Intake Manifold

[shaggenwagon]

Hey guys i was talking to a buddy of mine about making a new intake manifold. he says he could do it but he wanted me to ask around and see if anyone else would be interested. Im located in Bradenton FL but if he desides to make more he can ship anywhere in the states.

Thanks

[eastwick897]

I'd be if it provided any gains compared to the stock one and if the car still ran properly.

[daveman]

The advantage being?

(Serious question as I have no idea about these things..)

[eskimopunk]

One thats not made out of plastic would be nice.

[eastwick897]

actually the plastic one dissipates heat pretty well. The advantage that an intake manifold may have is it has a larger plenum that flows more air.

[LERecords]

The advantage being?

(Serious question as I have no idea about these things..)

well.. depends on how much room you have to work with.. ill try to list as many as i can think of..

-different intake sound
-possible hp/tq gains (even as simple as less restrictive air flow which will help even out the flow to each cylinder)(gains would be very limited on a stock car, but could be higher on a more tuned car)
-more positions for sensors (for those few running non-oem ecu's)
-bigger throttle body (self explanitory)
-able to take more heat(depends if you wrap it or what type of metal you are using)
-able to take more BOOST!!! (prolly the only reason you would really need to get one is if you were running really high boost)


anyone else can chime in, but really the advantages are small except in the case of handling more boost, but thats limited to how it is fabricated and what its made out off.. good luck if you decides to design one..

[viperdsa]

I'd be if it provided any gains compared to the stock one and if the car still ran properly.

x2 and if it's not really expensive

[AudiTFSI3o3]

well.. depends on how much room you have to work with.. ill try to list as many as i can think of..

-different intake sound
-possible hp/tq gains (even as simple as less restrictive air flow which will help even out the flow to each cylinder)(gains would be very limited on a stock car, but could be higher on a more tuned car)
-more positions for sensors (for those few running non-oem ecu's)
-bigger throttle body (self explanitory)
-able to take more heat(depends if you wrap it or what type of metal you are using)
-able to take more BOOST!!! (prolly the only reason you would really need to get one is if you were running really high boost)


anyone else can chime in, but really the advantages are small except in the case of handling more boost, but thats limited to how it is fabricated and what its made out off.. good luck if you decides to design one..

this being said, i'd be down as well.

[TheHeggi]

Not to completely shit on this idea...but I see NO reason why we would need an aftermarket manifold produced...only a handful of these guys are running a Stg 3 or BT setup and they work perfectly fine with the stock piece. There are PLENTY of other things we need in the aftermarket before we will see the need for one of these...our air is compressed so we won't see very many benefits from a well designed manifold like a n/a motor would. We don't need to worry about port matching, extrude honing, or any of that shit, especially at our miniscule power levels. I really see no good cost/benefit from this at all...but we continue to buy cold air intakes for a car that has a perfectly adequate stock air box...so sure, make it, some dumb ass will buy one lol. But until you can show any hard data that the stock manifold is inadequate in any areas and convince me that we will see true gains from a better designed piece, I'll hold on to my cash. For the price this will probably sell for, I'm betting you can pick up at least a full cat-back that just MAY do something...

[ed-rod]

Forced induction means not nearly as critcal for flow. Force the air through anything.

[shaggenwagon]

thank you for all the input on this subject. me and my buddy are just in the first stage's of the design so we wont be seeing any numbers for about a month or two.

As we work on it more i will keep the updates.

Thanks

[Arin@APR]

We made 620whp on the stock manifold. :-p

[TheHeggi]

We made 620whp on the stock manifold. :-p

LOL case in point

[Jmaak]

thank you for all the input on this subject. me and my buddy are just in the first stage's of the design so we wont be seeing any numbers for about a month or two.

As we work on it more i will keep the updates.

Thanks

100:1 odds this never amounts to anything tangible. Mean, but true.

[dougyfresh]

Aluminum FSI intake manifolds are in concept maturity right now. There is one guy to talk to about this (Issam).

[Quattro]

sure why not

[JRMSLINEA4]

We made 620whp on the stock manifold. :-p

Enough said.

[audidrver]

We made 620whp on the stock manifold. :-p

Then what happened?

[Arin@APR]

Then what happened?

The car ran the quarter mile and not only put down the quickest 2.0T FSI time, but also the fastest....

