SSautochrome/ XS Power exhaust

[AudiB4XD]

I'm a little new here on the forums, more familiar with the crew over at quattroworld but I have received tons of help from the threads here on audizine. Recently I saw the post about the SSautochrome/ XS Power exhaust and decided to make a move on it. And I'm glad I did, this system is quality and I haven't found one fault in it yet. Installation was a breeze, all the hardware and gaskets were included and it is a great improvement over the stock exhaust. It does not drone at all, and it has a nice deep tone that anyone could appreciate. You can also here the turbo spool up more then is did before...unless I'm just over analyzing haha.

If you haven't already I would advise you to seriously consider this exhaust if you don't have one already. This was my first mod to the car, just got it a few weeks ago now. I used to have a B4 Audi 90, so this is my second Audi .

Here's a video of it on my car:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNlB...e_gdata_player

[Turbwhistle]

I was thinking about it, but i wish it only had one rear muffler.

[AudiB4XD]

Do you mean single exhaust tip? Or are you talking about it being resonated...?

[Turbwhistle]

I would like it to have 3" outlets, and no resonator, and be 2.5" from the cat back.

[Elicit4orce]

hey AudiB4XD,

any chance that when you drive through narrow streets or closed in areas, does the exhaust/acceleration sound "raspy" or any unusual sounds?
I have that same exhaust and it sounds great except it annoys me when driving through narrow streets. I am not sure if I have an exhaust leak or not..

[runvsofme07]

This exhaust is only 2.3" piping, great for those staying with kkk frame turbos.. If you have power goals over 300, I would go custom or at least 2.5" piping.. These do sound good but would be pointless for me or anyone else that plans on going BAT..

[CBlockb5a4]

This exhaust is only 2.3" piping, great for those staying with kkk frame turbos.. If you have power goals over 300, I would go custom or at least 2.5" piping.. These do sound good but would be pointless for me or anyone else that plans on going BAT..

you think .2" of an inch is going to make a huge difference? running up to a 3071 on this exhaust is more than enough flow. especially if you're catless....

[Turbwhistle]

you think .2" of an inch is going to make a huge difference? running up to a 3071 on this exhaust is more than enough flow. especially if you're catless....

If im not mistaken, i believe stock is 2.25" any way, so all you need is to delete your cat, and add in either higher flowing mufflers, or just delete them, and you pretty much have a ssac's exhaust. Imo, 2.5 is a perfect all around exhaust, 3" would be better for the guys with huge turbo's, but k03 to gt28 elim would be fine with a 2.5"

Plus, cblock, bigger is always better. =P

[CBlockb5a4]

If im not mistaken, i believe stock is 2.25" any way, so all you need is to delete your cat, and add in either higher flowing mufflers, or just delete them, and you pretty much have a ssac's exhaust. Imo, 2.5 is a perfect all around exhaust, 3" would be better for the guys with huge turbo's, but k03 to gt28 elim would be fine with a 2.5"

Plus, cblock, bigger is always better. =P

I'll take a mandrel bent 2.3" exhaust over a 2.5" crush bent exhaust anyday.......gt3071's have been run on stock exhaust with cats and produced 350awhp......If you want more than that than 3" would be the next step up.....

Pipe diameter is not as important as flow rate through the entire exhaust system. you could use a 2inch pipe if it flowed enough for your application......

[GOODBYNAAIR]

I have the XS Power exhaust on a 3" test pipe running stg 2 on the k03 and the size is really about 2.375 " so its closer to 2.4 if you round it up. it is much better than the stock exhaust on this car, flow is much higher. If you want to cut out the 2 suitcases in the stock exhaust one being the resonator and one being the tail muffler, and replace them with high flow ones or straight pipes you will still spend a few Bens and only have a 2.25 none SS exhaust.. If your not going bigger than GTRS then the 350 bucks spent on this exhaust will work and look just fine. just my 2cents

[coolgraymemo]

If im not mistaken, i believe stock is 2.25" any way

IIRC stock exhaust is ~ 2".



I'm pretty sure there are dyno comparisons out there showing how restrictive exhausts can be. There is no way a 2.3" exhaust provides the same benefits as a 2.75" or 3" on a Gt30. (IMO of course)

[Nateness]

I'll take a mandrel bent 2.3" exhaust over a 2.5" crush bent exhaust anyday.......gt3071's have been run on stock exhaust with cats and produced 350awhp......If you want more than that than 3" would be the next step up.....

Pipe diameter is not as important as flow rate through the entire exhaust system. you could use a 2inch pipe if it flowed enough for your application......

Please post up a link to this 350 AWHP dyno on stock exhaust. That is pretty amazing....

