do I have a bad head gasket/cracked head/or something else?

[Furly]

Ever since I purchased my b6 from a zine member it's been a problem and I'm trying to fix it. I took it to a shop that couldn't find out why I was slowly losing coolant. There were no signs of a leak. So they pressure tested the coolant tank and saw that over an hour or more of time the coolant did very slowly go somewhere. So they stuck a camera into the cylinder and told me they found coolant leaking into the cylinder (I believe cyl1 since it has small misfire)

They think it's a bad head gasket or cracked head, but I've been doing lots of reading and it does not make sense.

My symptoms are not like the ones I'm reading online about bad head gaskets.

I don't have oil and coolant mixing. I don't have smoke blowing out of the exhaust, or a sweet coolant smell. The coolant temp gauge does not overheat, after 5-10 min of driving it reaches the middle line and stays there. Only small misfiring at idle. Car has been boosting like crap since I got it (possibly separate issue) and I lose coolant slowly. The car sat for a week while I waited for new plugs and coil packs, when I went to install them I noticed the coolant tank was super low. Well below minimum. The AC blows nice and cold. I have put 2k miles on it like this and it's not overheating even on 100 mile drive.

I have CEL for random misfires and cyl 1 misfire and turbo underboost. After replacing the plugs and coil packs the car didn't shake as bad on cold starts and the CEL and misfires didn't come back for a couple hundred miles and now it's back.

Does this really sound like a head gasket or cracked head problem? Or something else? If so what do you guys think it could be? I would like to get an idea before I pull the head and waste a bunch of time and money and still have the same problems later.
Also it may be possible the previous owner put some stop leak in the coolant tank before selling the car but it's just a possibility I'm not ruling out.
TIA!

[refueler]

I had the same problem of a slow coolant leak I was losing about 1 to 2 cups of coolant per week which was about 700 to 800 miles of driving per week only my car ran and still does run perfect. So after looking at this and other sites I decided to change the rear coolant flange as I saw some pink residue on the bell housing under the flange. Before that I had replaced the timing belt and water pump in Oct. so the water pump is new. My adventure began after replacing the rear flange in March after replacing the flange I didn't have heat any longer. After posting my symptoms here the solutions ranged from plugged heater core to air bubbles trapped in the cooling system. So I tried bleeding the system I tried bleeding the system with engine running, off, hot , cold, I have a steep bank outside of my garage so I tried bleeding with front end raised up the rear up,the right side up and the left side raised up. I continued to drive the car but still no heat and I was still losing 1 to 2 cups of coolant per week. My wife by now was trying to get me to send it to a local mechanic so I did he looked at it and told me to come the car and get his best guess was the thermostat or a blockage some where. So I replaced the thermostat and J plug still no heat not only that the engine didn't heat up any longer so I replaced the thermostat again. This where I learned more about how the coolant system in these cars works from Old Guy and MikTip. The coolant is continually circulated through the small loop which is the engine block/cylinder head, heater core to the hard pipe that distributes coolant to the oil cooler, the turbo , and the thermostat back into the engine and water pump. When additional cooling is required the thermostat opens and allows coolant to flow through the radiator. One other thing is that If when I'm going up long steep hill with the engine RPM above 3000 I get great heat , but it goes away on level ground. The next step was to check out the heater core so I found a local VW/Audi shop that said they could flush the heater core with a pulsating power flush that was completed with no change in the heat. Now through posts here I decided to investigate the possibility of a bad head gasket/cracked head due to the coolant lose and no heat. I found another local VW/Audi mechanic and he diagnosed a bad head gasket/cracked head by pressurizing each cylinder and discovered that the # 2 cylinder created bubbles in the coolant expansion tank when pressurized. So off with its head and I sent it to a machine shop for pressure testing and machining. After replacing the head gasket still no heat so I bought a vacuum coolant fill system and it states in the instructions to evacuate the cooling system observe the static vacuum for 20 sec to determine if there is a leak in the cooling system that's where I am now because I have a leak in the cooling system somewhere. So that's where I stand with mine hope you are able to diagnose your problem.

