View Full Version : Summer Perf tires in Snow?
I have the 19" wheels with the Summer Perf Tires. Has anyone ever tried these in the Snow? I'm curious as to how they hold up.
The only time i'll see snow is about a dozen times a year when i head up to Lake Tahoe so i don't really want to invest in A/S or Snow Wheel/Tire setup if i don't have to.
Thanks!
NWS4Guy
11-02-2009, 09:44 PM
I have the 19" wheels with the Summer Perf Tires. Has anyone ever tried these in the Snow? I'm curious as to how they hold up.
The only time i'll see snow is about a dozen times a year when i head up to Lake Tahoe so i don't really want to invest in A/S or Snow Wheel/Tire setup if i don't have to.
Thanks!
They'll look great on the car when you are in the ditch.
Seriously, snow and M+S rated tires are not a gimmick, they work, and summer is for summer and will not fo well at all in the snow.
They'll look great on the car when you are in the ditch.
Seriously, snow and M+S rated tires are not a gimmick, they work, and summer is for summer and will not fo well at all in the snow.
I do realize they're not a gimmick. I had M+S 33's on my old Chevy Tahoe and they chewed through the snow. I have A/S on my '04 Denali (AWD) and have never had a problem in the snow. Just was wondering if anyone had real world experience with the Summer Perfs in the snow.
NWS4Guy
11-02-2009, 09:57 PM
I do realize they're not a gimmick. I had M+S 33's on my old Chevy Tahoe and they chewed through the snow. I have A/S on my '04 Denali (AWD) and have never had a problem in the snow. Just was wondering if anyone had real world experience with the Summer Perfs in the snow.
I'd say that if you get snow every blue moon and had to drive very occasionally, short distances, nothing steep it would be passable. Going skiiing up to a pass, I would really not reccomend it unless you want to put on some cable chains.
Ynnekdude
11-02-2009, 10:01 PM
I'd say it's worth the hassle to get some snow tires...Saving a little time & money isn't worth possibly wrecking a $50,000+ car. I have 19"s with PZeros right now...when they get cold they're like rocks. I can't imagine using them in the snow.
UGwagen
11-02-2009, 10:02 PM
my friend had summer tires on his STI and tried driving through plowed snow. It was downright scary.
Snow tires costs less than a crashed car.
Go rent a car for your trips to Tahoe
NeedingAnAudi
11-02-2009, 10:04 PM
Yea my dad bought his corvette from Florida so it had summer onlys. The side wall actually stated DO NOT DRIVE IN SNOW but he rocked em anyways through 2 Chicago winters, and the vette is just as shiny and unwrecked as ever. It's not the brightest idea but it is doable. I don't recommend it though
I'd say that if you get snow every blue moon and had to drive very occasionally, short distances, nothing steep it would be passable. Going skiiing up to a pass, I would really not reccomend it unless you want to put on some cable chains.
Yea ... think I have to bite the bullet and just get some Winter tires. The thought of having to swap tires between seasons bothers me for some reason. It's not the cost ... not quite sure what it is :)
Any thoughts on A/S or snow tires on the 19's?
Thanks for the feedback.
my friend had summer tires on his STI and tried driving through plowed snow. It was downright scary.
Snow tires costs less than a crashed car.
Go rent a car for your trips to Tahoe
Well push comes to shove I have a Yukon Denali i can take to the snow. Just wanted to play in the S4 this year :)
Sharkfin
11-02-2009, 10:11 PM
It depends on whether or not you get snow, but if you regularly have temps below 45 degrees then you need all seasons. If you have low temps and snow/ice/rain, then you need winters.
zillmc
11-02-2009, 11:03 PM
... The thought of having to swap tires between seasons bothers me for some reason...
Hah, spoken like a true Californian, Tahoe making our lives difficult!
It depends on whether or not you get snow, but if you regularly have temps below 45 degrees then you need all seasons. If you have low temps and snow/ice/rain, then you need winters.