Let me point out that pipe diameter very much has an impact on flow. The important detail here is that there are two types of "losses" in fluid flow systems: major and minor. Major head losses include bends and transitions. Minor losses are due to friction loss, which is the primary loss through a straight pipe. The friction loss through a 2.5" pipe may be insignificant compared to a 3" pipe for a 300+ AWHP application, but the flow restriction in 2.5" bends are significant compared to 3.0" bends....

Two examples from actual users from AZ:
1. Javad's GTRS A4 from 034 Motorsport. He previously ran the Neuspeed 2.75" exhaust and was limited to ~230 AWHP. He installed the newly developed 034 3.0" exhaust and re-dyno'd at ~250 AWHP.

2. Marc's HTA2868 A4. Dyno'd at ~220 AWHP with a 2.5" exhaust. He then installed the APR 3.0" exhaust (modified to work on his A4) and re-dyno'd at ~280 AWHP.

Bottom line: even 2.5" is marginal to make ~220 AWHP. I can only imagine what the 2.3" exhaust will show on a dyno graph. I'm interested to see if anyone has a dyno graph to share for this SSAC exhaust.

[10kredline]

The diameter of an exhaust does have an impact on the flow, just like how my penis's diameter(2 3/4 inches) has an impact on pleasuring my girlfriend. =)

[GOODBYNAAIR]

this guy ^^^ haha

[CBlockb5a4]

so you guys are saying that a 3 inch exhaust with a high flow cat, resonator and a single muffler will flow better than a 2.4 inch system with no cat or resonator and a single muffler.... same number of mandrel bends in both sizes.

[CBlockb5a4]

Two examples from actual users from AZ:
1. Javad's GTRS A4 from 034 Motorsport. He previously ran the Neuspeed 2.75" exhaust and was limited to ~230 AWHP. He installed the newly developed 034 3.0" exhaust and re-dyno'd at ~250 AWHP.

2. Marc's HTA2868 A4. Dyno'd at ~220 AWHP with a 2.5" exhaust. He then installed the APR 3.0" exhaust (modified to work on his A4) and re-dyno'd at ~280 AWHP.

I find it very hard to believe that Javad picked up 20hp by increasing pipe diameter by .25" and Marc gained 60hp from increasing .5"...that seems a little far fetched....

[Turbwhistle]

I find it very hard to believe that Javad picked up 20hp by increasing pipe diameter by .25" and Marc gained 60hp from increasing .5"...that seems a little far fetched....

I feel the same about the numbers, but i don't doubt they saw gains.

[CBlockb5a4]

I feel the same about the numbers, but i don't doubt they saw gains.

dont get me wrong, I'm not saying that a bigger exhaust isnt beneficial and gains arent to be had with increased size....I'm just saying a LOT more is possible, than the interwebs lead you to believe, on smaller diameter pipes...

[Nateness]

I find it very hard to believe that Javad picked up 20hp by increasing pipe diameter by .25" and Marc gained 60hp from increasing .5"...that seems a little far fetched....

Better believe it. Both of these people have posted dynographs. The fundamentals are sound. Feel free to post up a dynograph of a 350 AWHP car using the stock exhaust and cat. You are free to continue to hope and wish that a 2.3" exhaust will be your ticket to high power. I will continue to follow empirical data supported by fundamentals fluid mechanics.

Try looking up Bernoulli sometime. Pressure drop is a function of velocity squared. Take a look at the reduction in velocity of 35 lb/min mass flow through a 3.0" pipe vs. a 2.5" pipe. Try looking up "Cv" values for 90 and 45 degree pipe bends sometime. The reduction in pressure drop, and thus increase in system flow rate, may surprise you.

[coolgraymemo]

Feel free to post up a dynograph of a 350 AWHP car using the stock exhaust and cat. .

I'm also still waiting on this.

I don't think I've ever seen any AZ B5 with a BT+ and a stock exhaust.

[howardfootball]

Pretty sure you would have to run a custom elim type setup to he able to run a 3071 on a stock exhaust because the hot side of the turbo would have a different bolt configuration or even V-banded.

[Nateness]

so you guys are saying that a 3 inch exhaust with a high flow cat, resonator and a single muffler will flow better than a 2.4 inch system with no cat or resonator and a single muffler.... same number of mandrel bends in both sizes.

Essentially, yes. It will also stink less and be less obnoxious.

[runvsofme07]

CBlockb5a4, The Gt3071 does come in a kkk frame version.. check atp, The high flow cat would cause some restriction but pipe cross area is still larger

[AudiSport12]

I've been looking for a Borla to replace my SSAC exhaust. Not a huge fan of it. I havent got it to fit right on there and its a little too noisy for my taste. The Borla was perfect on my '97.

