Swapping brakes between a Touareg and an S4

[B6JoeS4]

So I got to thinking....my sister has a 2004 Touareg V6 which, as you guys know, has the 6 piston brembo brakes up front.

Here is what I know so far

Touareg Rotors:330mm x 32mm with a 5x130 bolt pattern
the OEM ones should work wit the S4 calipers even though they are 2mm thicker

S4 Rotors: 345mm x 30mm with a 5x112 bolt pattern
I plan on using the OEM rotors until I have funds for the 350MM JHM rotors. If anyone has a suggestion on some cheap 350x32mm rotors, please let me know. I remember reading somewhere that one of the Mercedes OEM rotors will work.

Calipers: Only issue here is getting the S4 calipers to mount up to the Touareg spindles. S4 calipers accept a 14mm bolt and the Touareg spindles accept a 16mm bolt. My current thought is to have a machine shop drill out the S4 calipers to accept the Touareg 16mm bolts

[CHECKERED]

Calipers: Only issue here is getting the S4 calipers to mount up to the Touareg spindles. S4 calipers accept a 14mm bolt and the Touareg spindles accept a 16mm bolt. My current thought is to have a machine shop drill out the S4 calipers to accept the Touareg 16mm bolts

I’m sure anything can be jury-rigged but why go to all this trouble when you can use cayenne or rs4 calipers?

I mean I can drop a crate LS3 in the S4 and it will make more power than any supercharger/nitrous system but so what?

[B6JoeS4]

I’m sure anything can be jury-rigged but why go to all this trouble when you can use cayenne or rs4 calipers?

I mean I can drop a crate LS3 in the S4 and it will make more power than any supercharger/nitrous system but so what?

I don't see you logic. What I am talking about is pretty much free. I know I can just get a couple calipers new from the dealership and get the JHM bolt adapter and be set but that you cost over 700

[CHECKERED]

When you say free, does that mean you are going to swipe your sisters brakes and put on your S4 brakes on hers?

[B6JoeS4]

When you say free, does that mean you are going to swipe your sisters brakes and put on your S4 brakes on hers?

yes. the S4 brakes will be sufficient for a Touareg. Every American 6000lb suv uses single piston up front

[seanj130]

What does your sister think about all of this? Are you going to send her to the spa for the day and not tell her?

Best regards,
Sean.

[B6JoeS4]

What does your sister think about all of this? Are you going to send her to the spa for the day and not tell her?

Best regards,
Sean.

She could care less lol.

[psiaddict85]

You my friend need calipers from a V8 Touareg or a Cayenne S or Cayenne Turbo. 18ZL/ZR to be exact. The V6 calipers will not work with stock 345mm or 350mm JHM rotors.

[walky_talky20]

Although I fully agree with this swap, there is a risk here. If *anything* happens later on concerning the brakes, or god-forbid, an accident where the brakes could be blamed, you will at best be the bad guy *forever*. Or at worst be liable. Normal people (i.e. cops) won't understand why her brother "tampered" with her brakes. It just looks bad.

It could go something like "The detective found the incorrect and inferior brake calipers installed on the vehicle. The mounting holes for the calipers were modified and enlarged, weakening the units. During a panic stop maneuver, the weakened mount points gave out, causing the accident and subsequent rollover event.

Not saying that is probable, or even possible. Just saying that by doing this swap you have to basically guarantee that those calipers will never fail for any reason. Swap related or not.

[CHECKERED]

She could care less lol.

She will when she tries to stop from 80mph in an emergency…The S4 brakes are already undersized for this application and putting them on a 6000lb SUV is just irresponsible

[dmaxben]

She will when she tries to stop from 80mph in an emergency…The S4 brakes are already undersized for this application and putting them on a 6000lb SUV is just irresponsible

345mm is undersized??? I find them perfectly sufficient, but then again I normally drive my 3/4 ton pickup truck so it doesnt take much to impress me as far as brakes/stopping distance.

Another issue I see with swapping brakes between the toureg and S4 is you have to remember that the ABS and stability control (ESP) module is calibrated specifically for certain piston surface area and volume calipers...if you put something different on you might risk it not applying enough brake to a certain wheel, or applying too much brake in a significant ESP or ABS "event".

ben

[B6JoeS4]

Yeah I totally understand what you mean. but 1mm of material on each side is hardly anything.