Most people don't get snow in California, at least not like the snow/weather other places endure. A lot of families have the luxury of being only a few hours away from pretty good snow that lasts a few months out of the year in places like Tahoe. Typically its a few days to a week to do some skiing and then back home to where its 65degress+ most of the time. Here in the bay area even on the cold winter nights doesn't go below 35 and rains only a few weeks a year (though when it does rain we get dumped on hard for days-week at a time). This is what makes it hard to bite the bullet and pay for winters that could only see the snow for 10days/year. So in c52k's position, he's probably better off with the Denali as the winters are not practical for 90% of the year.
Tifosi
11-03-2009, 06:04 AM
Summer tires on snow = hocky puck. That's what the tire compound does when the temperture drops.
Dedicated snow tires or quality A/S tires are a must during winter conditions.
NWS4Guy
11-03-2009, 06:12 AM
I'd recommend you get some cheap 18's and put snows on these. Tires are made to live on the rim, not have the bead stretched over and over again going off the same rims. The cost difference between good snows for cheap 18's and 19's will almost pay for the rims - 19" snows at good bit pricier than 18's. Also you want narrower treads in snow, not spreading out the contact patch, which using a different rim by going to 18's will also help with.
audibird
11-03-2009, 12:02 PM
Edmunds Inside Line just did a test of Summers versus A/S versus Winter tires. http://www.insideline.com/features/tire-test-all-season-vs-snow-vs-summer.html
Basically, Summer is no good in the colder temps. I have a set of winter wheels and tires that I had for Chicago for my A4, but I didn't have them on very long last year since the Bay Area weather really doesn't require them. Don't know what I'm going to do yet this year, though...
There are also some really thin cable chains you can get, though not necessarily recommended as a fix.
KNaudi
11-03-2009, 12:21 PM
Summer tires on snow = hocky puck. That's what the tire compound does when the temperture drops.
Dedicated snow tires or quality A/S tires are a must during winter conditions.
^^^^^ this
S4-Tommy
11-03-2009, 12:24 PM
^^^^^ this
100% acceptance!
Today we got the first snow here in Vienna.
ChrisC
11-03-2009, 02:43 PM
No snow tires = "Say you're prayers, rabbit".
sworksone
11-03-2009, 06:25 PM
High performance tires in snow is a definite no-no. Sorry but that's crazy.
whartung
11-03-2009, 06:27 PM
Last year I didnt change out my summers for my winters in time for the first snow, and my car wouldn't even come to a stop. Full abs and i'd just slowly sail past driveways and turns at 10mph, unable to do anything.
02A4TURBO
11-03-2009, 08:20 PM
death wish?
riegeraudi
11-03-2009, 08:48 PM
I think also the cold wrecks the summer tires. Once the summer tire compound gets cold repeatedly they will no longer go back to being as soft as they are suppose to be and you will then even loose some of the summer tire traction in the summer. It's not like you will slip around in the summertime but when you push hard on a corner it won't grip like it use to.
BoostLover99
11-03-2009, 10:40 PM
Echoing others' sentiments here regarding NOT using summer tires in the snow. It's completely unsafe.
Vegas gets snow about once a year and it doesn't stick for more than a week. That being said, going out on my summer perf tires (Bridgestone Potenza RE-01R) was nightmarish.
Think about 30 mph to 0 stops that take over 100 ft, invoking ABS at 10% brake force application. You slide *right* through stop signs, red lights, etc. Seriously - if not for your safety then for the safety of the others on the road: get the right tires for the conditions.
