Q5 3.0tdi vs SQ5

[Scl1080]

Thinking about trading in my 09 A4 avant ( with a stage 2 tune and few suspension mods) before warranty is up. I believe I have narrowed down my choices between the two q5s. Just wondering if anyone else have made similar comparisons and or have any thoughts.

Here is a quick blerb on mine. Love the sq5 because of its power and especially handeling. It's got a great interior and is about as close as you can get to an s4 avant in the us. Only down side for me is the crappy mpg ( but not a terrible negative for me) and the fact that I do drive a lot of miles in the mountains in colorado where the tdi will do great and hold its value better.

3.0 tdi on the other hand is also great and I can get it in the sline and sports interior package which will help with some sporty feel. Also it has a great engine and is still pretty quick with a crap load of torque. Great mpg and with me putting 20000 miles plus on the car the engine will last and hold value better. My only down side on the tdi is I wish it would handle as well as the sq5. I suppose some suspension mods may help.

Any comments and thoughts to persuade me would be appreciated. Only if Audi would have given us the sq5 tdi I wouldn't have this problem.

[Stubek]

My wife wants a Q5 next year. She will be replacing her Honda Element. We looked at the SQ5 at my local dealer a couple days ago and have debated the TDI.
If MPG and towing are something you want to do, get a TDI and get the s-line/sport/whatever they call that package this year. If you can't, Stasis does a Q5 suspension that will work on a TDI no problem, so get the TDI and upgrade suspension and wheels.

If the MPG and towing are not part of your criteria, then go with the SQ5 and no need to upgrade the suspension.

We won't be towing (that we know of), but we do some long drives, so right now we take my 2011 Avant, but may get the TDI for that. The other issue with TDI is availability of diesel, I can stop anywhere for gas, but diesel is only at about 50% of the stations near me.

[BirdmanQ5]

Man, going from a honda element to an SQ5 will be a hell of a jump. I went Stage 1 Q5 to an S4, can't imagine if I hadn't tuned it.

I'd say go SQ5. No TDI will look as nice as that S package

[MP4.2+6.0]

Love the sq5 ... Only down side for me is ... and the fact that I do drive a lot of miles in the mountains in colorado where the tdi will do great and hold its value better.

3.0 tdi ... I wish it would handle as well as the sq5. I suppose some suspension mods may help.

Any comments and thoughts to persuade me would be appreciated. Only if Audi would have given us the sq5 tdi I wouldn't have this problem.

Not sure I get these parts, but reply if you know something different:

I don't get the part about TDI working better in the mountains: isn't any blown engine going to boost to a net of a certain total pressure? In other words, it counteracts the basic effect of altitude on a N.A. motor. Lag will be longer since there is a greater effective pressure to "make up," but it should get there. From the "old days," I can remember when the first gen Audi quattro turbos (5000T's) were a big seller in the Rockies--both for quattro but I think also for boost incremental power delta from an NA motor operating at altitude. Also BTW, since power is pretty way down on a TDI until the boost kicks in. That's actually the one I would think would be more "laggy" at altitude of the two. Separately, diesel fuel generically can have some issues at low temps and basic start process can also take a bit longer (if like the older days of diesels), so again not sure how that weighs toward TDI instead of any of the gas motors, (U.S.) SQ or otherwise.

Suspension: I don't know all the nuances here, but from info now out apparently the U.S. SQ is not dropped if you are thinking that, despite what early specs said. Has to do with meeting the U.S. SUV (i.e. "truck") regs that gives them a CAFE requirement fuel economy break, but that in turn requires a "truck" type ride height to qualify. Thus, I would expect ride height to start the same; from there I would have to see if either SQ or S line does anything on rest of suspension--roll bars, spring rates, strut valving, etc.

[josedebardi]

Tough one! Interestingly A LOT of people on other forums have said similar that they would like the SQ5 TDI to be offered in the US - maybe Audi underestimated the demand there would be for it...

The normal TDI is still no slouch and you could always give it a tune as well as the new suspension.
I personally would probably go this route as the TFSI MPG is going to be 1/2 if not less than that of the TDI and you will have paid a premium for the 'S' badge in the first place and the TDI will be better for towing. For me these 3 add up to a tweaked TDI fitting your needs better.

