Embarassed by a Mazdaspeed 3

[jyoung75]

Yesterday I was at lunch with a passenger and took off fairly aggressively from a light. I hit ~30 mph and looked in the rearview mirror to see a Mazdaspeed 3 riding my $@% and figured I would gun it to show him who was boss. Punched it and figured I'd lose him but he stuck on my tail all the way to ~75mph at which point I backed down since we were not in an area that I would feel comfortable going higher. He clearly had room to spare and was riding my direct tail when I backed off. Was a bit embarassed to see this "cheap" car show me up like that. What gives? Clearly I wasn't ready for a race, but didn't think I'd get eaten up by a Mazdaspeed 3. How fast is a modded Mazdaspeed 3? I'm feeling a bit down about the whole thing...

[mcimiluca]

Then you look at the car and it's still a mazda. I dont care if an sti or mazda or whatever smokes me on the road. There's so much more to our cars then the speed. I know how you feel though haha it's always a shame because he probably paid half for the car, but that's all he has.

[PitchS4]

If you have a tune you should have put some distance on him. He was obviously modded. Don't get frustrated anyone can dump coin into a "cheap" car and make it fast. Your manhood is the same size as it was the day before.

FWIW they are pretty close to a stock S4:

2007 Mazdaspeed 3 0-60 mph 5.3 Quarter mile 13.8
2008 Mazdaspeed 3 0-60 mph 5.5 Quarter mile 14.0
2010 Mazdaspeed 3 0-60 mph 5.1 Quarter Mile 13.7

[U2SLO]

Very light car, will get 375-400 whp with bolton's, front mount intercooler,and good tune.If He had a lane next to you by the time you hit 75 you would have saw the back of him.

[mcimiluca]

i agree about the tune... huge difference on these cars.

[tj@roc-euro]

like u2slo said, those cars can be pretty quick with some simple bolt ons and a tune. However, its still a mazda speed 3..

[MrFunk]

Time to get tuned!

Stock S4 vs Stock Mazda3 would be close from #'s posted above. Those are AWD aren't they? Or is that only the 6?
Stock S4 vs Tuned Mazda3 and I think you'd be beat => they are very tunable and light... fun car actually... Different type of car to the S4 tho...
Tuned S4 vs Tuned Mazda3 and you'll be in the lead.
Tuned S4 vs Tuned and bolt on's Mazda3 - I dunno...

Chin up mate!

[Ynnekdude]

He's already got GIAC per his signature

[richib86]

dont be too sad, it uses(d) ko3's out of the same parts bin as the b5 s4 haha

[AWDLover]

Surprised he didn't torque steer right off the road.....

[jfabes]

Very light car, will get 375-400 whp with bolton's, front mount intercooler,and good tune.If He had a lane next to you by the time you hit 75 you would have saw the back of him.

What?? 375 whp...so like 440hp at the crank with 15% dt loss??? No way...please show me! an older bmw 335 with tune, intake and intercooler can hit 400 whp (from 300 crank) and it has two turbos! Did something change on those Mazda cars??? the earlier ones from a few years ago that were rated at 263 hp or something at the crank had a small turbo and there was no gain from a tune. that was one of the reasons i didn't buy one and instead bought a GTI. i was dead even with one from a roll to about 120 in my GTI with APR stg 1 tune only. i talked to the guy afterwards and he had an intake, tune and tires/wheels/suspension. he didn't know what power his car was making, but he was a little surprised he didn't pull on me. he actually told me about the small turbos and the lack of tuning hp as I had already known. GTI stg 1 was about 256 hp with similar weight....so a good race on paper anyway.

[IanVr6]

Hope you are saving for stage 3.

[dparm]

The MS3 is not very fast off the line but once it gets moving it will outrun Evos and STIs. It is deceivingly fast. With a tune it's even faster still. I used to own one.

Ignore the published peak HP -- the power curves on that thing are really flat and the gearing is good.

[EErie B6]

dont be too sad, it uses(d) ko3's out of the same parts bin as the b5 s4 haha

This is incorrect. The only thing the 2 turbos share is the the name. The wheels are completely different.

Even if it was 14yr old technology, he still could have dusted a brand new S4 with it, so if anyone should be laughing, it's him.

[PaperishPlastic]

Hope you are saving for stage 3.

or NOS

[petoria]

I used to own a Mazdaspeed6 and that inline4 with the KO4 made quite a bit of power with some bolt ons and a good tune, but remember, as some have said. It's still a Mazda. I drive my RS4 and I don't miss my MS6 that much AT ALL. Prestige and power. Winner in my books. Unless you want to drop enormous amounts of money into your S4...