The alternative might be that you accidentally kill a family of 4 and live with that on your conscience for the rest of your life. You could also then be charged with 4 counts of vehicular manslaughter . . . do you like men much? There will be plenty of them to help you pick up your soap while you think over your decision to run summer tires in the snow. ;)
HobbesA5
11-04-2009, 05:47 AM
Wow, that's the first time I've seen the threat of anal rape used to dissuade somebody from running summer tires in the winter. [>_<]
KNaudi
11-04-2009, 05:57 AM
I think also the cold wrecks the summer tires. Once the summer tire compound gets cold repeatedly they will no longer go back to being as soft as they are suppose to be and you will then even loose some of the summer tire traction in the summer. It's not like you will slip around in the summertime but when you push hard on a corner it won't grip like it use to.
really? evidence to support this? I've never heard it before but, to be honest, it could be the truth for all I know.
trigoe
11-04-2009, 06:45 AM
Wow, that's the first time I've seen the threat of anal rape used to dissuade somebody from running summer tires in the winter. [>_<]
LOL!!![o_o]
thebishman
11-04-2009, 07:24 AM
Can someone recommend a 19" wheel and tyre 'performance' winter tyre set-up for the B8 S4?
I really don't want to spend much more than $200 for each wheel, but do want to get a 'high performance' winter tyre like the Pirelli 270 Sottozeros. We don't get much snow here, maybe up to 4"-6" a couple of times per year and it doesn't last long, hence a 19" package works well for my location.
TIA,
Bish
UGwagen
11-04-2009, 08:10 AM
Can someone recommend a 19" wheel and tyre 'performance' winter tyre set-up for the B8 S4?
I really don't want to spend much more than $200 for each wheel, but do want to get a 'high performance' winter tyre like the Pirelli 270 Sottozeros. We don't get much snow here, maybe up to 4"-6" a couple of times per year and it doesn't last long, hence a 19" package works well for my location.
TIA,
Bish
www.tirerack.com
use it. you'll find closeout wheels for less than $100 each
1_clean_Audi
11-04-2009, 08:15 AM
www.tirerack.com
use it. you'll find closeout wheels for less than $100 each
also try tire.com and ebay for winter wheels just find some beat up wheels or something for real cheap and your set.
thats what im doing now serching for a winter set up since my s-lines wont do the trick in snow and trust me summer tires are a scary thing in the winter ask me how i know [o_o]
riegeraudi
11-04-2009, 08:51 AM
really? evidence to support this? I've never heard it before but, to be honest, it could be the truth for all I know.
When you buy new winter tires notice that the tire is soft, after about 5years of use the tread steadily becomes hard. That is the reason after about 5 years of winter tire use you will notice that the tire is not as grippy even though the tread is still great. This happens to me all the time because I only put about 5000km on my winter tires and after 5-7 seasons I throw them away even though they have tons of tread on it. The new tire is noticeably softer. The same applies for summer tires if you use it in the winter but the life is much more reduced because they weren't made for the winter and loose the softness much faster. Don't have documented proof but was told to me by a toyo rep and also noticed it through my winter tires.
KNaudi
11-04-2009, 08:57 AM
When you buy new winter tires notice that the tire is soft, after about 5years of use the tread steadily becomes hard. That is the reason after about 5 years of winter tire use you will notice that the tire is not as grippy even though the tread is still great. This happens to me all the time because I only put about 5000km on my winter tires and after 5-7 seasons I throw them away even though they have tons of tread on it. The new tire is noticeably softer. The same applies for summer tires if you use it in the winter but the life is much more reduced because they weren't made for the winter and loose the softness much faster. Don't have documented proof but was told to me by a toyo rep and also noticed it through my winter tires.
thanks for the info but I'm not sold. The guy from Toyo probably wanted to sell you more tires. I've never noticed that and I've run summers through cold temps before. I'll keep it in mind though.
thebishman
11-04-2009, 10:32 AM
www.tirerack.com
use it. you'll find closeout wheels for less than $100 each
Thanks. I've used Luke at the 'Rack before and will give him a call.
Any thoughts on the Dunlop SP Winter Sport tyres? Anyone have experience with them? They are substantially cheaper than the Pirelli 270 Sottozeros.
Bish
UGwagen
11-04-2009, 12:56 PM
Thanks. I've used Luke at the 'Rack before and will give him a call.