[B6JoeS4]

Another issue I see with swapping brakes between the toureg and S4 is you have to remember that the ABS and stability control (ESP) module is calibrated specifically for certain piston surface area and volume calipers...if you put something different on you might risk it not applying enough brake to a certain wheel, or applying too much brake in a significant ESP or ABS "event".

ben

forgot about the ABS/EBD/ESP system. I dont think that will be an issue when you think about people doing bbk upgrades all the time without ABS modifications

[B6JoeS4]

Ok so this won't work. been digging hard in the interwebs and found out that the calipers on the V6 and V8 Touaregs are NOT the same as the ones offered in the JHM kit. The Touareg V10 and the Porsche Cayenne S Calipers are the ones offered in the JHM kit.

The calipers from the V6/8 Touareg wont even work for a 345/350mm rotor.

For anyone interested in the info....here are the part numbers for the Porsche calipers
955-351-421-70, 955-351-422-70

[CHECKERED]

345mm is undersized??? I find them perfectly sufficient, but then again I normally drive my 3/4 ton pickup truck so it doesnt take much to impress me as far as brakes/stopping distance.

I normally drive a 2580lb altima with 4 piston calipers and 13” rotors.
Downhill on a canyon road racing a C6 corvette, altima brakes are spot on, Audi brakes fade after 3 minutes...had to get RS4 brakes…

[psiaddict85]

Ok so this won't work. been digging hard in the interwebs and found out that the calipers on the V6 and V8 Touaregs are NOT the same as the ones offered in the JHM kit. The Touareg V10 and the Porsche Cayenne S Calipers are the ones offered in the JHM kit.

The calipers from the V6/8 Touareg wont even work for a 345/350mm rotor.

For anyone interested in the info....here are the part numbers for the Porsche calipers
955-351-421-70, 955-351-422-70

V8 Touareg Calipers are the same as Cayenne S or Turbo just not painted. Same Brembo part number. They are very hard to find though.

[dparm]

Not surprised. Phaetons with bigger motors got bigger brakes too.

[B6JoeS4]

V8 Touareg Calipers are the same as Cayenne S or Turbo just not painted. Same Brembo part number. They are very hard to find though.

No the v6 and v6 share the same caliper. only the V10 models got the same brakes that the Cayenne S has. The v6/8 both have the 330mm rotors while the v10 has 350mm

[vinny.dtw]

I can't believe you would even THINK about doing this Joe...Come on. Just upgrade your pads, rotors and get better tires if you really want better stopping power. Anything else is just for the sake of bling, and that bling factor certainly isn't worth the risk of your own sisters life...

Just because the brakes fit, doesn't mean they will work... Theres a lot more to brakes, safety, and braking distance then just caliper size, rotor size and thickness...Glad you did the research and found out that it didn't work though.

[B6JoeS4]

Yeah I know and the more I think about it the more i realize its a bad idea. when the idea first came into my head, it was seemed to me as just a direct swap. My intent in doing this was actually to shed unsprung weight.

[dmaxben]

forgot about the ABS/EBD/ESP system. I dont think that will be an issue when you think about people doing bbk upgrades all the time without ABS modifications

I dont think BBK's really affect ABS that much, but in my opinion it could noticeably affect ESP performance (when an ESP event occurs and the driver is not on the brakes at all). The pre-charge motor and dump/isolation valves are programmed/expecting to fill a certain size piston and pre-charge the system to a specific pressure in order to brake a certain wheel just enough to put it into slip before releasing brake pressure...if the caliper bites harder with more or less force than the ABS/ESP module is expecting it might make it slightly less effective.

Even tire size can throw it off for obvious reasons. When I went from 245/75/16 (stock) to 285/70/17 tires and EBC pads/dimpled/slotted rotors on my truck the ABS was noticeably less effective until I reprogrammed (recoded if you will) the EBCM to the correct tire size. The EBD (GM calls it DRP, dynamic rear proportioning) on my truck was all sorts of whacked out as well and the rears would lockup way before the ABS would even intervene. In 2009 when they made ESP (stabilitrak) standard on the GM heavy-duty trucks, guys changing tire sizes and brakes started to notice odd things happening during stabilitrak "events"...thats probably just the difference in the way a car vs. truck ESP system works though.

Im not saying its going to make it so the car "wont stop" or will go totally out of control...im just saying that any time you change something significant in the caliper or master cylinder setup on a vehicle with ESP it can "theoretically" make it less effective....

[slingshot]

I have a Q7 front brake set for sale (6-piston calipers and rotors) :)