How to level car during transmission fluid change

[Spike00513]

I have read many of the various DIY's on 5-TIP fluid/filter change procedures. Manual instructions, DIY's, you name it. They all say that the car must be level for the procedure.

I will be lifting up the car, and putting stands under the frame rails, to give me more room to do the job.

How exactly am I supposed to get the car "level"? The transmission pan has various angles,



This is the inside of the pan. As you can see, it is not completely flat on the bottom, it has angles. So, there are various places that I could put my bubble level tool, and it would get me different readings.

Where exactly do I put the level, and why? Maybe the frame rail/pinch-weld?

Thank you

[Timtheguru]

The pan may not be "level" but the fluid at the top would be "level" for the pickup.

Just do your best to make it level on all four jack stands.

[Spike00513]

The pan may not be "level" but the fluid at the top would be "level" for the pickup.

Just do your best to make it level on all four jack stands.

I asked because I am using different rear jackstands and wanted to know if there is a specific place to put a bubble level or something. I don't think I've had a single garage that was perfectly level itself.

[Timtheguru]

Ok, set up the jackstands where you would have them if the car was in the garage, and then level them and then set them to that level when you do lift the car. The car just needs to be lifted level, which you can figure out before even touching the car.

[ZXERT]

Even if it was off by 1 inch level, you're talking about VERY little difference in fluid. Certain things like timing must be exact, but a lot of things are just a best effort kind of deal. Its too stressful to be THAT exact.

[customa4]

I agree, do your best to get the car as level as possible. I'm not sure if the pan of the transmission has any flat surface but if it does that's where I would put it.

[audinaut]

What I do, don't even know if it's right. It works for me.

Whenever I've changed tranny and diff fluid on any of my cars, I've use a small torpedo level on the inside of the drivers door jamb/sill. I put the forward half of the car on ramps or jack stands, then use a floor jack somewhere off the tail/back of the vehicle -- depending on vehicle and what I am working on, I'll use the rear diff or rear tow hook, basically something towards the center of the vehicle so both sides of the vehicle raise at the same rate. Pump or release the jack as needed to level the bubble in the torpedo level, then place another set of jack stands under rear of car. Use scrap wood with the rear jack stands if needed, but basically I will carry most of the weight with the floor jack, releasing it a tiny bit it puts some weight on the jack stands and they cannot be pushed or knocked out under any amount of force.

Most important......never ever go under a car that is supported only with a jack. It only takes one time for a jack to fail and chances are it will be the last time you use any kind of jack. Always always use jack stands and/or ramps before going under a vehicle.

[viceprp]

Garage floors SHOULD have a pitch of 1" for every 5-8'. If you want to be absolutely level then put the level on the ground and calculate the pitch. If it's a 2' level and it's 1/2" off the ground when bubble is centered then you have 1"/4'. Measure the distance between jack stands and do the math. Add the amount to the rear/garage door side and you are done. It's as accurate as you can get. GTF is off a little due to the rear and front not being actually perfect to one another.

Hope the helps.

[Timtheguru]

One thing to note, you will need all 4 wheels free to change the transmission fluid, so ramps won't work for this job.

[diagnosticator]

One thing to note, you will need all 4 wheels free to change the transmission fluid, so ramps won't work for this job.

Why do you say all four wheels need to be "free"? I have changed my ATF many times and I use ramps on the front and jack stands at the rear.

OP, the car does not need to be perfectly level. Just get it as level as possible visually. It should not be tilted an obvious amount. Since the trans pan is "about" in the middle of the plan area of the chassis layout, the pan is not effected much by the tip of the car off level. The fluid level in the pan won't be effected negatively for refilling as long as the car is not tipped enough to be visually off level.

[Waspjr]

^ yep bingo right there you could waist alot of time but just get it so the fluid in the pan is at a level position. Sometimes you just have to think about why do they want the car level. Ohh its because it puts the fluid in the pan in a position that the engineers who built the trany found out that if the fluid is kept at this level at normal inclines and temps there would be no starvation of the pickup. Sorry if i seem rash i am just saying what i do and i mean no offence :)

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[seanf86]

as others have said, it does not matter if the cars not perfectly level, as long as its close, the whole filling the trans thing is not a perfect science either, if you're a little over or a little under its not the end of the world, thats why you're supposed to check it every oil change.

[Timtheguru]

Why do you say all four wheels need to be "free"? I have changed my ATF many times and I use ramps on the front and jack stands at the rear.

