am I nuts, 84 4000 quattro that mostly sat since 2004?

[onlyaudis]

always kept an eye out for another 4000 quattro since my 87 was totaled by a drunk driver parked in the front of the house over 10 years ago. need one like a hole in the head though, as I now have a bunch of cars including a tuned 2002 A4 1.8T. Why would I still be interested in a 4000 Quattro? Something about those cars left an impression on me. compared to modern cars, they are slow and have antiquated engine management, but they have a terrific mechanical feel to them and a classic boxy look I still am attracted to.

I found the cleanest one I have seen in 15 years, but it was not driven much (or at all -supposed to have been at least started from time to time) since 2004. Its basically a garaged 1 owner car, and the brother of the owner has spent some time getting it running again, changing fluids, water pump, radiator, etc. it did pass smog. everything is supposed to work except the gas gauge. the locking dif stuff seem to work, but the lights are night lighting up on the console--bulbs?

here is my question. what are the chances that after I start driving it, all those years of sitting will cause an endless amount of issues to surface? (see UR quattro thread below) I know it needs shocks which will be fun to change out, but am worried that after I start driving it, electrical gremlins will appear, brake hydraulic issues, coolant and oil leaks, fuel system problems, etc. car has 160,000 miles

has anyone brought back a long time dormant car successfully?

[Stubek]

Not sure what they are asking, but that thing looks in great condition. I think any Audi from that generation with 160k miles will have gremlins growing in it, but this one seems like it would be less likely and one of the best ones out there. If that was a quattro coupe, I would be all over it and my wife would be killing me.

[onlyaudis]

also , what is it worth?

[onlyaudis]

Not sure what they are asking, but that thing looks in great condition. I think any Audi from that generation with 160k miles will have gremlins growing in it, but this one seems like it would be less likely and one of the best ones out there. If that was a quattro coupe, I would be all over it and my wife would be killing me.

what are these things worth these days? wife will probably kill me if I bring it home as well. what is the old expression," it is easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission?"

[Stubek]

No idea really. They are so rare in the US especially in good condition, I would think they can go for very little if they are a complete restoration project or up to $30+

[onlyaudis]

The most i ever saw one sell for was a 30,000 original miles car on bring a trailer a year or two ago. went for $11,000 I think, but those crazy low miles cars often go for way more than a normal car, even a nice looking one.


going to go ahead and take a look at it now.

[onlyaudis]

went and looked at it today, and decided to bring it home. the body is really clean, and so is the interior. Speedo/odometer, sunroof, power windows, and power door locks all work. A/C works but should blow colder--will try to have it charged. brakes feel soft, and i know the guy flushed them out and bled them several times. have to figure out what is up with that asap. front end control arm bushings/steering parts are tight, and so is the rear suspension bushing.

shocks are completely shot. what's the best shock for the money with stock springs? Sach's? Bilstein heavy duty?

CV's look good, it shifts like a dream, and it pulls really hard. drove it for an hour at freeway speeds home from where I got it, and it seemed to love it. idles smooth, starts right up. It passed California smog easily the first try.

left tail light lens is cracked, fuel gauge isn't working. fuel pump seems noisy. tires are old. will have a few things to sort out I am sure, but I am very pleased with it already. took out the red Momo wheel and put a black one in I had here. looks much better.

[onlyaudis]

I have been busy doing an extensive brake overhaul on the car right now. My god were the inside of the rear calipers gross. no wonder the brakes were so bad- the rear hoses were nearly clogged at the fittings. 3 of 4 the bleeders were clogged, so there was no way they were bled correctly by the PO. It had a soft pedal when I bought it.

I thought since I was redoing everything, I'd spend a little time to make the old calipers, holders and backing plates show quality. lots of cleaning and bead blasting and detail painting. those old Girling calipers are nice looking pieces when they are cleaned up.

Decided to go silver on the wheels for a more classic look. after the old tires were removed, I bead blasted the wheels and machined down a few edge scratches with my sander. That is the Audi silver from my Wife's TT. went with a low gloss urethane clear for a softer luster, but still with proper protection from the elements / ease of cleaning. In person they look like brand new wheels.






Had to do some old fashion detective work, but I did locate a full set of Konis for the car. getting much harder to find things for 28 year old Audis, but I don't mind as long as I eventually get what I need. going to get some help from a friend who owns a shop on the install.