Any thoughts on the Dunlop SP Winter Sport tyres? Anyone have experience with them? They are substantially cheaper than the Pirelli 270 Sottozeros.
Bish
I know a lot of people that use them and are happy with them (evos & STIs)...
thebishman
11-04-2009, 03:59 PM
I know a lot of people that use them and are happy with them (evos & STIs)...
Thanks. I'm about to order them.
Bish
Phantom S5
11-04-2009, 04:09 PM
Before I got my S4, I had an A4.. I had summer performance tires on my 19" black wheels and went down a slight hill, not even steep at about 15-20 mph, when I went to brake the car had no chance and I ended up hitting a small wall.. fail. Also, the car would glide around on snow covered roads. I have to get some snow tires on my car soon.
Sin_city_Rings
11-04-2009, 05:06 PM
Echoing others' sentiments here regarding NOT using summer tires in the snow. It's completely unsafe.
Vegas gets snow about once a year and it doesn't stick for more than a week. That being said, going out on my summer perf tires (Bridgestone Potenza RE-01R) was nightmarish.
Think about 30 mph to 0 stops that take over 100 ft, invoking ABS at 10% brake force application. You slide *right* through stop signs, red lights, etc. Seriously - if not for your safety then for the safety of the others on the road: get the right tires for the conditions.
The alternative might be that you accidentally kill a family of 4 and live with that on your conscience for the rest of your life. You could also then be charged with 4 counts of vehicular manslaughter . . . do you like men much? There will be plenty of them to help you pick up your soap while you think over your decision to run summer tires in the snow. ;)
Yeah i live in Vegas as well and i plan on going to Brian head Utah once this year.... is it really going to be THAT bad.... pay 2000 for winters & wheels to go once or even twice....hmmmmm....
BTW the soap comment............[eek]
adam.smith
11-04-2009, 06:18 PM
If the cost is really such an issue, why not use someone's earlier idea of renting something for the times when you need it?
Living in Canada I can attest to the need for snow tires. A few weeks ago we had the first snowfall of the year and a guy with a BMW 330 that clearly had summer tires on it couldn't get going from a stop on the tiniest of inclines that's down the street from where I live. I don't know that I would go so far as to invoke the possible prison rape that you might undergo, but I would certainly be wary of wrecking my shiny new car.
BoostLover99
11-05-2009, 12:19 AM
Yeah i live in Vegas as well and i plan on going to Brian head Utah once this year.... is it really going to be THAT bad.... pay 2000 for winters & wheels to go once or even twice....hmmmmm....
BTW the soap comment............[eek]
The soap comment is hyperbolic - it's a worst case scenario thing. But do you really want to go to trial for vehicular manslaughter? Incidentally, you might be in county during the trial and we know what happens to new fish in county, don't we? [=(]
$2K is a lot of dough these days, no question. It's just cheaper than an accident, especially if someone dies in that accident. As soon as you have death in a car accident, the probability of charges being pressed increase a lot.
Alternatively, maybe the accident will just maim someone. What if you lose the ability to feel any sensation in your left foot after the accident?
I'm intentionally being dramatic because this kind of stuff happens. If you have to go in the snow only once or twice, rent a car with snow tires. It's a bit like drinking and driving - we all know better but someone always takes their chances.
Maybe nothing happens to you, maybe something laughable happens to you, maybe something bad happens to you. It's just not fair to the other people in your car or the other people on the road.
Please consider renting or getting the right tires. [hail]
arsiegel
11-05-2009, 02:40 PM
Curious to hear what c52k decided here. I'm in the same boat, live in SF Bay Area and want to take my s4 avant to tahoe multiple times this year and every year. Last year didn't get my act in gear in time and ended up with chains on pilot sport ps2s. Not fun. Chain patrol usually requires snow tires (snowflake) as opposed to A/S (m+s) even on AWD. c52k, if you figure out a good compromise i'd love to hear it. I recently posed this question to Doc at tirerack (from the wheels/tires forum) and will let you know what he says.