Availability of diesel shouldn't be an issue when you will be getting 600 miles to a tank...

Is the A6 available in the US with the bi-turbo TDI out of the SQ5? Not sure if this might be an option if you really want a performance diesel... You would lose the ride height and it is a slightly higher price bracket though.

[josedebardi]

Suspension: I don't know all the nuances here, but from info now out apparently the U.S. SQ is not dropped if you are thinking that, despite what early specs said. Has to do with meeting the U.S. SUV (i.e. "truck") regs that gives them a CAFE requirement fuel economy break, but that in turn requires a "truck" type ride height to qualify. Thus, I would expect ride height to start the same; from there I would have to see if either SQ or S line does anything on rest of suspension--roll bars, spring rates, strut valving, etc.

US spec SQ5 is not lowered as you say. I believe it does have stiffened suspension though from reading reviews of people that have driven it vs normal Q5. It doesn't have the adaptive damping either which is a shame as you are not getting the lowered sus in place of it. This again is a reason not to go for the SQ5 as the TDI can be spec'd with the adaptive dampers.

[tmoe]

I understand your problem. Before I bought my 2013 Q5 3.0 I was also considering a VW Touareg TDI as I wanted better gas mileage than the listed Q5 3.0 mileage. While I liked the TDI I didn't like the responsiveness of the engine while it's powerful it's somewhat slow to respond initially. After driving the TDI, I drove the Q5 both 2.0 (similar mileage to touareg tdi) and 3.0, overall 3.0 had the initial response I was looking for. From a mileage perspective the mileage a Q5 will get will depend on where you drive, my Q5 3.0 with APR stage 2 (similar power to the sq5 slightly more) gets 27mpg @ 75mph, around town it will average between 18-22 (with a light foot) depending on the number of traffic lights both slightly better than what audi listed. Something else to consider, the turbo TDI, will hold power better in the mountains than the supercharger on the SQ5. Tough choice. If you plan on keeping for 100,000+ miles TDI might be the choice but if you like sporty driving hard to go wrong with the SQ5.

[idale]

Is the A6 available in the US with the bi-turbo TDI out of the SQ5? Not sure if this might be an option if you really want a performance diesel... You would lose the ride height and it is a slightly higher price bracket though.

No, we don't have the biturbo on any models, at least at this point. The Q5/A6/A7/A8 get the 3.0 TDI (single-turbo), and the A4 (and A5?) will get the 2.0 TDI.

It's probably for the best that we didn't get the TDI SQ5 since then I'd have been sorely tempted to upgrade from ordering the TDI Q5.

[MP4.2+6.0]

...Something else to consider, the turbo TDI, will hold power better in the mountains than the supercharger on the SQ5. ....

Explain how this is the case, or where the info. comes from generally. Isn't boost basically boost, whether from a turbo or a supercharger? The supercharger is parasitic to an extent, but doesn't have the turbo lag (more pronounced on a TDI generally). Presumably either a turbo or a supercharger regulate up to a certain overall pressure, whether gas or diesel. Am I missing something?

[boomtime]

Availability of diesel should be an issue when you will be getting 600 miles to a tank...

I assume you meant "shouldn't be an issue"
And for the record I extracted 575 miles from a tank in my Q5 2.0, it took 19 gallons meaning it had another 30 miles in it.

After driving the TDI, I drove the Q5 both 2.0 (similar mileage to touareg tdi) and 3.0, overall 3.0 had the initial response I was looking for. From a mileage perspective the mileage a Q5 will get will depend on where you drive, my Q5 3.0 with APR stage 2 (similar power to the sq5 slightly more) gets 27mpg @ 75mph, around town it will average between 18-22 (with a light foot) depending on the number of traffic lights both slightly better than what audi listed.

For comparison, my best in the 2.0 Q5 was 35mpg, that is achieved around 55 mph, i get more like 31mpg at 65mph with cruise activated.
Im stating this because I really dont believe the 3.0TFSI vs 3.0tdi is a valid comparison, maybe only in terms of price. People dont buy the 3.0TFSI for gas mileage, thats why I didnt buy it and people dont buy the 3.0tdi for performance and speed.