After that the car was torn down, converted to E85 and a preproduction 2.0T FSI metal manifold was installed along with supplemental port injection. (Yes, the pre production 2.0T's had metal manifolds, not plastic). :-p

[B7!]

The car ran the quarter mile and not only put down the quickest 2.0T FSI time, but also the fastest....

After that the car was torn down, converted to E85 and a preproduction 2.0T FSI metal manifold was installed along with supplemental port injection. (Yes, the pre production 2.0T's had metal manifolds, not plastic). :-p

was it a B7 though?

[viperdsa]

was it a B7 though?

I have a feeling since it was putting down 620whp it was prolly a gti or A3. Something fwd

[Mordaine]

I have a feeling since it was putting down 620whp it was prolly a gti or A3. Something fwd

gti

[LERecords]

Forced induction means not nearly as critcal for flow. Force the air through anything.

not even close. Even with forced induction, flow has to be smoth. remember, the more you rough up flow, the more heat generated, more restriction there will be which will lead to loos of hp/tq. The pressure of the air being forced into the motor should flow smooth to generate good even power.

[Subaru71]

doesn't the stock one have some kinda flappers? If the ecu is designed to work with that.. a metal one without them would cause all sorts of problems..

[slimmj0k3r]

^^ removing the stock flappers adds HP.

Where's issam?!

[Mastercraftness]

SEM makes a great manifold for the 1.8T and he's modified one for the 2.0T GTI already. I am sure if there is enough interest he might make some for the B7 A4

Here is a link to the product.
http://www.semmotorsports.com
http://s117932057.onlinehome.us/gallery/album08

8T SEM Motorsports Intake Manifold

We're excited to introduce a new 1.8T Motorsports Intake Manifold. Designed & Engineered through SEM Motorsports . We expertly executed an intake that will outperform all others.

The SEM Motorsport Intake Manifold retails for $825USD and is ready to ship.
SEM Motorsports Intake Features:

- Constructed from A365-T6 Aluminum & Heat Treated
- 3/16" Uniform Thick Wall construction to facilitate Strength, Rigidity and Reliability.
- Plenum features 2.75L of internal volume for increased flow capacity to supply enough volume for higher rev limits.
- Tapered Plenum Design to supply equal flow distribution and to improve transient boost response.
- Shallow profile design to maintain lower CG (Center of Gravity); Will accommodate various 1.8T swaps.
- Integrated V-Stacks to induce optimum flow velocity throughout the rev range.
- Large ID & Calculated Runner Length to support higher peak HP.
- Fuel Injector Bungs are designed and located to facilitate optimal port runner flow & optimal fuel atomization.
- Cast as Small Port but Designed to Accommodate Standard AEB Port , AEB Gasket Matched and enough material for a 4mm overbore for your Extreme Port Sized setups.
- Standard Stock TB & 80mm TB Sized Flange openings available. (Custom options available upon request).
- Bracket Mount Bosses for under-intake bracket assembly.
- Vacuum Port Bosses and IAT Boss are all located beneath the manifold for a more clean aesthetic look.
- Underside Vacuum Port drilled and tapped for supplied NPT Fittings.


The manifold will only be available in Driver Side TB Configuration

The difference in gains were 35whp @ 15 psi on a stock small port head. You can deduce from the dyno's that it performs well even at relatively low to moderate boost levels. The intake performed as it was engineered to do.
TT 225 Stock TB vs SEM Small Port - 80mm TB
Dyno Tested with worst case scenerio:
Coolant temps were 105°C-110°C, IAT's were 60°C-70°C
@12-14psi STOCK SEM
HP 215.97 254.71
Torque (ft/lbs) 213.97 215.97
Download Dyno Graph

@15psi STOCK SEM
HP 237.32 272.48
Torque (ft/lbs) 207.84 227.02
Download Dyno Graph

@19psi STOCK SEM
HP 270.20 300.65
Torque (ft/lbs) 236.04 255.36
Download Dyno Graph

[Keith@APR]

Not to completely shit on this idea...but I see NO reason why we would need an aftermarket manifold produced...only a handful of these guys are running a Stg 3 or BT setup and they work perfectly fine with the stock piece. There are PLENTY of other things we need in the aftermarket before we will see the need for one of these...our air is compressed so we won't see very many benefits from a well designed manifold like a n/a motor would. We don't need to worry about port matching, extrude honing, or any of that shit, especially at our miniscule power levels. I really see no good cost/benefit from this at all...but we continue to buy cold air intakes for a car that has a perfectly adequate stock air box...so sure, make it, some dumb ass will buy one lol. But until you can show any hard data that the stock manifold is inadequate in any areas and convince me that we will see true gains from a better designed piece, I'll hold on to my cash. For the price this will probably sell for, I'm betting you can pick up at least a full cat-back that just MAY do something...