[richib86]

i stand corrected haha

This is incorrect. The only thing the 2 turbos share is the the name. The wheels are completely different.

Even if it was 14yr old technology, he still could have dusted a brand new S4 with it, so if anyone should be laughing, it's him.

[b6onboost]

I really don't think most MS3s should be feared. Stock they are high 13/low 14s cars. I can also guarantee that 'bolt-on' MS3s (tune, exhaust, IC, ect) do NOT make anywhere close to 375-400whp. A bolt on MS3 is probably close to stock S4 performance, but to embarass an S4 they'd have to have a turbo upgrade.

No point being embarassed. The fastest cars on the road are often cheaper, older, models that people put a ton of money into.

[CJ_S4]

This is no different than being run by a Cobalt SS, WRX, STi, Evo, or any of those other light cheap and fast turbo cars out there. As much as we want to be 3 times faster because our cars cost 3 times more its just simply not the case - physics doesn't care much about price tags. Cheap bolt on's, tunes, and relatively light weight (to the detriment of perceived quality) are all attributes of this subset of cars.

The way I look at it there is always going to be something faster on the road. Always. He may take pride in keeping up with a sport luxury sedan costing multiples what his car does, but I guarantee you he would take your car in a second over his. Our cars are a thrill to drive, smooth, solid and built like a bank vault. I'd take it every day over some buzzy, built like a tin can, peaky turbo 4 that can run 10's - especially as a daily driver.

The S4 is such a great blend of performance and class. It's super driveable (great engine, great driving dynamics, comfortable, fun) it's a very nice car without going over the top or having a stigma like a Porsche. You don't see them everywhere (335, G37), although I doubt the average person distinguishes between an A4 and an S4 (But the car enthusiasts do). Still has 4 doors and room for 5 people if need be. AWD. And the list goes on...

Hell, I got ran by a Gen 1 Tundra the other day from about 40-80 when I finally started pulling on him...What the hell did he have in that thing???

You made the right choice, so your car isn't the fastest car on the road. So what??

[omegax]

I'm pretty sure it you were in the wrong gear, too low on the RPMs he could have been brake torquing or whatever they do now a days. But you said he was rolling so FWD vs AWD laws of physics. Also there is no way the MS3 made 375whp or more like some of these guys mentioned he would be breaking his tires loose every time he stepped on it.

You also say you weren't racing so maybe you didn't have the pedal all the way to the floor? I wouldn't be too worried about having a MS3 beat me. The S4 is a complete monster in stock form in my opinion.

[motorboatingsob]

Don't worry about it. It is still a cheap car and yes like everyone has said we too could go out and buy a cheap car and put every bolt on possible on the thing to only be fast. You will never have what we do in our cars. not many can say they have luxury and speed. That group get's smaller and smaller as the price of the cars goes up :-)

Hey, look how a guy in a Ferrari would feel when we piss on him with a stage 3 setup. Hell ,some of us could probably hold up pretty well with the older ones with only our tunes. So it is all relative. Ferrari forum has the same thread "Embarrassed by an S4" - I just bought my Ferrari and some cheap ass S4 just beat me in a race... and he spent 200 grand more than us

[VeryBadman]

This is what would happen if we are too obsessed with being the fastest. There are plenty of cars that faster than S4 with mod or not. I like S4 because it gives me power when I want, great looking, and doesn't compromise the comfort. Not so many cars on the street have all of these properties. Many times I drove even slower than a crazy driver on a stock Mazda 3 and I can still enjoy S4 for the luxury (nice cabin, quiet, good sound system). Can we really get that out of Mazda?

[ahcow]

I would be more embarrassed being seen driving a Mazda than getting passed by one.

I usually avoid issues when I drive. I purposely start slower off the line at lights, if that other car wants to gun it, it isn't my business. If they don't move, then I step on it a little, get to around 10-20 over speed limit and stay at that speed. If I am driving home late at night in areas where there are tons of ricers, I just drive the speed limit. It's a no-win situation. You race them and win, you are expected to. You race them and lose, you feel unhappy. What's the point? Plus I think I value my life more than they do, I only drive to my enjoyment.

[Akrion]

First of all if you get the fact that you are the first looser (being 2nd in that "race") out of the way and do some rehabilitation of your ego you will realize that you still have one hell of a car which is a perfect blend of elegance, sportiness/performance and class where the Mazda picked one.