[tmoe]

Explain how this is the case, or where the info. comes from generally. Isn't boost basically boost, whether from a turbo or a supercharger? The supercharger is parasitic to an extent, but doesn't have the turbo lag (more pronounced on a TDI generally). Presumably either a turbo or a supercharger regulate up to a certain overall pressure, whether gas or diesel. Am I missing something?

There are a number of threads over in the B8 S4 forum that do a better job of explaining but from what I remember, a supercharger running at a fixed rpm has the ability to raise boast above what ever the current barometric pressure is available - which means that at 10,000 ft it will not provide the same level of performance at 0 ft as barometric pressure at 10,000 is quite a bit less than sea level. It will of coarse deliver much more than a naturally aspirated engine. With a turbo there is theoretically more boast available because it's not directly limited to the rpm's of the engine but by the blow-off/diverter/boast controller, it has the ability to compensate for the lower barometric pressure more effectively than a supercharger which is directly linked to barometric pressure and rpm.

[josedebardi]

I assume you meant "shouldn't be an issue"
And for the record I extracted 575 miles from a tank in my Q5 2.0, it took 19 gallons meaning it had another 30 miles in it.




For comparison, my best in the 2.0 Q5 was 35mpg, that is achieved around 55 mph, i get more like 31mpg at 65mph with cruise activated.
Im stating this because I really dont believe the 3.0TFSI vs 3.0tdi is a valid comparison, maybe only in terms of price. People dont buy the 3.0TFSI for gas mileage, thats why I didnt buy it and people dont buy the 3.0tdi for performance and speed.

Corrected - thanks. That's impressive mileage from the 2.0 (I assume gas)?

You are right on the SQ5 TFSI vs Q5 TDI being apples and oranges.
That's why so many want the SQ5 TDI I guess as you can get the best of both worlds, and as far as I am concerned, no compromises.

[yeshdolph]

I just read this and i have been going through the same thing.
I have waited for the sq5 and now that it hear I am not getting it.
I actually negotiated a deal 2000 off msrp plus another 1000 for loyalty so they will deal if you push them.
But they did not give us the real suspension. We got 1/2 inch lower springs bigger brakes and the same stabiizer bar as the 3.0
What I am going to do,
Swap out my non sports seats 2012 s line for a 2014 s line or negotiating on a leftover 13

I am going to take it to a performance shop that audi told me about and for 2300 going to do what audi refused to do right.

Get the diesel or the 3.0

The sq5 is just fluff with a big engine.

And granted the seats are nice and the mirrors and grill rock but not worth the extra 7 to 8 grand and if you really crave a suspension my shop said i would stlll need to do about 1600 worth of work to make it right.

[Scl1080]

I endened up test driving the sq5 today and will probably test drive the tdi later this week. The sq5 is very sweet, it's very quick and handles great. I did not see any real flaws during test drive. But your right its not any lower then a tdi sitting next to it so some simple suspension mods would do very nice. I'm slowly starting to lean towards the tdi because of its potential And I would think about driving it for a long time. So we will see how the tdi goes during a test drive.

[tmoe]

I assume you meant "shouldn't be an issue"
And for the record I extracted 575 miles from a tank in my Q5 2.0, it took 19 gallons meaning it had another 30 miles in it.




For comparison, my best in the 2.0 Q5 was 35mpg, that is achieved around 55 mph, i get more like 31mpg at 65mph with cruise activated.
Im stating this because I really dont believe the 3.0TFSI vs 3.0tdi is a valid comparison, maybe only in terms of price. People dont buy the 3.0TFSI for gas mileage, thats why I didnt buy it and people dont buy the 3.0tdi for performance and speed.