[CBlockb5a4]

I cant find any dyno sheets, I'm going to have to say it's invalid info at this point. I'll be the first one to say that I may have grossly underestimated the value of increasing pipe diameter even if its only .25".

I'm eventually going to be running BT through my SSAC exhaust and tubular mani, I guess I'll have to see what happens at that point...........

[AudiB4XD]

Elicit4orce, I haven't noticed any rasp to the exhaust, you may have a leak. I'm currently running a 034 Motorsports HFC along with the SSAC/XS power exhaust.
Just put in a APR R1 DV yesterday too I have yet to notice any unusual sounds. (Exhaust has been on for about 3 weeks now, 1 week with the HFC)

Also to anyone looking at this exhaust, understand SSAC/XS power are targeting a different crowd. Not the Big Turbo crew, just for people that want a nice sound with minimal drone for every day driving. I've had my experience with other cars running 3 inch exhausts and I really am glad I didn't go that route again. The drone was unbearable for my taste.

I for one am not looking to make big numbers on the dyno with my car. I'll stick with an APR stage 1 tune and upgrade small things here and there.

[Scientist]

Elicit4orce, I haven't noticed any rasp to the exhaust, you may have a leak. I'm currently running a 034 Motorsports HFC along with the SSAC/XS power exhaust.
Just put in a APR R1 DV yesterday too I have yet to notice any unusual sounds. (Exhaust has been on for about 3 weeks now, 1 week with the HFC)

Also to anyone looking at this exhaust, understand SSAC/XS power are targeting a different crowd. Not the Big Turbo crew, just for people that want a nice sound with minimal drone for every day driving. I've had my experience with other cars running 3 inch exhausts and I really am glad I didn't go that route again. The drone was unbearable for my taste.

I for one am not looking to make big numbers on the dyno with my car. I'll stick with an APR stage 1 tune and upgrade small things here and there.

Glad to hear I'm not alone.

Just to update, I will be working on my car next week installing the following:

KO 4-15 Turbo
New turbo oil lines
034 Motorsport HFC
Speedtunning Stage1 (My GIAC Flashed Stage 1 for sale)
SSAC/XS cat back
K/N Filter on OEM box

For the near future a steering column-mounted Podi. I do not want to replace a turbo again.

[mysman]

Glad to hear I'm not alone.

Just to update, I will be working on my car next week installing the following:

KO 4-15 Turbo
New turbo oil lines
034 Motorsport HFC
Speedtunning Stage1 (My GIAC Flashed Stage 1 for sale)
SSAC/XS cat back
K/N Filter on OEM box

For the near future a steering column-mounted Podi. I do not want to replace a turbo again.

GIAC has several tunes for KO4-15, I don't see anything on the Speedtune site for that?

[AudiB4XD]

Glad to hear I'm not alone.

Just to update, I will be working on my car next week installing the following:

KO 4-15 Turbo
New turbo oil lines
034 Motorsport HFC
Speedtunning Stage1 (My GIAC Flashed Stage 1 for sale)
SSAC/XS cat back
K/N Filter on OEM box

For the near future a steering column-mounted Podi. I do not want to replace a turbo again.

Paired with the 034 Motorsports HFC I like the sound of the exhaust a lot better. You can hear to turbo spool up much better too. Prior to the HFC it didn't quite have the sound I was looking for.

Let me know how the K04 and tune go, I may consider pulling the trigger on a turbo manifold paired with the K03 for now with an APR tune.

...I should probably look into a boost gauge soon. More then likely a center vent

[SynapticA4TQM]

The diameter of an exhaust does have an impact on the flow, just like how my penis's diameter(2 3/4 inches) has an impact on pleasuring my girlfriend. =)

but not near as much as the lack of bends ...

to the original topic though... for javad's you're talking about 8% difference, between natural variance, a potential reduction in the bends(due to the redesigned exhaust), along with the diameter increase... besides going from 2.75 to 3" is a 16% increase in the cros sectional area of the pipe. Seems plausible to me... For Marc's the power difference is 21% with a 30% increase in the pipe cross sectional area.

While I don't remember my fluid flow dynamics very well... I know that the volumetric airflow capacity is not linear compared to the cross section area ...

[Nateness]

The results are a combination of bends as well as diameter. Keep in mind that the driving equation for pressure drop through a bend is based on the square of the fluid velocity.

The diameter of the piping has a non-linear relationship (squared) with velocity, so it will always come back to the diameter of the piping ultimately driving the performance potential of the exhaust.

