Help! Clutch won't disengage... can't shift

[R8ted R]

So I was driving home from school and got a yellow light at the freeway exit so I rev matched and downshifted into 3rd (from 4th) so I don't have to stop. Shifted into 4th after crossing intersection then coasted. Later a sharp turn was ahead so I slowed down and rev matched and try to stick it into 3rd but it won't go. I heard a slight grinding sound (heard a similar sound before when I was being lazy and didn't clutch in all the way while trying to change gears) and so I tried to put it back into 4th, but it didn't want go in either. I coasted the car to the side of the road. Car doesn't go into any gear with engine on. Turned off engine and I can shift into all the gears.

Checked brake fluid and it was full. Did a clutch and brake flush about 2 months ago along with transmission flush. Master cylinder don't seem to be leaking so I don't think it's a hydraulics problem. I think it's more of a mechanical problem... broken pressure plate or cracked clutch from my brief research.

So here's what I did before calling tow truck. Since I was able to put it into gear with engine off, I put it into first and tried to turn car on. It hesitates to turn on because clutch is engaged and starter can't pull my car forward. I give it gas to turn on the car and it fires and I can slowly creep forward in first gear but I smell clutch burning right away so I shut it off and called for a tow.

Car is now back inside my garage. Anyone have any ideas? I'm thinking I'll have to pull the tranny and take a look at the clutch. If that's the case, anyone know of a DIY for the B7? Only found DIY's for B6's so far.

Thanks a lot for your help.

p/s-Clutch pedal does spring back after I press it down but it's really soft, feels like I'm not linked up to the clutch. Car has 65k miles.

[bman005]

Clutch is done or pressure plate took a dump. B6 DIY should be pretty damn close

[DRAKLORE]

Sounds like a clutch fork or slave issue.
I would suggest its time for a clutch upgrade while you've got the transmission down.
http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...st-impressions

[R8ted R]

Thanks for replies. I'm going to pick up a set of triple square sockets and then drop the tranny to take a look at the clutch. Will update and post pictures after I get the tranny out but it will be next weekend at the earliest.

[DRAKLORE]

If your confused on the procedure than check out the DIY on a4mods.com

check out the metal slave cylinder on vasts website. It's a big improvement over the plastic one.
I have a feeling you issue may lie in the clutch fork/slave, but it could be really simple or internal. Or even pressure plate issues.

[R8ted R]

If your confused on the procedure than check out the DIY on a4mods.com

check out the metal slave cylinder on vasts website. It's a big improvement over the plastic one.
I have a feeling you issue may lie in the clutch fork/slave, but it could be really simple or internal. Or even pressure plate issues.

I will be looking off the B6 clutch DIY from a4mods and audi geek. They both suggest getting a bentley manual. Do you guys think it's absolutely necessary? Can I download a pdf one anywhere?

Also, would a slave cylinder just go bad all of a sudden while driving? When car is on and I try to force it into a gear, car will slowly creep forward but I hear a mechanical grinding noise and what sounds like some actuators trying to push something. Therefore, I would think clutch or pressure plate is gone. I'm hoping it's as simple as a clutch slave though. Any easy way to check that without dropping the whole tranny?

[DRAKLORE]

The slave can be removed without dropping the trans.

The pedal is what's leaning me towards the slave, though you have some odd symptoms as well...

I dropped the trans without a guide, pretty much remove stuff till it can be slid out. I did have some trouble with the driveshaft but ultimately got it down while the car was on jack stands... Reall really tight squeeze lol




Here is the fork, im thinking for you it may have come off the yoke...

Keep
Us updated

Shane Drake

[CorneliusRox]

might want to upgrade the cylinders to the all metal ones whole you're at it.

[R8ted R]

So my triple square socket set finally came and I'm getting ready to drop the tranny tomorrow to see what broke. Been really busy with school lately since it's my final year but luckily spring break is coming up in 2 weeks and I think that's when I'll have time to put it back together.