It depends on the person, I'd like to have both mileage and performance, if set cruise @ 65mph I've gotten 30mpg, so not much difference between 2.0 and 3.0. Some of this could be the APR tune as they tried to improve mileage for low throttle cruising. I wanted the mid 30's @ 75mph from the tdi I just didn't like the response of the engine or highway performance for passing. If they had brought over the SQ5 bi-turbo TDI that would have been the best of both worlds. For me performance won out, I got a '13 Q5 3.0 pp, nav, b&0, sport seats out the door $48.5k. For me it worked out but for others it won't. Glad Audi is providing so many choices - no one right answer.

[scottisha]

I understand your problem. Before I bought my 2013 Q5 3.0 I was also considering a VW Touareg TDI as I wanted better gas mileage than the listed Q5 3.0 mileage. While I liked the TDI I didn't like the responsiveness of the engine while it's powerful it's somewhat slow to respond initially. After driving the TDI, I drove the Q5 both 2.0 (similar mileage to touareg tdi) and 3.0, overall 3.0 had the initial response I was looking for. From a mileage perspective the mileage a Q5 will get will depend on where you drive, my Q5 3.0 with APR stage 2 (similar power to the sq5 slightly more) gets 27mpg @ 75mph, around town it will average between 18-22 (with a light foot) depending on the number of traffic lights both slightly better than what audi listed. Something else to consider, the turbo TDI, will hold power better in the mountains than the supercharger on the SQ5. Tough choice. If you plan on keeping for 100,000+ miles TDI might be the choice but if you like sporty driving hard to go wrong with the SQ5.

LOL. Tmoe. I think we're living parallel lives my friend..... I was deciding between a gray Touareg V6 Executive and a gray TDI Sport+Nav, when I saw that Audi was putting the 3.0T in the new Q5......I was literally a day away from likely picking the V6 Executive, when I went and test drove the Q5....There was no comparison.....

Here's the Touareg I came very close to buying:




Just doesn't hold a candle to the Q5. And the Q5 was less money and has a better warranty :)








Luckily, I talked my wife into getting a Touareg. She traded her Honda mini-van in on one almost 2 months ago....

We put the Touareg to good use a few weeks ago and took a trip to Siesta Key Beach in Sarasota Fl.



But, to get to your question, I would likely go with the SQ5, unless the TDI was way less, which I doubt.

[tmoe]

Scott definitely some parallel universe linked by VAG products maybe there's a bugatti in our future!! LOL

Tom

[Scl1080]

Scott your q5 is exactly what I would go for in terms of looks. What is your suspension set up, wheels and offset.

[T0M3K]

I am in market for new car and being in love for S_ Avants, I am very disappointed that AoA doesn't offer any :(

Next big thing is Q5. I like dynamic driving and those SUVs always reminded me of something that is EASY to flip. I should take one for test drive and see how it feels.

So an option seems to be TDI, 3.0 and SQ5.

TDI offers superior mileage and awesome torque for city driving
3.0 offers good cost reference
SQ5 is just tuned 3.0 with visuals and awesome seats.

I seriously wish Q5 was offered in some kind of adaptive suspension like allroad, I would love to bring it down for highways or tight corners. Or maybe just get S4 and pull a trailer.

[wilber]

US Dept of Energy gives a combined mileage of 27 mpg for the TDI, 23 mpg for the 2.0t and 21 mpg for the 3.0t. With diesel being about 40 cents a US gallon cheaper than premium in Canada and diesels historically holding their value better than gas models, it makes a TDI pretty attractive for a Canadian. One more thought, even though they are also direct injection, I've never heard of carbon buildup on intake valves being a problem with diesels like it seems to be on DI gas engines.

[ibiski]

http://www.streetfire.net/video/143-...uel_180378.htm

[josedebardi]

I am in market for new car and being in love for S_ Avants, I am very disappointed that AoA doesn't offer any :(

Next big thing is Q5. I like dynamic driving and those SUVs always reminded me of something that is EASY to flip. I should take one for test drive and see how it feels.

So an option seems to be TDI, 3.0 and SQ5.

TDI offers superior mileage and awesome torque for city driving
3.0 offers good cost reference
SQ5 is just tuned 3.0 with visuals and awesome seats.

I seriously wish Q5 was offered in some kind of adaptive suspension like allroad, I would love to bring it down for highways or tight corners. Or maybe just get S4 and pull a trailer.

