Coilover comparison: Bilstein, KW, Stasis

[S4 Wheelman]

I have had my S4 just over a year now, and finally started to do a few mods. Needed new tires so I changed from the stock 18s to 19'' BBS while I was at it. Things wearing out is a great excuse for an upgrade! Needed front brakes, so ordered some upgraded parts (but no BBK, sadly). Anyway, now that it has the 19s on it, it seems to appear higher than before. I knew I wanted to lower it eventually, but now seeing how it sits I am not really happy with it, so want to speed that process up if possible. I don't really want springs only since I had that on my old M5 and I was a little disappointed with the end result. I did not like how I was unable to fine tune the height how I want. Also, I think the overall drop on my S4 should be more than on my M5 (more wheel gap stock in the Audi) and I would also hope that coilovers generate a bigger improvement in handling. I've never had coilovers on a car before.

My main concerns are:
1) a quality coilover that will not rust. I live in New England and we have crappy winters
2) adjustable height obviously, so I can get the stance how I want it. I'm not a part of the hellaflush crowd or any of that, but I want as little wheel gap as possible while not rubbing.
3) improve handling and corner flatter for street use. I don't track the car, but I do enjoy some spirited drives on back roads.

I am leaning towards the Bilstein PSS10 as that offers lots of adjust-ability, and is the least expensive of the 3. I am not really looking to spend $3k on the Stasis ones. I do like that it comes with a rear anti-roll bar, which I would likely add anyway, but I think the price difference is hard for me to justify on a street car. Also, a friend of mine has the PSS9 on his 996tt and that is my favorite riding/handing car that I have been in. I know they are completely different platforms, though. I wish they still made the PSS9 for our cars, but I can't find it anywhere. I don't think I need the extra stuff on the PSS10. The only concern I have with the Bilstein is that I have heard they do not go as low as come other coilovers.

So I would very much like some opinions from other members with these coilovers, and if you happen to have a picture of your car with one of these setups on it and 19'' wheels, I would greatly appreciate it.

[jran76]

I have the Stasis now, and had the ST's before (same as KW V1). I would personally go with the Bilstein or Stasis, but it really depends on what you are after. The first thing I would ask is do you really need coilovers? The adjustment options are great, but they are more "work" for you. If you just want to lower your car, go with a nice set of springs and shocks. Go with coilovers if you really want the most adjustment options, or if you are interested in the absolute best performance.

The Stasis are awesome, but expensive and require regular maintenance every couple of years. Ride quality and height adjustment are good. Only really rough/sharp pavement is an issue, and there is nothing but height adjustments available. For track and overall street performance, I don't think you can beat these. I have had 5-6 sets of coilovers, and these are the best so far. I love what they do to the car, and linear springs are the way to go. I have heard of a few part failures, but I think you are more likely to get that with small quantity higher end products like this. Hit up Alex at Europrice if you decide on Stasis, and he will hook you up with a deal (I paid $2100 for just the coilovers).

Bilstein is always a good option. They offer the most adjustments, but again, that's more you have to worry about. The ride and performance are good from what others have said, although I have heard you cannot go really low if that is what you are after. I would assume the overall reliability is better than something like the Stasis.

The ST/KW have had too many issues for me to recommend them. I am pretty sure they have addressed most of their problems at this point, but it's not worth it to me. My rear springs were sagging and making nasty noises, and several people have had similar issues with their rear springs. My previous experience with KW had been really good, and they seem to make good products, but there were definitely issues with the B8 S4. Unless someone can say unequivocally that they addressed all their issues, I would not buy them right now. I understand others may disagree....

[Tomasz@Startup]

Is Eibach too high and H&R too low for you? Do some research on springs first and see if that does the trick for you.

Tomasz

[xxx_mojo_xxx]

Do eibach and H&R do springs for 2013 B8.5? Links please...

[S4 Wheelman]

I have the Stasis now, and had the ST's before (same as KW V1). I would personally go with the Bilstein or Stasis, but it really depends on what you are after. The first thing I would ask is do you really need coilovers? The adjustment options are great, but they are more "work" for you. If you just want to lower your car, go with a nice set of springs and shocks. Go with coilovers if you really want the most adjustment options, or if you are interested in the absolute best performance.

