Tuned S4 vs E92 M3....

[cohenfive]

Here's my dilemma....I have a pristine e92 m3 which I love, but we just bought a vacation house on the Nevada side of the Sierra. I'm thinking that my m3 isn't going to be able to get up there during the winter rain/snow season, so I'm considering swapping for an S4. I know the oem s4 is not in the same class as the m3, but the one I'm considering has a bunch of goodies--stasis touring package, apr exhause, bbs wheels (hate the stasis rims), drivetrain stablizer, awe intake, plus a bunch of little goodies including a set of blizzaks for winter use.

While I love the m3, I'm wondering how a mildly tuned s4 like the above will compare. I doubt it will handle as well, but with the added boost will it keep up off the line? Any thought would be appreciated. There is no way to really test drive the car since it is not local to me (but is a day's travel). Thx.

[blackESfour]

it will keep up off the line, go stg2 and youll be more than fine.

[akatz]

I dream over the growl that comes from the NA V8 in that M3, that may just be enough to keep them M. That S4 does sound pretty sweet though.

[hanzy]

Can you get rid of the avant/Jetta and keep the M and still get the S?

Best of both worlds.

[cohenfive]

Can you get rid of the avant/Jetta and keep the M and still get the S?

Best of both worlds.

You little sneak, you saw my signature!! We are also talking about just keeping a car up at the house, which would mean selling the jetta and getting something like a used subi. We love the a4 avant, it is one of the things that has me thinking about doing the swap. The avant is my wife's car, and since there will be times when I go up without her, am thinking that having a fun all weather car might be a good idea. But I hear you, it is tough to get rid of the m3. I really haven't heard all that much enthusiasm for doing the swap, even on the audi sites.

[ralniv]

Something to ponder... A stock S4 has more torque than an M3, which means it will pull harder. A stage 1 or 2 will widen the torque gap substantially. Test drive one and see what you think.

[Wusty]

Others will chime on with their opinions, mine is that it will 100% stand toe-to-toe with your M3 & tuned as you're describing, probably exceed it, especially if your vacation homes at elevation leaving your NA M3 sucking for air. You'll love it. With a few suspension upgrades as well, you'll also be equally in love with it's handling. My $.02. I'd so go for it!

[oc cc]

Okay, you are comparing a stock M3 to a modded S4. A few things to consider:

-S4 will be faster
-M3 will have better steering feel, but some of that gap is lessened since the previous owner of the S4 has the drivetrain stabilizer bar added
-Handling will be very similar, especially if the S4 has the sports diff option
-M3 will be more fun to toss
-M3 will sound better, but the exhaust should lessen the gap
-S4 is a heck of a lot of fun to drive, even if it is not RWD
-S4 has almost 100 more tq, but similar hp. Needless to say the mid-range passing power is better, and it is no competition off the line- AWD will let you point and shoot. You basically gotta ask yourself "Do I like being pushed back in my seat at any given moment I smash the throttle, or do I prefer wringing my engine out till every last rpm?"
-Objective, but I like the interior of the S4 better
-Coupe= more sexy than sedan
-S4 gets better mileage
-Both will look equally aggressive since one is modded and the other is a beast out of the box

Ultimately, you can't lose either way. Here's what I would do personally: keep the M3, throw some wheels and exhaust on it, keep the A4 avant and add the following goodies: Eurocode drive-train stabilizer, EC sways and endlinks, APR K04 upgrade, BBS wheels, intercooler and done! Sure, it won't be an S4, but it will be a quick wagon with great AWD handling but civil manners that can accommodate your wife.

[800088]

A stage 2+ will eat an M3 E92 unless it is blown.

[lapisia]

I agree with oc cc, keep the M3!

also, inb4 god's chariot blah blah blah jibes

[Auditude2.0T]

Go S4 you won't regret it. I've had a lot of seat time in an M3. It's got no power down low, I hate the shifter and I'm not sold on the looks. The M3 however has a better exhaust note and the steering is much butter along with the awesome thick steering wheel.

I honestly walk M3's bad. The only M3 that ever gave me a run for my money had under drive pulleys, intake, Catless, exhaust, tune and lw mods on race gas that put down 400+whp.