You would need two wheels up a ramp to flip a Q5. It handles more like a car than an SUV.

The SQ5 TFSI is a totally different engine from the Q5 3.0 TFSI.

The Q5 does have adaptive dampers as an option (SQ5 does not).

[tmoe]

You would need two wheels up a ramp to flip a Q5. It handles more like a car than an SUV.

The SQ5 TFSI is a totally different engine from the Q5 3.0 TFSI.

The Q5 does have adaptive dampers as an option (SQ5 does not).

when you reference totally different engine in sq5 vs q5 3.0 is that because UK get the great biturbo tdi, in the US we get a tuned version of the q5 3.0. Pretty sure many would rather have tdi but not the first time the US/North America gets less! our tdi is low power single turbo.

[josedebardi]

when you reference totally different engine in sq5 vs q5 3.0 is that because UK get the great biturbo tdi, in the US we get a tuned version of the q5 3.0. Pretty sure many would rather have tdi but not the first time the US/North America gets less! our tdi is low power single turbo.

No, hence referencing SQ5 TFSI.
There are significant differences beyond just a tune. That said, a Q5 3.0 TFSI with a stage 3 tune would probably just a powerful - not sure on the longevity of doing so though. And again in this case I use the phrase 'tune' lightly as you will be changing intakes/exhausts and likely other bits as well to get there beyond playing with the ECU.

Agree the TDI bi-turbo is a much better package all round. But I guess Audi figured too many Americans/Canadians are nervous of oil burners still.

[tomaszp72]

No, hence referencing SQ5 TFSI.
There are significant differences beyond just a tune. That said, a Q5 3.0 TFSI with a stage 3 tune would probably just a powerful - not sure on the longevity of doing so though. And again in this case I use the phrase 'tune' lightly as you will be changing intakes/exhausts and likely other bits as well to get there beyond playing with the ECU.

Agree the TDI bi-turbo is a much better package all round. But I guess Audi figured too many Americans/Canadians are nervous of oil burners still.

The same 3.0 TFSI engine with a different tune. Stage 2 tuned "regular" 3.0T will get you beyond what the 3.0TFSI in SQ5 is in terms of numbers. Even Audi admits is is the same hw different sw in those engines.

[tmoe]

The same 3.0 TFSI engine with a different tune. Stage 2 tuned "regular" 3.0T will get you beyond what the 3.0TFSI in SQ5 is in terms of numbers. Even Audi admits is is the same hw different sw in those engines.

I would agree that an APR stage 2 is producing more than 354 HP based on Scott's track experience with mustang gt 5.0 420hp that have yet to come close to his 12.7 106.6mph 1/4 time in summer heat 80-90 degrees. APR dyno results tend to support that as well. I'd guess a stock sq5 should run mid to low 13's. Audi can't have an sq5 run with an s6.

[zwickau]

SQ5's accoutrements make the extra cost justified. Now I find myself looking for SQ5 parts and that time alone (no matter how entertaining) is worth something right? Awesome seats, dials, shift knob, etc... The 3.0 brings a smile to my face every time I get behind the wheel.

[martian421]

i'm actually going for the TDI (replacing my B8 A4) because i think the price is more economical that that of the SQ5. Plus once APR or some other tuner comes out with a flash, it would make the car that much more fun!

[Scl1080]

I ended up test driving both the sq5 and tdi this week. The sq5 is for sur the more enjoyable car to drive in terms of performance. However I was really surprised with diesel and the thing was pretty quick. Based on the longevity of the engine, mpg, and potential for suspension mods and apr tune in the future I think I have decided on the tdi. I will at least be adding the sline and sports package for aesthetic upgrade and the adaptive dampening. Will plan on trading in the avant and ordering one soon.

[scottisha]

You would need two wheels up a ramp to flip a Q5. It handles more like a car than an SUV.

The SQ5 TFSI is a totally different engine from the Q5 3.0 TFSI.

The Q5 does have adaptive dampers as an option (SQ5 does not).