At the end of the day, there will always be a dozen or more unknowns that may be unique to everyone's setup, but empirical data can help fill in the gaps between academic analysis and real-world results. Just look at what others are using and the results published. From the data we have available, there is significant evidence to show that a 2.5" diameter exhaust is going to be limited to aprox. 220 AWHP on GT28-sized compressors.

Who knows what 2.3 would do at this point without dynographs. I suspect that it will be limited to less than what the 2.5" guys are putting out.

but not near as much as the lack of bends ...

to the original topic though... for javad's you're talking about 8% difference, between natural variance, a potential reduction in the bends(due to the redesigned exhaust), along with the diameter increase... besides going from 2.75 to 3" is a 16% increase in the cros sectional area of the pipe. Seems plausible to me... For Marc's the power difference is 21% with a 30% increase in the pipe cross sectional area.

While I don't remember my fluid flow dynamics very well... I know that the volumetric airflow capacity is not linear compared to the cross section area ...

[AudiB4XD]

*Bump

[crazexr7]

Every car I see with this exhaust makes me want it a little less. Almost every car I've seen with this exhaust has never really got it to fit right. On yours it looks like the tips are a little low and off to the side? Is it just me?

[Scientist]

Paired with the 034 Motorsports HFC I like the sound of the exhaust a lot better. You can hear to turbo spool up much better too. Prior to the HFC it didn't quite have the sound I was looking for.

Let me know how the K04 and tune go, I may consider pulling the trigger on a turbo manifold paired with the K03 for now with an APR tune.

...I should probably look into a boost gauge soon. More then likely a center vent

To update, the installation was last week. YES, with the HFC and the SSAutochrome you can hear the turbo spool very well. I love the sound. With the AC on and some music, you can barely tell. So the hell with the AC and the music, let's toe and heel all the way to work. The jury is still out on the Speedtuning with the KO4. It is my impression that the powerband flattens around 2800 rpms. Not like the GIAC which fealt it would keep going until almost redline. How about it Speedtuning guys? My mechanic wanted to do a dyno but didn't know who has one for AWD. I haven't tried it with the GIAC yet. What I know is that I kept getting a CEL (running lean) with the previous (GIAC + KO3) set up and now I don't. I'm curious if I will get the CEL if I swap for the GIAC ECU.

Every car I see with this exhaust makes me want it a little less. Almost every car I've seen with this exhaust has never really got it to fit right. On yours it looks like the tips are a little low and off to the side? Is it just me?

That's correct. Question to anyone who has installed this cat back. Did you managed to bolt in place the bracket from the downpipe to the chassis?

[LDetter]

^ Mine is also a little crooked and the tips slope down a little, seems like they are all like that. Also the whole exhaust hangs down lower then the stock exhaust. I didn't have any problems getting the bolt in on the downpipe, beside mine was missing from the get go so I had to get a new one. The exhaust does sound great, does not drone, and is barley noticeable while cruising the highway. It is pretty audible at full throttle though. My only gripe is the fitment, which I am living with for now. I don't know if it could be tweaked or not to fit better as I haven't had time to do so. You can't expect it to be perfect for $300.

[CBlockb5a4]

^ Mine is also a little crooked and the tips slope down a little, seems like they are all like that. Also the whole exhaust hangs down lower then the stock exhaust. I didn't have any problems getting the bolt in on the downpipe, beside mine was missing from the get go so I had to get a new one. The exhaust does sound great, does not drone, and is barley noticeable while cruising the highway. It is pretty audible at full throttle though. My only gripe is the fitment, which I am living with for now. I don't know if it could be tweaked or not to fit better as I haven't had time to do so. You can't expect it to be perfect for $300.

I found that a bit of tweaking with some very large pliers will allow you to tweak it into the correct position. I also hose clamped 2 of the rubber hangers to pull the whole exhaust in the direction it needed to go in order to fit right.

[LDetter]

^Thanks for the info. I was afraid of trying to bend the hangers in fear of breaking the weld. When I have some free time I will give that a try.

[AudiSport12]

^ Mine is also a little crooked and the tips slope down a little, seems like they are all like that. Also the whole exhaust hangs down lower then the stock exhaust. I didn't have any problems getting the bolt in on the downpipe, beside mine was missing from the get go so I had to get a new one. The exhaust does sound great, does not drone, and is barley noticeable while cruising the highway. It is pretty audible at full throttle though. My only gripe is the fitment, which I am living with for now. I don't know if it could be tweaked or not to fit better as I haven't had time to do so. You can't expect it to be perfect for $300.

This is pretty accurate with mine. I have tried fanugaling the hangers to get it right but it still hangs down too low. And it rattles itself back of our alignment after a while. I will try hose clamps on the hangers. Thanks