That being said I love the fact that there are situations like those. Once you start feeling to “high” with your car things start to always go downhill in quite a few directions :) Stay humble :)

If money is not an issue and sanity is not an option … you can make a hotdog stand faster than B8 S4 :)

PS. No one mentioned that the passenger in your car did not really add much value in your race with a significantly lighter car :)

[U2SLO]

What?? 375 whp...so like 440hp at the crank with 15% dt loss??? No way...please show me! an older bmw 335 with tune, intake and intercooler can hit 400 whp (from 300 crank) and it has two turbos! Did something change on those Mazda cars??? the earlier ones from a few years ago that were rated at 263 hp or something at the crank had a small turbo and there was no gain from a tune. that was one of the reasons i didn't buy one and instead bought a GTI. i was dead even with one from a roll to about 120 in my GTI with APR stg 1 tune only. i talked to the guy afterwards and he had an intake, tune and tires/wheels/suspension. he didn't know what power his car was making, but he was a little surprised he didn't pull on me. he actually told me about the small turbos and the lack of tuning hp as I had already known. GTI stg 1 was about 256 hp with similar weight....so a good race on paper anyway.

Lets look at what happened to this S4 with tune,Mazda speed was glued to his bumper.It's clear to me that he was running an upgraded turbo,and it's cheap to do on that car.The bolt on turbo kits available are less than what we pay for a exhaust on the S4.I paid 6000.00 for intake headers and exhaust installed on my 13' S4.For 6 grand in a Mazda speed he easily hitting 400 whp.It dosent't take much to make power in those cars.They remind me of the gazillions of bosted hatches that were running up and down the strip walking Zo6's from a roll.Coming home from Waterfest I got walked badly by some old Eclipse with an external wastegate on the NJ Turnpike. I pulled up next to him in the middle lane after he slowed and I gave him the thumb's up!,His window came down he screamed out do i wanna trade cars and laughed.

[richib86]

i got beat by a turbo diesel f350 when i had my rs4. the reason we tune our cars is to be faster, props to the mazdaspeed

[Speed Stick]

you cant win them all. both of you bought your cars for different reasons. if you were looking for pure speed, a jdm turbo sedan/hatch is the way to go.

friend of mine has a evo x with dyno tune, and full exhaust. ran him under 2k for everything and he is dead even with my other buddy's tuned, long tub header c63. but ask me which i would rather have...

[ENV²]

Always a faster car out there
Always a BETTER car out there
Always a better driver out there


If you feel that badly about it, go buy a MS3 or EVO,STi, etc.

There was recently a video of a guy losing to an S4 in his R8. Im sure he went home happy to have an R8 regardless.

[nhman]

Always a faster car out there
Always a BETTER car out there
Always a better driver out there


If you feel that badly about it, go buy a MS3 or EVO,STi, etc.

There was recently a video of a guy losing to an S4 in his R8. Im sure he went home happy to have an R8 regardless.

+1

If I had an S4 and beat the R8, yes I would be saying "I wish that R8 was in my garage". Perhaps the Mazda driver is saying the same about the Audi. Most likely not but the Audi guy doesn't want the Mazda.

The S4 especially with mods is a fast car but still limited due to weight (around 3700 lbs). What is the most HP available at the crank, 450-475HP? As others have stated, the Mazda with mods is a very fast. Plus the curb weight is around 3200 lbs. There's the key difference.

[phillips2024]

as you guys are saying...

its a mazda



it would be funny though to see this thread on the mazda forum. See all of them hooting and haulering about how they SMOKED an s4 and how dumb we are for spending so much money on a :slow" car

[dparm]

I totally lost it when I saw that photo...

[DLAB]

I would be more embarrassed being seen driving a Mazda than getting passed by one.

BOOM!

[Vandalrg]

as you guys are saying...

its a mazda

it would be funny though to see this thread on the mazda forum. See all of them hooting and haulering about how they SMOKED an s4 and how dumb we are for spending so much money on a :slow" car

As an ex-southerner I need to point this out. It's "hootin and hollerin". As in "I'll holler at ya later", or "Who you hollerin at?". I'm not sure what to call this, as it's not really being a grammar nazi, but I think it changes the meaning when it's spelled differently. No hard feelings, but I wanted to point it out. =)

Since you've mentioned it, I'm going to see if I can find something like this on one of their forums... Sounds like fun!

[S4_Phantom]

This is no different than being run by a Cobalt SS, WRX, STi, Evo, or any of those other light cheap and fast turbo cars out there. As much as we want to be 3 times faster because our cars cost 3 times more its just simply not the case - physics doesn't care much about price tags. Cheap bolt on's, tunes, and relatively light weight (to the detriment of perceived quality) are all attributes of this subset of cars.