OP, the car does not need to be perfectly level. Just get it as level as possible visually. It should not be tilted an obvious amount. Since the trans pan is "about" in the middle of the plan area of the chassis layout, the pan is not effected much by the tip of the car off level. The fluid level in the pan won't be effected negatively for refilling as long as the car is not tipped enough to be visually off level.

Well, unless things have changed the procedure is:

1. Drain fluid.
2. Fill fluid until it starts coming out
3. Start engine and shift gears (transmission sucks up fluid, and requires wheels free) while monitoring fluid temp with vagcom
4. Fill the rest of the fluid before it gets too hot and overflows

[Timtheguru]

Ah I see, you can hold the brake, doh. :)

-Reinstall the Audi automatic transmission fluid oil fill plug hand tight.


-Start the car. With your foot pressed down on the brake pedal, shift the transmission selector in each gear for about 10 seconds. Note: Don't drive the car.


-Remove the oil fill plug while the car is at an idle and add more Audi automatic transmission fluid until it runs out. The final steps and procedures for topping off the Audi automatic transmission fluid level will vary depending on Audi model and year. It is critical to obtain the proper Audi automatic transmission fluid level to prevent Audi transmission shifting problems especially with tiptronic transmissions. You should refer to the factory manual or Blauparts Audi automatic transmission fluid change instructions that are now included in most of our BLAU® Audi ATF Filter Change Kits!

http://www.blauparts.com/audi/audi_f...nsmissionfluid

[diagnosticator]

Well, unless things have changed the procedure is:

1. Drain fluid.
2. Fill fluid until it starts coming out
3. Start engine and shift gears (transmission sucks up fluid, and requires wheels free) while monitoring fluid temp with vagcom
4. Fill the rest of the fluid before it gets too hot and overflows

When refilling the trans, add fluid until dripping overflow occurs. Next, start the engine in Park, with the e-brake applied, and add fluid until dripping overflow begins again. Next, with the service brake applied, shift through the gears, P>N>D>N>P stopping in each gear for about 10 seconds, then return to Park. Check the fluid temp, with the fluid temp between 30 and 40 degrees C, add more fluid until dripping overflow occurs again, then reinstall the fill port plug. Next, turn the engine Off. Finally return the car to the ground and test drive. Done.

If the fluid temp exceeds 40 degrees C with the fill plug removed, reinstall the fill port plug then turn the engine Off. Wait for the fluid to cool down to 30 degrees C as shown in VCDS, or with an infrared temp gun pointing at the bottom of the trans pan. With the fluid temp =/>30<40 C, start the engine then remove the fill port plug. Add fluid until dripping overflow occurs then reinstall the fill port plug before turning the engine Off.

[Timtheguru]

If the fluid temp exceeds 40 degrees C with the fill plug removed, reinstall the fill port plug then turn the engine Off. Wait for the fluid to cool down to 30 degrees C as shown in VCDS, or with an infrared temp gun pointing at the bottom of the trans pan. With the fluid temp =/>30<40 C, start the engine then remove the fill port plug. Add fluid until dripping overflow occurs then reinstall the fill port plug before turning the engine Off.

Need to shift gears again at this point to get the transmission to suck up the fluid before removing drain plug. Other than that, looks perfect.

[Spike00513]

depending on vehicle and what I am working on, I'll use the rear diff or rear tow hook, basically something towards the center of the vehicle so both sides of the vehicle raise at the same rate. Pump or release the jack as needed to level the bubble in the torpedo level, then place another set of jack stands under rear of car. Use scrap wood with the rear jack stands if needed, but basically I will carry most of the weight with the floor jack, releasing it a tiny bit it puts some weight on the jack stands and they cannot be pushed or knocked out under any amount of force.

Isn't it bad to jack up via the rear diff or rear tow hook? I have bent the rear tow hook on another car that way, and I can't imagine the stress caused by jacking up by the rear diff is good. For me, jacking up my B6 is very easy. I have the RS4 jack pads, so I just use a hydraulic jack (with hockey puck jack pad) under subframe bushing mounting points. Then, with the car jacked up, I slide stands under the RS4 jack pads. The jack pads are also shaped to allow use of the factory trunk widow-maker.

as others have said, it does not matter if the cars not perfectly level, as long as its close, the whole filling the trans thing is not a perfect science either, if you're a little over or a little under its not the end of the world, thats why you're supposed to check it every oil change.

Are you confusing this with a manual transmission? IIRC, manuals have a fill plug which is easily used to check level. You fill, and once it starts pouring out, you're done. That is not the case with the Tip, where there is a more complicated fill procedure. For example, with the TIP, if you open the fill plug when cold, a ton of fluid will drain out. If you have the transmission at 40degC and have shifted through the gears, it will not pour out as much, if at all.