I agree, I take corners as fast in my Q5 as I do in my Golf R. It handles way better than you would expect. Handles and feels flatest in "Dynamic" mode

[boomtime]

I agree, I take corners as fast in my Q5 as I do in my Golf R. It handles way better than you would expect. Handles and feels flatest in "Dynamic" mode

I can break my Q5 loose pretty easily even with ESC enabled although Mr. Computer takes it away from me and straightens the car out after about 2-3 seconds.
With ESC off, you can easily induce oversteer on throttle, on the stock 2.0T with a sharp turn around 40mph.
I imagine the 3.0T is even more fun with the extra TQ+HP.
Edit: Just dont hit the brake pedal...stay on throttle, or else you could run into trouble!

[spijun]

You would need two wheels up a ramp to flip a Q5. It handles more like a car than an SUV.

The SQ5 TFSI is a totally different engine from the Q5 3.0 TFSI.

The Q5 does have adaptive dampers as an option (SQ5 does not).

Where did you get this information, what you write is not true

3.0TFSI engine in model SQ and standard Q5 are the same. Engines are the same just a different ECU

Engine Code: CTUD (354HP), CTXA (354HP), CTUC (272HP), CTVA (272HP)
Here's proof of my assertion, if you need anything else please let me know

[davidjz]

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...di_first_test/

[Q5 Bob]

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...di_first_test/

Good read. Thanks.

[Transfer]

That really is a good read if cross shopping these two models. TDI for more DD duties and road trips, SQ5 for more sporty performance including significant straightline speed advantage above 50-60 mph.

[Madbusy168]

I myself had the same debate before buying my Sq5. I've never had a diesel before out of the 30-40 new cars that I've had. I wanted to give it a try since there seemed to be so many great reviews on diesel powered vehicles. More Torque, more mpg, really good longevity. After much debate, I still ended up with the Sq5 for the following reasons. The Sq5 was prettier, had the nice big wheels especially since I opted for the 21s. The brakes were very massive and being a mechanic, I knew how important it was to overkill on the brakes so we dont have the warped rotor every year scenario. The interior was without a doubt better looking with the steering wheel and the seats, Plus I hated wood interior, so carbon fiber was another big plus in the Sq5. Without a doubt the tdi is very good for daily driving and usage but thats not why I wanted this vehicle, I wanted the Bling factor, SQ5 is gonna outshine a Tdi anyday of the week. You can get the SLine, but why get a S Line when you can get the Genuine S vehicle? Lets be fair here, put the same exact tires and wheel package on both the Sq5 and the tdi and lets see some real comparison then. seems like everyone is comparing the acceleration of the tdi vs the sq5.

[Dennis C]

We also considered the Q5 diesel and came close to buying one. My wife preferred the look of the SQ5, so that was certainly a factor in our decision. I think the thing that pushed us further towards a gasoline powered vehicle was a story that a friend told me about his Q7 diesel. One day on a road trip, he got low on Ad Blue. His Q7 simply shut down on the highway, out in the middle of nowhere. It had to be towed to the dealer. That story was enough for my wife. I realize it's preventable, but she didn't like the fact that diesels are "different" than gasoline powered vehicles.

Personally, I'd love the diesel powered SQ5 if it was available in the US.

[JimR_ATL]

I'm a little less than two months into my SQ5, and I agonized over exactly this question on a private forum full of Euro car types, including one AoA employee, some TDI folks, etc.

I'm still seriously 2nd guessing myself, and would probably go with the TDI if I had it to do over again.

It's a long story, and I'm on vacation in Europe on an iPad (I'm actually looking out my hotel window at the Eiffel Tower as I tap this out), so ping me in a week if you want more details.

[Dennis C]

We've never looked back. I love the SQ5 and I'm glad we bought it.

[SQ57]

Hello Gents,
Interesting find:
http://m.motortrend.com/roadtests/su...di_first_test/
The TDI option seems very appealing, specially for a Q7/7seater family hauler,considering MPG.
I've been longtime owner/fan of Lexus/Toyota hybrid SUVs, but Audi just won me over. With the TDI economy, I'll easily prefer Audi.
Cheers,
Bob