NWS4Guy
11-05-2009, 02:58 PM
Curious to hear what c52k decided here. I'm in the same boat, live in SF Bay Area and want to take my s4 avant to tahoe multiple times this year and every year. Last year didn't get my act in gear in time and ended up with chains on pilot sport ps2s. Not fun. Chain patrol usually requires snow tires (snowflake) as opposed to A/S (m+s) even on AWD. c52k, if you figure out a good compromise i'd love to hear it. I recently posed this question to Doc at tirerack (from the wheels/tires forum) and will let you know what he says.
Wow that is odd to hear. In Washington state which being farther north has some roads which close 6 months out of the year due to the volumes of snow we get, any vehicle with M+S or better tire ratings and AWD (even a car) is not required to use chains even when the pass conditions say chains required.
arsiegel
11-05-2009, 03:18 PM
Depends on when/where you are in Tahoe. Most of the time you're fine with M+S, but if you're going to Kirkwood or some places that are a little more exposed the roads can be worse. If you stick to I-50 or I-80 and the places right off the major highways you're ok without snows. Also, remember these are California drivers, so the more they can do to limit the guys who think they're better drivers than they are, the better. I grew up in Seattle and there is a stark difference, especially in adverse conditions.
Turbavanttro
11-05-2009, 04:06 PM
i drove my then new B6 quattro ultrasport from san diego, where i bought it, through colorado, skiing in the rockies, then through a blizzard in the midwest on my way home to pennsylvania, all this in summer performance tires. the car handled decent in the middle of the blizzard, but i had to work at it.
for me, if i plan to drive in snow even twice or three times a year, i buy good snows. its a no brainer. renting a car for a 4-day trip will end up costing about 25% of the price for snow or all-seasons. you never know what winter will bring, why throw the dice unless you really would rather file an insurance claim and get another car.
Turbavanttro
11-05-2009, 04:08 PM
for what its worth, my vredestein wintrac extremes handle amazing in all seasons. (of course, until i put on the sessantas for summer).
arsiegel
11-05-2009, 04:12 PM
For me, the question is not about spending the money on snows, it's how they'll do the 99.5% of the winter when I'm driving in the Bay Area and it's 60 degrees and dry. I'll have to decide between buying snows and mounting them and then re-mounting the summers after ski season or getting dedicated wheels for the snows and changing those out as needed.
Nvius
11-05-2009, 04:19 PM
If you're from the Bay, just getting chains is probably the most sensible/economic option. They are an immense PITA, but I have seen system that does not use chains. I forget what it's called, but you bolt it onto your hub and it sits on the outside of your tire.
Nvius
11-05-2009, 04:26 PM
In trying to search for what I was talking about I ran into this...
http://www.snobootz.com/
Anyone tried these before?
In trying to search for what I was talking about I ran into this...
http://www.snobootz.com/
Anyone tried these before?
Hmm these look like an interesting option.
S4 Dan
11-06-2009, 03:05 PM
it depends on the summer timer, but generally, it is not a great idea. When I had my B5 s4, I had BF Goodrich GForce summer tires on it... They absolutlely sucked in the snow! The car fealt like it was constantly on ice, and I had to control it around every turn. I cant lie to you, it was fun, but if I had to stop fast, it would have been a wrap. Needless to say, my snow tires were mounted later that night when I got home from work. I would invest in a decent All Season tire, and you will be fine. It doesnt make sense for you to waste your money on snow tires if you see snow that seldom, but all seasons would be a great choice depending on your driving style while your rolling around Cali
UGwagen
11-06-2009, 10:34 PM
If you're from the Bay, just getting chains is probably the most sensible/economic option. They are an immense PITA, but I have seen system that does not use chains. I forget what it's called, but you bolt it onto your hub and it sits on the outside of your tire.
Spikes Spider.
They can be a PITA to use. Their "measuring tool" isn't accurate. If you're going to spend that type of money, get the Thule K-summit or RUD Centrax.