When refilling the trans, add fluid until dripping overflow occurs. Next, start the engine in Park, with the e-brake applied, and add fluid until dripping overflow begins again. Next, with the service brake applied, shift through the gears, P>N>D>N>P stopping in each gear for about 10 seconds, then return to Park. Check the fluid temp, with the fluid temp between 30 and 40 degrees C, add more fluid until dripping overflow occurs again, then reinstall the fill port plug. Next, turn the engine Off. Finally return the car to the ground and test drive. Done.

If the fluid temp exceeds 40 degrees C with the fill plug removed, reinstall the fill port plug then turn the engine Off. Wait for the fluid to cool down to 30 degrees C as shown in VCDS, or with an infrared temp gun pointing at the bottom of the trans pan. With the fluid temp =/>30<40 C, start the engine then remove the fill port plug. Add fluid until dripping overflow occurs then reinstall the fill port plug before turning the engine Off.

Does it matter at which temp. between 30 C and 40 C that I do my final fill? The manuals/instructions all seem to suggest topping it off to overflow as close to 40 C as possible, right after holding each gear for 10 seconds for the trans to suck up as much fluid as possible through the pick up tube.

As mentioned above in this post, I am considering replicating my cars forward rake during the fill procedure. Would you suggest doing this? This would allow me to put more fluid into the transmission - but probably not much. I am hoping this won't affect the transmission in a negative way.

[seanf86]

For my b5 tip I just filled it as it was warming up until fluid dribbled out running the car thru the gears and I put back in pretty close to what I drained out when I changed the filter, its due for an oil change soon and I will double check the level then but I'm pretty sure it will be fine

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[customa4]

Does it matter at which temp. between 30 C and 40 C that I do my final fill? The manuals/instructions all seem to suggest topping it off to overflow as close to 40 C as possible, right after holding each gear for 10 seconds for the trans to suck up as much fluid as possible through the pick up tube.

As mentioned above in this post, I am considering replicating my cars forward rake during the fill procedure. Would you suggest doing this? This would allow me to put more fluid into the transmission - but probably not much. I am hoping this won't affect the transmission in a negative way.

Selector lever in position “P”, engine idling.
Air conditioner and heating system switched off.
The ATF temperature at the beginning of the test must not be higher than 30°C. If necessary, first allow the gearbox to cool down.
When the ATF temperature reaches 35°C, unscrew the ATF inspection plug and drain off any surplus ATF.
The ATF level is correct if a small amount of fluid comes out at the ATF inspection plug when ATF temperature is between 35°C and 45°C, or 50°C in hot climates (the fluid level rises due to expansion as it warms up).
If no ATF emerges from ATF inspection hole when ATF has reached 40°C, top up with ATF
The ATF inspection plug must be screwed in again at the latest when ATF temperature reaches 45°C (or 50°C in hot climates). If necessary, switch off engine, allow gearbox to cool down and repeat the test.
The ATF level must not be too low or too high, otherwise this would impair the function of the gearbox.
Fit new seal on ATF inspection plug and tighten to 80 Nm

[Spike00513]

I ended up re-filling with about 5.2L at 39 deg C (started @ 36 deg C), after going through the gears down to S and back up to P, holding each one for 8 seconds. I am guessing that if I top it off again when its completely cold (28 deg C) and hold each gear longer, I may be able to get more fluid in.

I took into account the angle of my garage floor when setting the raised angle of the car, like suggested. I also leaned the car a little more forward to simulate how it regularly sits (forward rake). I'm not sure if that's correct, but the car didn't blow up on my test drive so...

The new bottle design on the Blauparts kit sure made it...fun...

I can still tell when the transmission shifts, but it is smoother than before.

Thanks everyone!

[diagnosticator]

You don't need to top it up again, as long as the fluid temp was less than 40C, with dripping overflow, the trans is correctly topped up already. You could get a little more into the trans with the fluid temp closer to 30 C, but it won't be enough to make the effort worthwhile. BTW, the reason for the specified temp range for checking the fluid, is because of the expansion of the fluid as the temp increases. The height of the fill port in the pan, is calibrated to provide the correct fluid level with the fluid dripping overflow within the specified temp range. If the fluid is hotter, the actual fluid level in the trans will be to low, and vice versa. If the fluid level is to low or to high, can cause malfunction of the transmission. I need to confirm the temp range, (30/35C <> 40/45C) regardless, with the trans fluid at 39C, with dripping overflow, then replacing the fill port plug correctly established the fluid level in the trans. When the trans is a full operating temp, the fluid level in the pan is higher than the overflow level.