The Stasis are awesome, but expensive and require regular maintenance every couple of years. Ride quality and height adjustment are good. Only really rough/sharp pavement is an issue, and there is nothing but height adjustments available. For track and overall street performance, I don't think you can beat these. I have had 5-6 sets of coilovers, and these are the best so far. I love what they do to the car, and linear springs are the way to go. I have heard of a few part failures, but I think you are more likely to get that with small quantity higher end products like this. Hit up Alex at Europrice if you decide on Stasis, and he will hook you up with a deal (I paid $2100 for just the coilovers).

Bilstein is always a good option. They offer the most adjustments, but again, that's more you have to worry about. The ride and performance are good from what others have said, although I have heard you cannot go really low if that is what you are after. I would assume the overall reliability is better than something like the Stasis.

The ST/KW have had too many issues for me to recommend them. I am pretty sure they have addressed most of their problems at this point, but it's not worth it to me. My rear springs were sagging and making nasty noises, and several people have had similar issues with their rear springs. My previous experience with KW had been really good, and they seem to make good products, but there were definitely issues with the B8 S4. Unless someone can say unequivocally that they addressed all their issues, I would not buy them right now. I understand others may disagree....

Thank you very much for the detailed response. That deal you mention sounds pretty good. When you say "2100 for just the coilovers," what parts did you give up in order to make that happen? It appears that the kit would normally come with a rear sway bar, but is there anything else that would normally be included that was not included for your price?

I am hoping someone has some pictures of the Bilsteins so I can get an idea of how low they can go. As I said before, I am not looking to lay the car out on the ground, and I think the Bilstein will accommodate my needs, but I would like some pictures to confirm.

[Jacksonbeall]

Ran KW's for a long time before going on air. They are very strong coils IMHO and they have a very nice feel to them along with a very long adjustment range.

[jran76]

Thank you very much for the detailed response. That deal you mention sounds pretty good. When you say "2100 for just the coilovers," what parts did you give up in order to make that happen? It appears that the kit would normally come with a rear sway bar, but is there anything else that would normally be included that was not included for your price?

I am hoping someone has some pictures of the Bilsteins so I can get an idea of how low they can go. As I said before, I am not looking to lay the car out on the ground, and I think the Bilstein will accommodate my needs, but I would like some pictures to confirm.

Just the rear sway bar was not included.

[1MORLAP]

Do eibach and H&R do springs for 2013 B8.5? Links please...

No difference between B8 and B8.5.

[[email protected]]

You really can't beat the Ohlins for performance on the street. Many have the impression it's just a track capable suspension, but it's far more than that. The suspension will have the widest range of use because of it's dual digressive valving. Essentially what this means is you have two separate circuits in the damper that work for different purposes. A high speed system which allows the damper to react very quickly to imperfections in the road, potholes, train tracks, etc and helps to eliminate you feeling that shock within the cabin and keep the tire planted on the road. The low speed system which handles loading forces such as pitch, roll and dive in order to keep the car as flat as possible. The Ohlins system will run a relatively higher spring rate than any other kit because of the dampers capabilities. What this means to you is a very flat and controlled ride, but also a comfortable day to day ride. Generally you have to compromise with suspensions, firm and flat but somewhat uncomfortable for day to day use or soft and anything but flat however very comfortable for daily use. You get the best of both worlds with Ohlins systems.

jran76 already had a rear sway bar which is an integral part of the complete STaSIS setup. That is the only way a system can be sold to a customer without the rear sway bar included, even then it takes me a bit of wiggling usually to get the sale approved.

If you or anyone is interested in a quote do just let me know via PM or email: [email protected]

Cheers,

[S4 Wheelman]

And the bilstein does not have this type of valving? Do you have any picture or does jran have any pictures of the car on those coilovers? Also as I know understand it, the Stasis coilovers has only height adjustments? And from your post I would infer that it does not need damping adjustments due to the dual circuits which supposedly allow the best of both worlds? I'd say I am leaning towards the bilsteins mainly for price reasons, but I would be interested to know what you can do on the Stasis coilovers. I'll pm you.