[old guy]

Furly: Regardless of what ever symptoms you may be experiencing the only way coolant is going to get into the cylinders is through a cracked or warped head or a leaking head gasket. Much more likely to be the latter.

Refueler: I would recommend adding coolant and then pressure test the cooling system to find the source of the leak. You aren't going to find a leak by pulling vacuum. All you can do that way is determine that there is a leak somewhere.

Good luck to both of you!

[DiertyEuroSpec]

I had a warped head and had a slow lose of coolant and misfires only on first 10 to 15 secs of startup. Those were the only symptoms and my head was .008 out of spec. Head and HG issues are abundant on these vehicles. GL

[Furly]

In the case I have a warped head, a machine shop should be able to correct it right? Any ideas on the cost of doing so?
And can any machine shop do it? I'm hoping it's just a gasket but it seems like it can be any of the 3 if not multiple problems

[Furly]

I had a warped head and had a slow lose of coolant and misfires only on first 10 to 15 secs of startup. Those were the only symptoms and my head was .008 out of spec. Head and HG issues are abundant on these vehicles. GL

very similar to mine. Cold start makes the car shake for 5-10sec and it's harder to start the car. When I come to a stop light I can feel very mild constant misfiring. So looks like I'll be ordering a head gasket kit and taking the engine apart
Can anyone point me in the right direction as to everything I'll need to replace while the head is off? So far I'm thinking of ordering this kit, http://www.europaparts.com/cylinder-...tor-reinz.html but I know I'll probably need new head bolts and other things as well. Including a timing belt kit. But not sure what else

It'll be my first time doing head work and first time doing the timing belt. So while it'll be a great learning experience, is there any pointers you guys would give someone like me? I read OG's timing belt thread and I'll be following that too. Thanks everyone !

[refueler]

The machine shop work for my head was $185 included pressure test machining of the head and replace the chain tensioner gasket. The head gasket replacement was not really difficult if you can do the timing belt and water head gasket pump the head gasket is no more difficult than that good luck.

[Furly]

what head gasket kit do you guys recommend? victor reinz? ARP? oem? etc..
i'd like to get a quality set but dont want to pay oem price. also do you recommend ARP head bolts or OEM? i wont be pushing more than 300-350hp out of this thing ever.
also what else do you guys recommend i replace while i am in there? i am getting my list together so i can start ordering parts.

[VAGlover]

How are your heads warping and gaskets failing? Thought the 1.8ts held up quite well in those departments. Significant overheating would cause this but otherwise... Im not sure


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[Furly]

How are your heads warping and gaskets failing? Thought the 1.8ts held up quite well in those departments. Significant overheating would cause this but otherwise... Im not sure


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the car is not overheating. i'm just losing coolant slowly and theres small misfires. 034 said they stuck a camera in the cylinder and found some coolant leaking in there. i asked for pics but nothing yet.
they said they think its either a headgasket, cracked head, or warped head. either way the only way to find out for sure is to pull the head.

the older 1.8's did not have these problems but i guess they do in the B6.

and its not my fault this happened. i bought the car this way. the previous owner screwed me over and he's a member on the zine. car drove fine when i test drove it, but thats because he warmed it up before i came. when i started it on a cold start 2 days later it was shaking for 5-10 sec and had misfires. he may have put leak stop in there also, and i wont find out til i do the head.
he sold me the car with the turbo and clutch barely on its last days of life, the head leaking and numerous other things i have already addressed. and he swore nothing was wrong and that it needed nothing. i guess you cant trust people even if they have been on the zine for quite some time. not only did i pay above book value for it but it came with the most expensive problems an audi can have. guy is a total scumbag, but i'm attempting to fix this and need some advice as to what parts to order. i'll be ordering parts next week and most likely pulling the head over the following weekend with a friend.

[PreciseD]

Yeah so the PO might have led you on, but you should have educated yourself on what to look for before you bought the car. In regards to what you need is up to you and how much money you want to dump into the car.

At the minimum I would mill the head (as long as there is not a crack larger than 1mm) and install new gaskets. If it was me I would do a refresh of the head including valves and the like.