[drob23]

I'd keep the RWD M3 and use a beater (whatever that is to you, wrx hatch?) to get to/from the mountains. You live in the bay area so there's no reason to switch for an AWD just so you can commute 8 hrs/2 times a month/4 months of the year. There are lots of reasons to switch to the S4, but this doesn't seem very compelling...

If there are other reasons you want to switch, then by all means the S4 really kicks ass, especially if you want to tune .

[MrFunk]

Keep the M3. You already have Quattro for the snow storms.

[cohenfive]

Thanks gang...not surprisingly a mixed bag which is how I feel as well. My wife and I are not going to be coming up together all the time, so having another all weather car at the ready is a reasonable thought. I guess I could take the avant up and leave my wife with our minivan on occaison, but that just doesn't seem fair to her. She loves the avant (as do I), which is one of the reasons I was considering an audi for myself. Do the rear seats fold down on the s4, and does audi make any 'touchless' racks for the roof like bmw does?

[audiaudacity]

S4- can't beat that AWD handling!

[Wusty]

Seats fold down in it has a center ski slot.

[Akrion]

Can you get rid of the avant/Jetta and keep the M and still get the S?

And some of the $3K+ camera lenses :)

Nah... Just kidding ... +1 for your photo gear ... wish you posted some pics taken with it :) .. like of the M3 for example ...

[cohenfive]

Thanks for the comment on the photo gear...mtn biking and photography are probably my two big vices these days. I'm older so have accumulated this stuff over several years, and have found myself fortunate in being able to buy most of the gear at pretty good prices..Here are a couple of images taken with the gear...


[IMG][/IMG]

[westwest888]

I happen to race with a lot of M3's and came from an e90 myself which I was racing, but it was the N52 3.0L engine in the sedan body. A factory M3 is faster than an S4 in every way. Don't listen to people who blabber about peak torque. The M3 is about really even power delivery all the way through, and holding the gear until it sings high. There's plenty of places on track where I have to shift before a turn or at the apex (if it's straight) where an M3 would run to track out. But the S4 can get on the gas earlier too because of the AWD.

I also took my stage 1 S4 to the drag strip with an M3 sedan from the same model year. He was 0.01 MPH faster.

I have the same concerns with you about going to Tahoe. That's why I haven't done a full suspension - I want the ground clearance for snow if I go up there for a season.

[PaperishPlastic]

I happen to race with a lot of M3's and came from an e90 myself which I was racing, but it was the N52 3.0L engine in the sedan body. A factory M3 is faster than an S4 in every way. Don't listen to people who blabber about peak torque. The M3 is about really even power delivery all the way through, and holding the gear until it sings high. There's plenty of places on track where I have to shift before a turn or at the apex (if it's straight) where an M3 would run to track out. But the S4 can get on the gas earlier too because of the AWD.

I also took my stage 1 S4 to the drag strip with an M3 sedan from the same model year. He was 0.01 MPH faster.

I have the same concerns with you about going to Tahoe. That's why I haven't done a full suspension - I want the ground clearance for snow if I go up there for a season.

So what are you going to get now that your selling your car?

[Auditude2.0T]

I happen to race with a lot of M3's and came from an e90 myself which I was racing, but it was the N52 3.0L engine in the sedan body. A factory M3 is faster than an S4 in every way. Don't listen to people who blabber about peak torque. The M3 is about really even power delivery all the way through, and holding the gear until it sings high. There's plenty of places on track where I have to shift before a turn or at the apex (if it's straight) where an M3 would run to track out. But the S4 can get on the gas earlier too because of the AWD.

I also took my stage 1 S4 to the drag strip with an M3 sedan from the same model year. He was 0.01 MPH faster.

I have the same concerns with you about going to Tahoe. That's why I haven't done a full suspension - I want the ground clearance for snow if I go up there for a season.

That's bc u suck in the 1/4 mile and you have malfuntioning tune but you're too delusional to see that

[S4 00 2.7]

S4- can't beat that AWD handling!

X2

If you must part ways with the M3, you definitely can't go wrong with an S4. I like the Audi interior better too.

[ralniv]

That's bc u suck in the 1/4 mile and you have malfuntioning tune but you're too delusional to see that

That's a wee bit harsh. I was going to ask who had the faster time. I bet the S4 won and the M3 trapped faster.