[Ruffiano]

Car is beautiful, well worth saving. glad to see you are going through the brakes, i'm guessing the suspension is also one of the items you have on your list, luckily you are in Cali and not on the east coast somewhere, these cars survive much better on the left coast.

[AudiCoupeGT]

If I'm not mistaken, this car must've had a brake swap some time in its past. I don't believe these cars came with rear discs till later models? Do you have any info on this?
Looks great! Motivates me to do this to my own car!

[Ruffiano]

2 wheel drive cars of this era had drum brakes, but the awd models have always had 4 disc.

[AudiCoupeGT]

ah thanks for clearing that up

[onlyaudis]

So the brakes are back together and look great, but I still have no pedal. looks like the master cylinder is bad as well. the PO told me it had been replaced "recently", but I bet it is has been years and the seals are gone in it from sitting. trying to hunt one down in the next few days.


Planning on getting Konis on the car. the control arms were done by the PO.

[onlyaudis]

Car is now a runner! Found more worn out parts in the front end when we were doing the struts (which are a pain on these cars by the way) new mater cylinder and proportioning valve fixed the brake hydraulic issues. ride is so nice with new front need parts and the Konis. need to align the car today still

The dif locks worked when the actuators were manually engaged from under the car, and the lights come on the console. seems like the system is not hood up to manifold vacuum though. i need to find out where exactly that system T's into. any photos/diagrams would be very helpful.

[Nollywood]

That is one immaculate type 85! I had a similar car, UK-spec '84 80 quattro, same colour too. Only differences externally were the obvious Euro bumpers and one-piece Cibie headlamps.

[AudiCoupeGT]

Looking great! Keep posting away and i'll keep following!

[onlyaudis]

The initial excitement has given way to reality now on this project, as the "things it needs" list just keeps getting longer and more involved. Dumped a ton of $$ on front end parts plus the Konis: control arms, ball joints, CV boots, tie rod ends. I think of myself as a fairly capable amateur mechanic, but did not want to try and tackle the front end on these cars by myself, so I rang up a nice full day shop California labor bill as well including a some misc. sorting out and the rear struts.


Needed to replace the brake master cylinder and proportioning valve, all 4 calipers needed rebuilding, new rotors, pads, and tires.

I just replaced the torn intake boot with a nice intact one, and now it is idling all over the place. everything is snugged up tight, so i can not understand what the hell is going on. Seems like everything I touch causes another problem right now. the brake reservoir cracked a fitting when I was trying to remove it to replace the M/C, and I have one of those on the way too-the 84 is unique and nearly impossibe to find.

Just replaced the broken drivers door mirror with a used one, and now I am not getting any power to either of the mirrors. left one worked before and I didn't even touch that one. the servo worked on the drivers side one before too, but the glass was loose. fuse isn't blown. Not getting power to the switch as far I can tell. maybe I bumped something in the door or under the dash while i was running the mirror wires.

I know I'll get through this phase of the mechanical sort out, but right now its a bit over whelming. think I will let the car sit for a few days and start fresh on it next week. right now I am not sure I wasn't nuts to buy it!

[AudiCoupeGT]

At times like these, it is best to just walk away and get your mind off of the car for a few days. Starting fresh always makes things better

[Vinchenzo51]

Well lets not split hairs here... you are definitely nuts for buying it.

Although, the reward generally outweighs the efforts. Keep up the awesome work

[onlyaudis]

Well lets not split hairs here... you are definitely nuts for buying it.

Although, the reward generally outweighs the efforts. Keep up the awesome work

the reason its crazy to pick up any upscale cars from this era (definitely including the first gen Quattros) is because of the complexity of the cars from that time compared with older classics. couple that with decades of at least some neglect and wrenching by mechanics with skill levels all over the place, and you have a recipe for a difficult (and potentially very expensive) sorting out process, especially if you are interested in a really tight and fully functional car like I am. I am also finding out some parts for the 84's are not the same as the 85-87, making them even harder to come by.

Have to just wait now for the brake reservoir to arrive so I can get the thing back on the road again, have another scheduled day with a master Audi tech familiar with the old CS injection cars next Tuesday to try and get a few more things done and hopefully get the nice idle back. really want the dif locks to work as well--way too nice of a car for that system to not be functioning. the vacuum line is hooked up, but something isn't right withe vacuum to that system.

[AudiCoupeGT]

I don't want to take away from these forums too much but if you haven't already checked it out, check out Quattroworld.com 4000/CGT forums for some really good resource info. The guys there are great and have a lot of experience and great info to pass on.