Anyways, I have a few questions before I drop the tranny. I've read the DIY's for a B6 A4 tranny from a4 mods and audi geek and none of them mention having to drain the MTF, so I'm assuming it's contained in there and won't leak out when I drop the tranny right? It won't leak out the back after I remove the drive shaft either? I just replaced MTF and rear diff fluid with Motul Gear 300 less than 500 miles ago so I really don't want to spend another $100+ on new fluids.

Also, for my shifter, so I have to remove anything from up top inside the cabin of the car? Or do I just remove the linkages from the bottom?

This will be my first tranny drop so I'm quite nervous. I have replaced timing belt on B5 A4 before by myself, along with suspension, brakes, and other regular maintenance work on my car so I'm not a total noob. I have the tools and mechanical expertise but there's a first time for everyone.

Thanks for the replies so far. I'll take pics and post them after I drop the tranny.

Oh, one more thing... anyone know how heavy that tranny is just so I have an idea of how much help I'll need in case it falls off my jack.

[bman005]

I don't know of an exact weight but I know for a fact that 2 people are easily enough to manhandle it

[Ed Gein]

sorry OP but I cant believe i made it into DRAKLOREs sig!

on a side note I also cant beileve its not butter

[DRAKLORE]

You shouldnt lose any fluids. Unless yOu have a bad seal. The rear driveshaft doesn't slide into the trans via a yoke, but sits in a cup. Ball in a cup lol

You lOosen te linkages, nothing to do with the shifter. I had to make a special 8mm Allen socket to remove one I the linkages. But any short 8mm socket should do.
Be careful with your slave. I somehow snapped the one bolt that hold it in place :-/

And yes I see you are Quattro, if you see how much space I left myself (not much) my jack failed and I was left to bench the trans into place... I work out weekly but am a small dude. The trans is quite heavy lol I at one point almost called for help as I felt pretty helpless with it sitting on my chest trying to catch my breath.

Get a friend, a pal, or a proper jack
IMHO you should see the damage pretty fast if it isn't internal to the case.
Good luck.

[DRAKLORE]

Lol @ The killer in the room

[R8ted R]

sorry OP but I cant believe i made it into DRAKLOREs sig!

on a side note I also cant beileve its not butter

Lol @ The killer in the room

Am I missing something here? I'm not following you guys' inside jokes.

Draklore: Your pics gave me hope that I can tackle this job with my 3 ton jackstands + 2 ton jack (20" max lift height). I don't have access to a lift but I do have my own garage. After dropping the tranny, I can just leave it under the car on the floor as shown in your pic, correct? Because I don't think I'll have the clearance to do that.

[bman005]

Am I missing something here? I'm not following you guys' inside jokes.

Draklore: Your pics gave me hope that I can tackle this job with my 3 ton jackstands + 2 ton jack (20" max lift height). I don't have access to a lift but I do have my own garage. After dropping the tranny, I can just leave it under the car on the floor as shown in your pic, correct? Because I don't think I'll have the clearance to do that.

First read DRAK's signature and then https://www.google.com/search?source...0l75l423l6l6l0

Not really a mystery

[DRAKLORE]

Sorry Ed, had to remove your quote to make room for an example of my thought process :-/

[DRAKLORE]

If your doing it on jack stands, just make sure you have enough room to move comfortably. But also that your jack can reach the bottom of the trans, I threw a few straps that wrapped into the interior and then down around the trans like a belt as a fail safe.

[Ed Gein]

i noticed you switch up your sig often so i had a feeling it wouldnt last

[R8ted R]

Got the tranny out today. Looks like clutch is shot. See pics.





Here's a "bolt chart" I made to keep track of which bolt goes where.


Some notes about the tranny removal that is different for a B7 compared to the B6 DIY I used:
-I have an AWE Catback Exhaust that came with a downpipe and the pipe wouldn't come off unless I unbolted the cat, which I did. This actually gave me a lot of access to the top bolt and it wasn't as hard as the DIY claim it to be.