[westwest888]

That's bc u suck in the 1/4 mile and you have malfuntioning tune but you're too delusional to see that

You going to Watkins Glen this summer, or do you have to mow your parents' lawn for free rent on Strong Island?

[westwest888]

So what are you going to get now that your selling your car?

Did that kid in the other thread retract his bid on the eBay headlights? I was afraid to look after I posted. I like this car and nothing shiny new has caught my eye.

[PaperishPlastic]

Did that kid in the other thread retract his bid on the eBay headlights? I was afraid to look after I posted. I like this car and nothing shiny new has caught my eye.

What bid? He has those headlights on his car for a while. Also they are the stock bixenons he just added additional led's so he can switch between stock to stock with purple LEDs on at the same time. Now man up and sell your car.

[westwest888]

What bid? He has those headlights on his car for a while. Also they are the stock bixenons he just added additional led's so he can switch between stock to stock with purple LEDs on at the same time. Now man up and sell your car.

The car is only leaving the planet in one of two ways. Either I ball it up at the track and live to tell about it, or I export it to Mexico like my BMW because it's no longer street legal or safe for use in the states.

[PaperishPlastic]

The car is only leaving the planet in one of two ways. Either I ball it up at the track and live to tell about it, or I export it to Mexico like my BMW because it's no longer street legal or safe for use in the states.

What? You said it yourself. Why the fuck did you get everyone's hopes up like that?

[LINDW4LL]

Things to consider:

-Tuned S4 will be faster than your M3.
-quattro>RWD
-S4 has better interior
-Handling will be very similar
-S4 has larger powerband and more usable torque
-M3 has better exhaust sound IMO

[Auditude2.0T]

You going to Watkins Glen this summer, or do you have to mow your parents' lawn for free rent on Strong Island?

Nope they have a landscaper

[dbX79]

BMW and Audi are two different ride feels. I prefer Audi for comfort on the road. But if your looking for the great road experience just keep your M3. BMW's are know for being the Driver's car. Honestly, if I could I'd keep both ^^


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[shonseb]

Drivers car: M3.
But if you want a car that you can use all year round, then the S4 is the way to go. Snow's got nothing on Quattro. This past winter I was was going back and forth from NY/Ohio nearly every other weekend. I was driving through blizzards in the Pennsylvania wilds passing cars and trucks without breaking a sweat (I had blizzaks on too). Now imagine driving an m3 through conditions like that. I can already see the ESP flashing....

[Tweakophyte]

All it takes is one heavy snow on a Friday evening and you'll wish you had AWD. That sierra cement is a pain. Snow tires + AWD = no chains in a snow storm. To some extent, the S4 will help you get more value out of your cabin, because you can use it more often.
However
You have to ask yourself how often you'll want to head up to the mountains in the winter when your wife is already up there. Since you are in the Bay Area, snows in the winter are of little use, other than when you are in the mountains. You'd have the same problem with the M3.

[dbX79]

I agree with the last two guys. BMW has it good sides. But normally AWD is an upgrade and most Audi's have Quattro. My wife has a 328i and its a nice coupe that's a V6. Good quality but I still get road noise and the interior isn't anything compared to my A4 or S4. I sat in one hour of traffic in the BMW and it was real uncomfortable. But sitting in a Audi i was just enjoying the ride. True story! Not just saying that because I like Audi. I have both.


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[Auditude2.0T]

Just a quick comparison..

The fastest N/A M3 in the 1/4 mile did a 11.88@118mph with a GIAC Tune, Race gas, Downpipes, Catback, intake, underdrive pulleys, DCT, drag radials in a negative DA. That same car on race gas did a 10.71s 60-130 on race gas.

My S4 which is the fastest manual did the 1/4 mile in [email protected] with GIAC Tune, Race Gas, Testpipes, Catback, intake, supercharger pulley, short shifter/clutch on all seasons in a worse DA. My best 60-130 on race gas was a 10.5 if I remember correctly.

So a full bolt on M3 is a very good race with a full bolt on S4 but the M3 needs drag radials to touch me.

