and pinion would be toast after a race. Some tried Swepco 210 ( trans fluid ) and the rest is history in the Porsche circles.
As for oil, I run M-1 0/40 with Swepco...my S/4 runs quite as the day I bought it in 2004. Noise...yes with the hood up, I can hear some injectors / valve noise.- no start up noise too

Everyone's experience will differ. But that's what I've used all these years.

Thanks for sharing your experience. When Im ready to try something I'll look into the Swepco.

[0396]

I use two pints of Swepco Oil Improver when I do an oil change. As for this oil improver, it contains moly in it along with many other oil fortifiers. As a company, Swepco main target audience is the heavy machinery industry where as these run 24/7.
In the 70/80 when Porsche was running their 934/935 race cars, the trans ring and pinion would be toast after a race. Some tried Swepco 210 ( trans fluid ) and the rest is history in the Porsche circles.
As for oil, I run M-1 0/40 with Swepco...my S/4 runs quite as the day I bought it in 2004. Noise...yes with the hood up, I can hear some injectors / valve noise.- no start up noise too

Everyone's experience will differ. But that's what I've used all these years.

I would also like to add, not to be cheap. I also put Swepco oil improver in all my cars...track Porsche , street Honda etc.

[Brettannica]

noticed any reduction in start up noise since the manufacturers of some of these products claim that they can quiet engine noise and provide enhanced lubrication/protection etc..

I figured Dparm had already answered that...

Lubricants do not fix mechanical problems, they just mask them. In other words, an additive or heavier oil is not going to magically solve a timing chain issue, though it might hide the noise. And noise is not really anything to be worried about.

By barking up the wrong tree IMO he’s simply stating save your money on additives and stick with a good quality oil.

[RPMtech147]

0-40 is too dang thin! The only reason they ever put that water in a crankcase is to appease the left wing tree-huggers. I do 20w50 full syn in whatever I own and in whatevers on sale during the ball sweat nasty hot houston heat. Loosen it up to 10-30 if it's a little cooler where you are. -Stick with a name brand, Mobil1, Castrol, Liqui Molly, etc. Stop wasting your money on additives.

You only want 0wGarbage oil when your trying to operate at Space Vacuum Cold like conditions where its just a tick above −273.15°, or absolute 0 when you start it up in the morning.

If you want to quiet a noisy motor use sawdust or banana peals or both. Itll keep a rod knock quiet enough to get it off the lot, not kidding.

[dparm]

0-40 is too dang thin! The only reason they ever put that water in a crankcase is to appease the left wing tree-huggers. I do 20w50 full syn in whatever I own and in whatevers on sale during the ball sweat nasty hot houston heat. Loosen it up to 10-30 if it's a little cooler where you are. -Stick with a name brand, Mobil1, Castrol, Liqui Molly, etc. Stop wasting your money on additives.

You only want 0wGarbage oil when your trying to operate at Space Vacuum Cold like conditions where its just a tick above −273.15°, or absolute 0 when you start it up in the morning.

If you want to quiet a noisy motor use sawdust or banana peals or both. Itll keep a rod knock quiet enough to get it off the lot, not kidding.

I hope that this is a joke/troll post. There's so much that is blatantly wrong that I don't even know where to start.

[dparm]

By barking up the wrong tree IMO he’s simply stating save your money on additives and stick with a good quality oil.

Correct, not sure why OP is taking it personally.

[Brettannica]

0-40 is too dang thin! The only reason they ever put that water in a crankcase is to appease the left wing tree-huggers. I do 20w50 full syn in whatever I own and in whatevers on sale during the ball sweat nasty hot houston heat. Loosen it up to 10-30 if it's a little cooler where you are. -Stick with a name brand, Mobil1, Castrol, Liqui Molly, etc. Stop wasting your money on additives.

You only want 0wGarbage oil when your trying to operate at Space Vacuum Cold like conditions where its just a tick above −273.15°, or absolute 0 when you start it up in the morning.

If you want to quiet a noisy motor use sawdust or banana peals or both. Itll keep a rod knock quiet enough to get it off the lot, not kidding.