I think testing should be done at the throttle body.

I think that the second point of restriction will be there.

I know the first point of restriction is the head and that opening up the ports will give nice gains with the OEM manifold.

An upgraded intake manifold may make some power though and they are cool lookin'.

[dougyfresh]

SEM makes a great manifold for the 1.8T and he's modified one for the 2.0T GTI already. I am sure if there is enough interest he might make some for the B7 A4

Here is a link to the product.
http://www.semmotorsports.com
http://s117932057.onlinehome.us/gallery/album08

Please show me a picture of a modified SEM for the FSI motor. Your have a few words about it but 90% of your post is just 1.8T stuff. I see no pictures in your links to a Frankenstein SEM manifold on a FSI motor.

I think testing should be done at the throttle body.

I think that the second point of restriction will be there.

I know the first point of restriction is the head and that opening up the ports will give nice gains with the OEM manifold.

An upgraded intake manifold may make some power though and they are cool lookin'.

agreed.

The benefits of a big plenum intake manifold are really seen when you have matched the entire intake tract all the way into the head. That is why we go to a larger throttle body with a bigger plenum manifold on the 1.8T motor. If I kept my stock 58mm throttle body but put a huge plenum manifold on my car I would not see much gain since there is a huge restriction at the 58mm throttle body. Therefore, I went with a 75mm throttle body and matched the cold side intercooler piping to the throttle body. Benefits are there.

[Keith@APR]

doesn't the stock one have some kinda flappers? If the ecu is designed to work with that.. a metal one without them would cause all sorts of problems..

Can easily be removed in the ecu.

[Keith@APR]

was it a B7 though?

No, it was USP Motorsport's GTi.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4093369

Further development resulted in this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C8PbF7XMYU

The 2 engines, 2.0T FSI transverse as found in the GTi and longitudinal as found in your A4 are extremely similar. Development accomplished on the transverse directly applies to the longitudinal with some slight differences.

There are a few critical differences that are important regarding the longitudinal but they are easily handled with a slightly different approach than on the transverse.

[Mordaine]

No, it was USP Motorsport's GTi.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4093369

Further development resulted in this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9C8PbF7XMYU

The 2 engines, 2.0T FSI transverse as found in the GTi and longitudinal as found in your A4 are extremely similar. Development accomplished on the transverse directly applies to the longitudinal with some slight differences.

There are a few critical differences that are important regarding the longitudinal but they are easily handled with a slightly different approach than on the transverse.

is this why there are GTI's running BT and big numbers where as to our engines we are having a problems with the low pressure side?

[Arin@APR]

We did not run into any low side issues software couldn't correct on our stage III kit (Trans or Long). :)

The 600+ GTI needed a low side solution.

[Keith@APR]

We did not run into any low side issues software couldn't correct on our stage III kit (Trans or Long). :)

The 600+ GTI needed a low side solution.

and I think most people are waiting for a kit they can drop right in as opposed to resolving the issue in a "custom" way for the B7.

[shaggenwagon]

heres a picture of what we are wanting to do for our final product. but this one is not ours.

[eskimopunk]

That sweet... I spy a sexy weld

[Wizard-of-OD]

^^ removing the stock flappers adds HP.

Where's issam?!

Lurking

[dougyfresh]

Lurking

hahaha

[Don R]

Please show me a picture of a modified SEM for the FSI motor. Your have a few words about it but 90% of your post is just 1.8T stuff. I see no pictures in your links to a Frankenstein SEM manifold on a FSI motor.










agreed.

The benefits of a big plenum intake manifold are really seen when you have matched the entire intake tract all the way into the head. That is why we go to a larger throttle body with a bigger plenum manifold on the 1.8T motor. If I kept my stock 58mm throttle body but put a huge plenum manifold on my car I would not see much gain since there is a huge restriction at the 58mm throttle body. Therefore, I went with a 75mm throttle body and matched the cold side intercooler piping to the throttle body. Benefits are there.

Transverse FSI
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4555822

Working on the Longi type.