-Not counting the 2 starter bolts, there's only 9 bolts that bolt the tranny to the engine. The B6 DIY said there's 10 so I kept searching for a 10th one. I guess there's only 9 on the B7.

-There are 2 bolts and 1 nut that hold the shifter linkages to the car. The nut is accessed on driver side and the two bolts are on the passenger side. One is a 13mm bolt and the other is a hex. The hex bolt can only been seen and removed with the tranny dropped a little. B6 DIY only mentions 2 bolts.

-Electrical connectors: B6 has 2, B7 has 3. One on passenger side for speed sensor, 2 on driver side next to slave cylinder.

-I didn't remove flywheel yet since I didn't have a chain or anything to hold it in place while I wrench away. I will get a chain and remove it when I have time. Clutch install won't be for another 2 weeks when I have spring break and don't have to deal with midterms.

I think that's it for now. Did it with car on jackstands so space was an issue. Having universal joints and lots of extensions helped out a lot so I can relocate the ratchet to somewhere with easier access.


Here's what I need now:

After doing some research on LWFW vs stock, I think I'll resurface my stock FW and re-use it for two reasons. 1) I'm in my last year of college so money is tight. 2) I live in San Francisco so I do a lot of city driving. I don't want to have to keep my revs up all the time. I also don't want to deal with FW chatter that I keep hearing about.

As for clutch, pressure plate, and throwout bearing, I'll be getting a kit. Searching AZ, it seems most people recommend South Bend clutches and pressure plates or are happy with them. In terms of power, my car is at stage 1 right now but I'll be going stage 2 (HFC, not TP since I have CA emissions) in the next year or so. No future plans for BT so I think I'll be good with a stage 2 clutch. What do you guys think and recommend me to get.

[DRAKLORE]

I'm sure if you searched harder you will find a lot more people doing vast clutches with no reports of chatter like the SB clutches and really good reviews.
To
Top it off the vast clutches can be considerably cheaper, and are not puck style which creates a very OE feel.
To get my
Bias out of the way I will let this thread do the remainder of my talking...http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...st-impressions
There are quite a lot of members running all stages of the vast clutch.
Comes with pressure plate, and throw out bearing.

And that is one FUcked Clutch! Lol
Good luck

[DRAKLORE]

EDIT- I'm not saying All fx400 or SB or CM clutches chatter*

[Igmif]

My clutch did the same exact thing at about 68k miles. And I don't beat on my car what so ever. The DIY for B6 clutch repair worked great. That slave cylinder was a pain in the ass though. I didn't have my throwout bearing fork installed properly and the slave cylinder broke on my first press of the clutch. I ended up taking the trans out twice. That was an ugly job.

[bman005]

That's a Pretty nasty looking disc

[R8ted R]

My clutch did the same exact thing at about 68k miles. And I don't beat on my car what so ever. The DIY for B6 clutch repair worked great. That slave cylinder was a pain in the ass though. I didn't have my throwout bearing fork installed properly and the slave cylinder broke on my first press of the clutch. I ended up taking the trans out twice. That was an ugly job.

i'm still not quite sure how that slave cylinder mounts on there. Because of it's location.. I had a hard time taking it off. I took off the one bolt according to the DIY but it was wobbling in place. In the end, I figured I just pull on it and it came out the hole. Is that how it's suppose to be? So to install it, I just stick the rubber boot back in the hole and then install that one bolt?

Draklore, I did do research on the forums on Vast clutches. I love their attractive pricing (~$425 for Stg 2 clutch kit I think) but I read more negative than positive reviews about their clutches. I know there's lots of happy customers that run their clutches on this forum, but keep in mind that their line of clutches are fairly new, less than a year old according to VAST's own sale thread on this forum. Therefore, no problems should surface yet. But according to "Scotty@Advanced," Vast uses a pressed kevlar disc without a steel backing, which is inferior to clutches from other well known brands. See here: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...Anyone-buy-one

Also, there's a recent thread that said Vast is going up in smoke. They're not even an advertiser on AZ anymore. Check here: http://www.audizine.com/forum/showth...T!-A-must-read!