IE sells a complete upper end gasket kit for $139.99
and the machine work cost is up to your local shop, but $200-$250 for a hot tank and mill is about normal.

And This if you need it

[Furly]

Yeah so the PO might have led you on, but you should have educated yourself on what to look for before you bought the car. In regards to what you need is up to you and how much money you want to dump into the car.

At the minimum I would mill the head (as long as there is not a crack larger than 1mm) and install new gaskets. If it was me I would do a refresh of the head including valves and the like.

IE sells a complete upper end gasket kit for $139.99
and the machine work cost is up to your local shop, but $200-$250 for a hot tank and mill is about normal.

And This if you need it

i knew what to look for, but you cant necessarily pull a turbo and inspect the guts while looking at someones car. and a PPI would have not uncovered most of this stuff, because it took 3 trips to 034 to find all these problems.
very expensive lesson learned. next time i will be purchasing only CPO vehicles. not worth the gamble buying used car from someone that lies about the condition and sells you a piece of junk for above book value.

thanks for the links! i'll order the kit. dont know if i need the springs, hoping i dont at this point but the condition is unknown til i pull the head.

whats the hot tank for? to expose cracks? and would you only mill the head if its warped? or just in general do it anyway?
this is my first time doing this job, and my first time ever having a car with head gasket/head problems

[PreciseD]

i knew what to look for, but you cant necessarily pull a turbo and inspect the guts while looking at someones car. and a PPI would have not uncovered most of this stuff, because it took 3 trips to 034 to find all these problems.
very expensive lesson learned. next time i will be purchasing only CPO vehicles. not worth the gamble buying used car from someone that lies about the condition and sells you a piece of junk for above book value.

thanks for the links! i'll order the kit. dont know if i need the springs, hoping i dont at this point but the condition is unknown til i pull the head.

whats the hot tank for? to expose cracks?

Hot tank cleans the head from all contaminates and will allow you to do a better inspection.

If I recall you are running a 2871r? Then if you plan to get on it, then maybe upgraded springs and a valve lap job would be a good idea since you will be pulling the head.

Next is rods but we already talked about that lol.


In the future when looking at any turbo car I would suggest pulling the TIP and checking for shaft play. I also highly recommend asking the seller if you can take it to a shop of your choice to have it inspected. A few hundred now could save you thousands in the end. If they say no then Walk Away.


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[PreciseD]

Have a compression test, vacuum leak test and coolant test done. Those three can tell you a lot about what you are buying.


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[Furly]

Hot tank cleans the head from all contaminates and will allow you to do a better inspection.

If I recall you are running a 2871r? Then if you plan to get on it, then maybe upgraded springs and a valve lap job would be a good idea since you will be pulling the head.

Next is rods but we already talked about that lol.


In the future when looking at any turbo car I would suggest pulling the TIP and checking for shaft play. I also highly recommend asking the seller if you can take it to a shop of your choice to have it inspected. A few hundred now could save you thousands in the end. If they say no then Walk Away.


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yea even the shop said there was no shaft play, but that the turbo was leaking thru the seal. i believe it was leaking coolant thru the turbo also. maybe because of the bad head?

i definitely learned my lesson. never been burned this bad in my life. i figured the guy must be stupid to sell a car on the AZ classifieds if it has problems. because someone can easily expose him for that, which i think i might just do.


i'd love to do rods, but money is ridiculously tight right now. a lot of financial problems with the family right now. and on top of that the money i spent on the car and repairs has put a huge dent in my bank acct.
so i want to do the most important stuff first. people told me to sell the car and get rid of it, but i am not a scumbag like the guy that sold me the car.i would feel really bad if i passed this car to someone else like this. so i am going to fix what i can.
about the valve springs, how would i know if i need new ones?

[PreciseD]

Well you probably don't need new ones but it could be a good idea if you plan to do upgrades in the future.

If your head is trashed PM me maybe I can help you out when I pull my old motor. Also sure there are some guys here with spare heads that could part with them to help out.


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