Matter of fact, my fathers S4 when he was Revo 93 tune, AWE Catback and Intake ran a 11.0s 60-130 (DSG). That same night my friends DCT M3 with race Exhaust and drop in filters went 11.8s 60-130 so even up top the stage 1 s4 has the advantage vs. a stock/lightly modded M3. From a dig or low speed the margin between the two would be even larger in favor of the S4.

[Auditude2.0T]

Stage 1 Supercharged M3's from m3post:
11.61 @ 123.17 MPH - 1.83 60' - E92 M3 DCT / ESS VT600 / Akrapovic Evolution / 93 Oct/ Pilot Super Sport / DA +1000'
11.68 @ 122.44 MPH - 1.87 60' - E92 M3 DCT / ESS VT 535 / 93 octane / Street tires / DA -1600'
11.71 @ 132.26 MPH - 2.14 60' - E92 M3 DCT / ESS VT625 / 100 octane / Nitto DR's / DA -700'
11.94 @ 118.66 MPH - 1.93 60' - E92 M3 6-MT / ESS VT600 / 93 octane / DR's / DA -1100'

Stage 2 B8 S4 from Audizine:
11.69 @ 117.12 MPH - 1.64 60' - B8 S4 DSG / APR Stage 2 / 110 octane / HFC, CPS / DA ?
11.75 @ 119.6 MPH - 1.83 60' - B8 S4 DSG / APR Stage 2 / 110 octane / HFC, CPS / DA ?
11.83 @ 116.41 MPH - 1.74 60' - B8 S4 DSG / APR Stage 2 / 100 octane / Headers / DA?
11.87 @ 116.77 MPH - 1.75 60' - B8 S4 DSG / APR Stage 2 / 100 octane / CPS, LW mods / DA ?
11.88 @ 117.9 MPH - 1.78 60' - B8 S4 6MT / GIAC Stage 2 / 104 octane / CPS, TP's / DA ?


There's a fun little comparison. Obviously the M3 is the faster car, but usable power the S4 is def the easier car to run consistent and I think that a great showing for the less powerful, heavier, smaller dispacement Audi.

[blmlozz]

Here's my dilemma....I have a pristine e92 m3 which I love, but we just bought a vacation house on the Nevada side of the Sierra. I'm thinking that my m3 isn't going to be able to get up there during the winter rain/snow season, so I'm considering swapping for an S4. I know the oem s4 is not in the same class as the m3, but the one I'm considering has a bunch of goodies--stasis touring package, apr exhause, bbs wheels (hate the stasis rims), drivetrain stablizer, awe intake, plus a bunch of little goodies including a set of blizzaks for winter use.

While I love the m3, I'm wondering how a mildly tuned s4 like the above will compare. I doubt it will handle as well, but with the added boost will it keep up off the line? Any thought would be appreciated. There is no way to really test drive the car since it is not local to me (but is a day's travel). Thx.

Stictly referring to the question, my advice would be to get some snow tires for the M3. AWD is pretty over-rated on plowed roadways, and nothing will save you on ice-patches except spiked chains, espically a car that gives you false confidence. I can get sideways at will with my piffly 200Hp Avant the few times we get powder here if I want to.

However, it doesn't sound to me like that's really what you want to know more than it is that maybe you like the A4 and want a new toy.

Realisticly, buying an AWD car to replace your M3 because you *might* get some snow in a vacation house that you *might* visit for a grand total of a month out of the year is ridiclious.

If you want some pats on the back for making a switch, you'll find a lot of them here, and there's no reason to be ashamed of that. The B8 S4 is a very, very nice vehicle that can be modified to be pretty quick. If you're not taking the M3 to laguna secca every tuesday something less boy-racer isn't a bad thing. If you do, and you're looking for something that has the jour de vive of the M3, I think you'll be dissapointed.

[mcoomer]

Do you have kids? Sell them, buy the S4, and keep the M3. Plus, you'll have more disposable income without the eventual college tuition payments. You're welcome!

[OmaHahn]

That Eagle looks SO pissed your taking it's picture!!! Sorry, back to thread...

[S4 00 2.7]

Do you have kids? Sell them, buy the S4, and keep the M3. Plus, you'll have more disposable income without the eventual college tuition payments. You're welcome!

Problem solved.