The way I look at it there is always going to be something faster on the road. Always. He may take pride in keeping up with a sport luxury sedan costing multiples what his car does, but I guarantee you he would take your car in a second over his. Our cars are a thrill to drive, smooth, solid and built like a bank vault. I'd take it every day over some buzzy, built like a tin can, peaky turbo 4 that can run 10's - especially as a daily driver.

The S4 is such a great blend of performance and class. It's super driveable (great engine, great driving dynamics, comfortable, fun) it's a very nice car without going over the top or having a stigma like a Porsche. You don't see them everywhere (335, G37), although I doubt the average person distinguishes between an A4 and an S4 (But the car enthusiasts do). Still has 4 doors and room for 5 people if need be. AWD. And the list goes on...

Hell, I got ran by a Gen 1 Tundra the other day from about 40-80 when I finally started pulling on him...What the hell did he have in that thing???

You made the right choice, so your car isn't the fastest car on the road. So what??

Those Tundras are damn fast! I too raced one from about 45-90 and he kept up with me. I was in shock cause it's a huge truck! What's the deal with those??

[CJ_S4]

Those Tundras are damn fast! I too raced one from about 45-90 and he kept up with me. I was in shock cause it's a huge truck! What's the deal with those??

Haha...I don't know, this one was a short cab but it was old, like a 2000 or so. TRD made superchargers for those 4.7L V8's and they are pretty light for trucks.

You weren't racing a current body style "full-size" Tundra were you? TRD also makes a Supercharger for those, 500 HP/550 ft-lbs. I used to have one - it put down 470HP/500 ft-lbs to the wheels with headers, exhaust, intake and a custom tune. Thing was a beast and I would guess it could absolutely hang with an S4 to about 75ish. They run 13's even lifted with big wheels/tires. The RCSB (Regular cab short bed) can run 12's with them. Crazy.

[Ynnekdude]

BOOM!

I believe it's "ZOOM!"

[FatalBert]

As an ex-southerner I need to point this out. It's "hootin and hollerin". As in "I'll holler at ya later", or "Who you hollerin at?". I'm not sure what to call this, as it's not really being a grammar nazi, but I think it changes the meaning when it's spelled differently. No hard feelings, but I wanted to point it out. =)

Since you've mentioned it, I'm going to see if I can find something like this on one of their forums... Sounds like fun!

HOLLA!!!

[Vandalrg]

HOLLA!!!

Well shit. hahahahaha

[BrianV]

Remember that he was behind you as well, so he had significant aerodynamic advantages (especially if he was really that close to you as you described). Assuming he got good traction and was in the right gear when you punched it, the story isn't too unbelievable. 75mph isn't really that long/fast.

[jfabes]

Lets look at what happened to this S4 with tune,Mazda speed was glued to his bumper.It's clear to me that he was running an upgraded turbo,and it's cheap to do on that car.The bolt on turbo kits available are less than what we pay for a exhaust on the S4.I paid 6000.00 for intake headers and exhaust installed on my 13' S4.For 6 grand in a Mazda speed he easily hitting 400 whp.It dosent't take much to make power in those cars.They remind me of the gazillions of bosted hatches that were running up and down the strip walking Zo6's from a roll.Coming home from Waterfest I got walked badly by some old Eclipse with an external wastegate on the NJ Turnpike. I pulled up next to him in the middle lane after he slowed and I gave him the thumb's up!,His window came down he screamed out do i wanna trade cars and laughed.

I don't disagree that the mazda wasn't heavily modded....i just don't consider a turbo upgrade to be a "bolt on" even though it does bolt on and only cost $2k. the most power i have seen in a while on a stock turbo with a custom tune (not simply a ecu flash, but mapping, etc.) is in the 295'ish whp. of course there are upgrade turbo kits that will give 400 whp, i wasn't referring to them when i responded to your post as you only mentioned intercooler and good tune. so 375-400 whp isn't possible with the stock turbo.

s4 weighs ~3750 lbs and is ~375 whp with a tune (i think that's fair given the tuner dynos). So that's 10 lb/whp. the mazda is 3250 lbs, so using that same 10 lb/whp, it would have to be 3250/10 = 325 whp to be equivalent. using 15 % dt loss, 325 whp = 382 crank hp or about 120 more than stock....so its clear to me that if he were keeping up with the s4, he would have to have an upgraded turbo as you mentioned.

OP, don't sweat it as others have mentioned. i remember about a year ago, i got pulled on by a 2000 camaro (i'm assuming it was an LS motor) in my e46 m3 with intake, full exhaust and tune. his car was a POS too...but he got me by about 2 car lengths from 70-130. THAT was humiliating. his car couldn't have been worth more than $5k....i sold the M3 for $35k. who's laughing now ;)