[jran76]

I don't have pics with the Stasis; only the ST's. I'll try to get a couple later today, but the car is a little dirty....

[[email protected]]

I do not know specifically what the valving is, however the dual digressive valving on the Ohlins is a step above other offerings even if they claim to have digressive technology. This is why there is a price difference between the kits you are seeing.

As for damper adjustments, generally not useful when a kit is properly valved, especially for mainly street use. The reason I say this is that a large range of adjustment of a damper isn't needed for those people not looking for that last ounce of performance on track. Adjustable dampers actually tend to get set incorrectly quite often and puts the kit out of harmony between the spring and damper. People look to take an overly soft kit, which is because of the springs, and crank up the damper which causes the kit to appear firmer and control the roll better but you get a very bouncy ride and the damper can't react quickly to imperfections in the road. Conversely a kit with springs that are too high a rate for the damper people may try to turn the damper down to get the ride comfortable and you get a very jittery ride. There really is a sweet spot for a damper to work with a specific spring rate over a wide range of movements. I have a set of Motorsport suspension on my older S4 B5 that have a huge range of adjustment and once I found what my ideal street setting was for the specific springs I chose I never adjusted it again unless I was at a track event and even then I would be tinkering with the adjustments at each track because some are bumpier than others. Really no major need to adjust dampers on a properly matched kit, even for driving events.

Cheers,

[S4 Wheelman]

I don't have pics with the Stasis; only the ST's. I'll try to get a couple later today, but the car is a little dirty....

Dirty is no problem, you should see mine! Going to try to wash it today though. Just trying to get an idea of the stance.

Thanks for the PM, Alex.

[jran76]

I'll see what I can do. I went with the Stasis recommended settings, and it raised the rear about 1/8" from the highest setting I had on the ST's. The ST/KW's are good if you want to go really low, but I was almost tucking my rear tire at the highest setting in the rear. The Stasis has a good amount of adjustment to go higher than the ST's, but also not quite as low (although the Stasis will be low enough for 99% of the people out there). If that makes sense....

[wwhan]

And the bilstein does not have this type of valving? Do you have any picture or does jran have any pictures of the car on those coilovers? Also as I know understand it, the Stasis coilovers has only height adjustments? And from your post I would infer that it does not need damping adjustments due to the dual circuits which supposedly allow the best of both worlds? I'd say I am leaning towards the bilsteins mainly for price reasons, but I would be interested to know what you can do on the Stasis coilovers. I'll pm you.

What to choose, depends on what is important you and your list of priorities in your order of preference.

All the coilovers reduce the suspension travel. The various coilover kits use the same part number for Audi B8 S4/S5/S4/A5.

The Bilstein PSS10 has progressive rate springs (for street comfort), so the first inch of travel is softer than the next 1" of travel. The Bilstein dampers are easliy adjustable externally, but even on the softest setting, the ride is similar to stock S4 suspension. The rear damper adjusters have a much larger height adjustment range than the KW coilovers.

The Stasis Coilovers are fixed rate springs (Hyperco or Eibach Linear Rate), so one could get some custom springs, but over a limited range to be compatible with Ohlins damper calibration. For track use, fixed rate springs tend to have the edge and would be the setup to get, if tracking is most important to you. Here is the Ohlins page discussing the dual mode Damper technology; http://www.ohlinsusa.com/road-track-tech


The KONI FSD dampers have a two mode damping also (1Hz & 10 Hz damping response). http://www.koni-na.com/fsd-frequency...ve-damping.cfm. It did not feel any softer than the stock S4 suspension.

The KW V3 dampers have both rebound & compression damping adjustment & progressive springs. Here is the page talking about KW Damper valve technology; http://www.kw-suspension.com/us/kw_valve_technology.php


The KW Street Comfort is the only coilover for the Audi B8 S4/S5/S4/A5 that rides softer than the S4 or A4 sport suspension & has softer progressive springs.

I did not go with the Stasis setup, because the stock S4 suspension is too rough for the roads I drive, so I went with the KW Street Comfort. I tried the PSS10, also. I am happy with the KW Street Comfort coilovers, used with Hotchkis sway bars, Alu-Kreuz & Eurocode end links.