THEREFORE, I will stay away from Vast. Does anyone else have any good recommendation on a clutch + pressure plate kit other than the South Bend stage 2 that I'm looking at? Or if there's a cheap place to get that SB Stg 2 kit?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

[R8ted R]

Just order the South Bend Stage 2 Daily clutch + pressure plate kit from Brian @ Avalon Motorsports. Brian hooked me up with a great price so I'd definitely recommend them if you need parts. Anyways, hopefully clutch will be here by next weekend so I can put my car back together. Pics to follow after install.

[R8ted R]

Finally on spring break now so I installed new clutch + pressure plate and put everything back together yesterday. Went out for a test drive afterwards and everything was fine... until I got on the freeway. I noticed my tach needle jumping up and down and then CEL came on. While the tach needle was jumping, actual engine RPM stayed constant, it was just the needle. Got home, pulled the code and it's P0321 + P0322 - failing engine speed sensor. I turned off the car and now car won't start again. From what I've read, a bad engine speed sensor will cause the vehicle to not start.

When I was dropping the tranny to take out the broken clutch, I didn't know there was a plug on the passenger side as I was watching everything from drivers side. Found out when tranny was almost to the ground that there was a connector still attached, and the wiring for the connector was fully stretched. I couldn't even unplug it so I had to remove three torx screws to get the "thing" out and then unplug it. My question to you is this: that connector that connects to this "thing" bolted on by 3 torx screws on passenger side of a B7 tranny bell housing, is that the engine speed sensor? If so, Where does the other end of the connector connect to? I think I might have disconnected some wires and that's what causing the CEL.

Thanks for any input. Please help so I can drive my car again.

[mcpcartier]

I can't help you but cudos on the perseverence and the research you did.

[A4_Ti]

Took a peek at my Bentley manual, I think the "thing" your missed was the backup light switch, from the pictures it was held on by three torx screws, the engine speed sensor was held on by a bolt, and there was a speedometer sensor that looked like it was held on by two bolts.

Also nice work tackling this job, I changed the clutch in my sisters Audi 90 with my old man last summer and it was a royal pain in the ass just getting to the thing unbolted.

[R8ted R]

Took a peek at my Bentley manual, I think the "thing" your missed was the backup light switch, from the pictures it was held on by three torx screws, the engine speed sensor was held on by a bolt, and there was a speedometer sensor that looked like it was held on by two bolts.

Also nice work tackling this job, I changed the clutch in my sisters Audi 90 with my old man last summer and it was a royal pain in the ass just getting to the thing unbolted.

Yea changing the clutch was a royal pain. I initially didn't know what was wrong with tranny other than it not shifting so I had to drop tranny, found broken clutch, then order parts and wait for me to have time off from school. In all, it lasted about 3 weeks and now engine won't start due to engine speed sensor.

Since you said the "thing" held on by 3 torx is actually the backup light switch, then I know the stretched wire wasn't affected since the CEL was for engine speed sensor. I think when the clutch shredded to pieces, the clutch "powder/dust" might have clogged up the engine speed sensor and caused it to malfunction.

Can anyone tell me where the B7 engine speed sensor is located? Is it similar to a B6 where it's located right by the oil filter housing and held on by one bolt, and connected with a gray connector?

[CleverA4Name]

I will grab my bentley manual tomorrow morning and check for you if nobody responds first.

[R8ted R]

I will grab my bentley manual tomorrow morning and check for you if nobody responds first.

Thanks, I'll be waiting. Can you also provide me with a part number to the engine speed sensor while you're looking it up? Thanks.


And here's the pictures I promised earlier:


Bellhousing with throwout hearing removed. Notice all the bits of clutch on sides of the housing. I made sure to vacuum all that out and lubed the slave cylinder hole before installing tranny.


Stock DMFW resurfaced.