Once these cars are dialed in, the run like clockwork! Just to let you know, a lot of the parts do not cross between pre-85 cars and post 85. For parts, check out RockAuto.com for great deals on parts.

[onlyaudis]

I know about the 84 only parts--already dealing with that and the master Cylinder and its reservoir


I think i found out what was going on with the idle. the 2 complicated shaped breather hoses that attach to the idle control valve are totally shot, and someone had just black duct taped them together. When I was moving things around to get at the air cleaner, must have lost the weak seal. just ordered those upgraded parts in silicone from 034 Motorsports, and should have them in a day or so. got a new mirror switch coming in too (was only $19 and is a likely culprit)






http://www.034motorsport.com/engine-...r-p-18018.html


http://www.034motorsport.com/engine-...q-p-18019.html

[AudiCoupeGT]

A lot of the time, if you take out the switches out and just give them a good clean, they end up working again. Bought the same silicon reinforced vac fittings for my CGT. Good luck!

[onlyaudis]

A lot of the time, if you take out the switches out and just give them a good clean, they end up working again. Bought the same silicon reinforced vac fittings for my CGT. Good luck!

that is how I fixed my fuel gauge--took apart the sender and cleaned it, and it works great now. the mirror switch is cheap enough to just replace. If that don't fix it, have to see if i buggered wires that go to the mirror switch while I was feeding the new mirror harness through..

[onlyaudis]

current state of car, still waiting for a couple needed parts to drive it. should have the vacuum hoses from 034 and the M/C reservoir tomorrow.

Put some hub-centric spacers on the factory wheels with longer bolts. 10mm front and 20mm rear spacers. I like the stance better, especially in the rear where the wheels were just lost inside the wheel arch before.

[onlyaudis]

OH yeah, found some new old stock killer Cibie fog lights on fleabay. check these out, this is a great deal on the fantastic lights that are period correct.

clear fogs here

http://www.ebay.com/itm/320891261372...#ht_500wt_1202

I got these amber ones. love the black covers--goes with my color scheme.



I live in the SF Bay Area, and foglights are used often in real fog and not just for decoration..

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cibie-35-ser...#ht_500wt_1202

[Sin_city_Rings]

I love the look of this car, congrats on your project.

Interestingly enough your car's twin is on Autotrader right now, link below:

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...18208528&Log=0

[onlyaudis]

Installed the silicone hoses today, and the car still is idling very badly and cutting out at low speeds. all this started after I changed the air filter and put an intact intake boot on in place of a torn one. I must have disturbed something in the process. I don't really know how the CIS idle circuit works or how to trouble shoot it , and will probably have to have it towed to a shop. Frustrating that i can't drive the car now or figure out how to fix it by myself.

Is there a way to test that idle control valve?

[AudiCoupeGT]

The Idle Stabilizer Valve can get gunky sometimes inside which causes it to stick. Shoot some Carb Cleaner inside and move the valve around with a stick or something to get rid of some of the gunk. Clean it as well as you can inside (maybe use a ear bud or something) and then shoot the inside with some WD-40. Hook it back up to it's connection and actuate it electrically allowing it to buzz and lubricate itself.

Try this page for diagnosing. This site should be bookmarked as it is invaluable!
http://www.humanspeakers.com/audi/tuning-cise.htm

[onlyaudis]

Thanks for the tips. i got the car to my favorite VW/Audi shop today and am just going to let them sort out a few of the things with the car. then I will do some more fun things--like upgrade the lighting and speakers, and I also am going to custom mount a rear sway bar on the car. let you know what they end up finding.

[AudiCoupeGT]

Just out of curiosity, what kind of rear sway bar you going to put in? As far as I know, the only option for a rear sway bar is the one from Addco.

[onlyaudis]

I have a factory B6 A4 18mm rear bar that I took off my 02 A4, (I put on the 22mm RS4 bar) and it lines up really well on the 4000Q. I already mocked it up, and with some universal fit ends I have, its a pretty basic fabrication job to weld up some center brackets and attach the brackets that came with the end links to the strut housings. . It will be very similar to the 2bennett bar linked below in the way it fits, less the $500.00 cost. i will post some photos of it when i finish the job. My end links are almost exactly like the ones they have in their kit. came on an ST bar for an MR2, but I used the factory MR2 end links instead.

http://2bennett.com/2Bcoilprogram.html#swaybar

Actually, I think Addco bars are on for the FWD versions of the 4000 and the GT.