Most of the KW coilover issues have to do with the limited rear adjuster range. The Street Comfort KW rear spring free length is about 9.75" long & the PSS10 rear spring is 10" long, but the Bilstein has a lot more adjustment range, see the KW rear adjuster in purple compared to the Bilstein PSS10 rear adjuster.



Here is a KW damper range chart for the various KW models.

[S4 Wheelman]

Thank you, very informative post. I don't find the stock S4 suspension too harsh, and wouldn't mind going a bit harsher if it would handle make it sharper in the corners, but I don't want it to rattle fillings loose.

[Nightauditor]

I can´t speak for KW or others but I can report very positive things from Bilstein. I have had top notch Bilstein suspensions on three of my cars including the S4 and I was never disappointed.

I have the bilstein ride-control suspension which lets you adjust damper stiffness between two settings on the move. That comes in very handy in a dd as the normal setting is more comfortable than stock while still being a lot more stiff.

I coupled the whole thing with the alukreuz and H&R adjustable swaybars front and rear. The end result is a world away from stock in terms of steering feel, cornering speed and overall feel. I can highly recommend bilstein.

To be fair though, I have heard good things of KW as well. And they have a similar suspension which offers a lot more options to adjust. And they even have an iPhone app for it.

[Seinsmeld13]

I had the Bilstein PSS10's on my 2010 S4. I liked it enough that I had it removed from my 2010 and it is being installed asswe speak on my 2013 S4. Thiese Bilsteins go plenty low enough that your camber will be way out of wack. In order to get this to align I am also installing SPC adj. control arms. Anyway I pick it up later today. I'll post some pics here later in the day.

[jh901]

Thank you, very informative post. I don't find the stock S4 suspension too harsh, and wouldn't mind going a bit harsher if it would handle make it sharper in the corners, but I don't want it to rattle fillings loose.

What did you end up going with?

Does anyone have the Ohlins that Alex recommended?

[[email protected]]

I know that me answering the question isn't the same as other owners, but I did just install Ohlins into the Allroad project. Night and day. More comfortable than the factory sport suspension, far flatter, actually made the car tossable and quite fun considering what it was like before. I can't say enough about the Ohlins kits.

Cheers,

[Akatsuki...]

I recently had a chance to test Nivelk's S4 with Ohlins and My S4 with PSS10 on the track.

I have to say... Both handled evenly well, but I find the Ohlins very bumpy compared to my PSS10..
Another reason why I chose PSS10 over the Ohlins was because no one seems to have experience with them in Canadian winter.. but lots of ppl had PSS10 thru canadian winters no problems.

Hope that helps.

[macbook1]

PSS10s, even at a setting of 6, the car rides better (less jarring) than stock....the whole rebuild every 2-3 years on the Ohlins was a no-no for me....

[jh901]

PSS10s, even at a setting of 6, the car rides better (less jarring) than stock....the whole rebuild every 2-3 years on the Ohlins was a no-no for me....

What is this rebuild situation all about?

[wwhan]

What is this rebuild situation all about?

Stasis Limited suspension warranty

"To maintain the lifetime limited warranty policy, STaSIS Engineering requires an annual (1 year)
or 12,000 mile service interval for every Motorsport damper and a bi-annual (2 year) or 25,000
mile service interval for every Signature Line damper.
o Consumers must schedule service directly with STaSIS Engineering, parts must be returned with a
STaSIS issued RMA number which is issued when scheduled.
o Service consists of a complete overhaul of 2 front and 2 rear dampers. Overhaul will include a
complete disassembly and inspection of all dampers, replacement of all seal heads, and fluid
change for all dampers. Cost to consumer - $500 plus any applicable shipping charges.
o Consumer will be advised"

[sgroer]

What is this rebuild situation all about?

Ohlin's coilovers from Stasis require you to remove them from the car eavery 2 years or 25000 miles and send them to Stasis to be rebuilt at a cost of roughly $200. That's if you want to keep the lifetime warranty. It basically means a suspension installation each time, so for the non-DIY'er, it gets very expensive.