SouthBend Stage 2 Daily clutch + pressure plate kit:


Installed on engine:

[R8ted R]

So I found the engine speed sensor (held on by a 5mm hex bolt) right next to oil filter on driver side and took it out. Doesn't look too bad and not too much metal shavings on it. Nevertheless, I took it out and wiped it clean before putting it back and tried to start car again. Nothing.

I'm at a loss here guys. Someone please chime in and give me some hope. Pretty bummed out about this.

[mcpcartier]

I can't find a speed sensor in the manual I have. Is this what you're looking for?

http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B7_A4-...nsor/ES252391/

You may have to break down adn pick one up and see if it fixes your problem?

[R8ted R]

I can't find a speed sensor in the manual I have. Is this what you're looking for?

http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B7_A4-...nsor/ES252391/

You may have to break down adn pick one up and see if it fixes your problem?

No, that's for the CAMshaft... the one I'm asking about is for the CRANKshaft.

It should be this one:
http://www.germanautoparts.com/Audi/...ctrical/182/12

While taking out the engine speed sensor, I noticed a hole on the very end of the transmission bellhousing (close to where it connects to engine) with a screw hole right next to it. Is that where the engine speed sensor is located for other cars that use the same tranny housing? Like the S4? I don't think I took anything out of that hole when dropping the tranny or else I would remember to put it back.


This is why I'm hesitant to just go out and buy a new Engine speed sensor: I just replaced clutch and car threw this code. Leads me to think that changing the clutch did some damage to the wiring. If I hadn't changed my clutch and my car threw the P0322 engine speed sensor code out of nowhere, then I know it really failed and would just buy a new one. What do you guys think? Did I do some damage while replacing clutch or it might be coincidence that the sensor decided to crap out right now? Anyone know where that sensor ultimately connects to so I can check for continuity in the wires?

[mcpcartier]

I wish I could be of more help...your in uncharted terriotry for me. You're logic makes sense and I'd hate to drop $80 on a part just ot find out if it's good. If I were near you I'd let you take mine off and test it out but I'm several hundred miles south so not much I can do. Maybe reach out in the local section and see if there is anyone near by who might do the same.

[quickaudi07]

Nice I just had to get my clutch replaced as well, I went with Vast Stage2 + so far love it! I'm at 61K right now....

[A4_Ti]

ugh I'm out of my league here and can't help you out, don't know where the engine speed sensor ultimately connects to but try manually trace the wires back? I dunno, just bumping your post in hopes someone with more knowledge will chime in


Edit: found a good link from a4 mods, from a 1.8 but might give u an idea of where to look

http://www.a4mods.com/index.php?page...eedsensor.html

[R8ted R]

Thank A4_Ti for the link but I saw that already. I tried tracing the wiring but it goes into a big bundle and I think into the ECU so it's hard to trace without cutting open the shielding around the bundle. Went to Audi dealer today asking for wiring diagram but they couldn't find it.

I did more research and found that I can test my current speed sensor using a multimeter to see if it's still good, but the test is not really accurate. (Test can show a good sensor but it'll still be bad). I'm gonna go down and pull speed sensor to test after this post.

Anyone got access to electrical wiring diagrams for the B7 A4? I really need to know where that sensor ultimately connects to so I can test for continuity.

[A4_Ti]

So went through my bentley manual and could only find info on 1.8 and 3.0 engines, there was some info on testing the sensors so I'll snap some pics and PM them to you shortly. Plus found a wiring diagram but it means nothing to me, maybe it'll mean something to you

[R8ted R]

So went through my bentley manual and could only find info on 1.8 and 3.0 engines, there was some info on testing the sensors so I'll snap some pics and PM them to you shortly. Plus found a wiring diagram but it means nothing to me, maybe it'll mean something to you

Thanks for the pictures! From the wiring diagram pic, it looks like the Engine Speed Sensor (G28 in Pic) connects to pins 36, 51, and 52 of the 60 pin connector that goes to the ECM. I just hope the wiring is the same for a 2.0T.