By the way, their were two problems with my car. fist, when I installed the air cleaner, an old wire had broke loose from its ground--it was the ecu ground wire!

Second, the car had been "tuned" with air leaks from some bad hoses and a crack in the inlet hose. after i fixed those leaks, the CO had to be reset. car runs awesome now, and idles like you can hardly tell its running. we bumped up the timing a few degrees as well, and I love the way the car pulls.

[onlyaudis]

Custom installed a rear sway bar today that I had taken off my 2002 a4 Quattro years ago. Lucky I had a set of adjustable end links from ST,(and they came with a mounting tab) as it would have been really hard to get it on there right without being able to vary the length of the end links. turned out great, no interference throughout the full suspension travel, barely changed the ride quality, but the car turns in way better now. was harder than I thought it would be, but I did get it done with almost all left over parts. took me a couple hours just to fabricate the center bracket. As the photo shows everything is nice and square, the end links are straight up and down. My first time doing a custom sway bar install, so i was pretty happy with the results.





got the Cibie fog lights on too. they are very bright, have a great pattern, and the mounts are strong as hell-- most other fogs i have tried have a lot of wiggle in the mounts even when tightened all the way down.

[AudiCoupeGT]

Looks great! Really diggin the fogs as well. Look right at home on the car

[onlyaudis]

just found out today as of 1/1/2012 California no longer allows recharging of the older cars A/C with 12A coolant. Can't buy it or have it shipped here, and no shop will risk fooling with it. I have to convert to R134a if I want the a/C to blow cold. I am going to convert it, because this car is nice enough to want all the stuff to work right on it. going to be about $150 more for the conversion than it would have been for just a service/leak test/ recharge with the older style coolant. this way, its an easy service in the future as well. edit:needed a new dryer and expansion valve as well. good news is I will have basically a brand new working A/C when done. bad news is the cost is killing me!



http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/de...d=viglink&cj=1

worked on the cooling system over the weekend. the thermostat was busted in pieces, and the coolant was ugly looking. flushed the system, installed a new silicone upper hose, and replaced the thermostat with a 80C one, and also changed the fan switch out for a lower temp one.The fill tank was disgusting, and was difficult to clean because it has some kind of internal baffle and screen. the temp needle now runs at or below the middle mark on the gauge, where before it was climbing up 2/3 of the way. changed the oil as well, so now I know when it was done and what is in there.

[teach]

Sheesh! What a super nice example to start with, and you are really doing things right- SO nice to see. The undercarriage and wheel wells are ridiculously clean. Congrats on a great project and a job well done.

[onlyaudis]

Sheesh! What a super nice example to start with, and you are really doing things right- SO nice to see. The undercarriage and wheel wells are ridiculously clean. Congrats on a great project and a job well done.

with cars from the 80's, (especially upscale ones) you need a really nice starting point if you want to make a super clean car, because cars from this era are put together in a way that makes a restoration extremely difficult compared to 1960's and early 70's classics. I am so excited about this car right now, and the way it drives is truly amazing. Audi got the gearing perfect for the torque curve of that engine, and the suspension upgrades I did have turned the car into a really comfortable, agile and responsive ride. Had a few newer audi owner friends drive the car, and they were taken with the precise steering feel and the obviously much lower curb weight and all that goes with that. The other thing that is cool is the 4000Q actually has more room in the back seat area than the B5, B6, and B7 A4's because of the boxy shape.

[Extreme90path]

Excellent work man! I wish I would have done an adjustable set up with my rear sway bar set up!

[Extreme90path]

just found out today as of 1/1/2012 California no longer allows recharging of the older cars A/C with 12A coolant..

You should look into 'Freeze 12" it's an excellent R12 substitute. I have had really good results with it. That is what we use at the shop I work at, atmospheric friendly and everything. :)

[onlyaudis]

So the the A/C is now fully working as of today. also found out why the A/C flapper valve and dif lock were not working--the PO hooked up the vacuum lines totally and completely wrong. I got some detailed photos from a friend that owns a 4000Q today, sorted out the vacuum stuff, and now everything works. A/C blows cold as hell-awesome!

I am still amazed what a difference that 18mm A4 bar made on the rear. i have driven a couple of 83 UR Quattros, and that is what this car feels like on the handling now.