View Full Version : MTM S4 vs E92 M3
KareemA4
10-05-2009, 05:06 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ge84DQzqD8
[>_<]
it was in the B6/B7 section, so i just passed it along incase someone didnt see it
TapouTx914
10-05-2009, 05:10 PM
Awesome video thanks the new s4 motor turned out better than i thought!
NWS4Guy
10-05-2009, 05:18 PM
Wow, that thing is a monster to do that!
Amazingly tunable engine, it took a while, but right at the very end the M3 finally overtook it. If the same magic can be brought forth for the RS, the M3 is in T-R-O-U-B-L-E.
Wow, that thing is a monster to do that!
Amazingly tunable engine, it took a while, but right at the very end the M3 finally overtook it. If the same magic can be brought forth for the RS, the M3 is in T-R-O-U-B-L-E.
Audi didn't tune the transmission for acceleration in 6th and 7th. more for gas mileage. It was on the shift into 6th or 7th that a huge step change in acceleration took place. Plus it was a roll on...from a dead stop the S4 would have walked it much worse. The inital lunge in 3rd gear was very quick.
plus....the S4 was an avant. mtm needs to tweak the sedan....all the tuners hop up the heavier avants.
Stearnsy
10-05-2009, 05:36 PM
The M3 just lacks in the tq department. You know that supercharger is makin' torque like a mawfucka. Reminds me of watching a GT-R v. an E60 M5. To about 100mph the GT-R leads (the M5 does hang), but then the M5 pulls lengths.
NWS4Guy
10-05-2009, 05:44 PM
The M3 just lacks in the tq department. You know that supercharger is makin' torque like a mawfucka. Reminds me of watching a GT-R v. an E60 M5. To about 100mph the GT-R leads (the M5 does hang), but then the M5 pulls lengths.
Very true, once the top end comes, the M's HP kicks in and takes over.
naveen
10-05-2009, 10:35 PM
it just shows you that the s4 is no slouch![:D]
bunnn
10-05-2009, 10:37 PM
pretty glad audi stepped up big time with the s4....sadly the next generation M will also be a force induced engine....the high-revving engines are all coming to an end...battle of the tuners coming to a future near you...
on a side note..i'd love to see how a stock DCT M3 will fair against an MTM tuned DSG S4
awhk82
10-05-2009, 10:47 PM
Time for MTM S4 vs C63...
Time for MTM S4 vs C63...
That would be very interesting.
riegeraudi
10-06-2009, 07:10 AM
S4 would still get beat just not as bad as in the other video. C63 has both power and torque.
sakimano
10-06-2009, 07:39 AM
S4 would still get beat just not as bad as in the other video. C63 has both power and torque.
not as bad as this video? or not as bad as that M3/ISf/RS4/S4 video? That video is fukt.
riegeraudi
10-06-2009, 01:45 PM
The would still be beat by the C63 but not as bad as it did in the C63/ISF video if it was chipped. In that video the stock S4 was beat pretty bad if you don't consider the launch.
Saracen
10-06-2009, 01:58 PM
This just in, one type of car is faster than another type of car.
News at 5.
sakimano
10-06-2009, 02:11 PM
The would still be beat by the C63 but not as bad as it did in the C63/ISF video if it was chipped. In that video the stock S4 was beat pretty bad if you don't consider the launch.
"He fought that shark off pretty well...if you don't consider where it bit off his legs at the beginning"
riegeraudi
10-06-2009, 02:20 PM
It is pretty fast but if you look at the M3 video and the C63 video once the S4 gets into either 6th or 7th gear then game over due to the larger gears or whatever reason.
Hey Sak, go to the B6/b7 board which asks B8 S4 or RS4 and I just posted a video with the same M3 vs the RS4. Pretty interesting IMO.
sakimano
10-06-2009, 02:49 PM
It is pretty fast but if you look at the M3 video and the C63 video once the S4 gets into either 6th or 7th gear then game over due to the larger gears or whatever reason.
Hey Sak, go to the B6/b7 board which asks B8 S4 or RS4 and I just posted a video with the same M3 vs the RS4. Pretty interesting IMO.
will do at home..can't see youtube at work
the C63 caught the S4 at 9 seconds from a dig in the 4 cars video with the stock S4. At 9 seconds, the S4 has beaten the C63 from 0-85mph.
C63 gets to 60mph in 4.1 seconds, give or take. This means that on that day, the S4 got to 60mph WAY quicker than the C63. C63 was automatic...no passengers that weighed 500 lbs...so wtf?
All these videos are weird. The results don't always add up. Joe Blow says he's stock, but who knows?
You could take my B7 S4...put simple bolt ons like light weight rotors on it...lightweight pulley...forged Hartmann HRS4 wheels...downpipes and JHM tune...JHM clutch...and the car would look and sound 100% stock. Yet it would surprise anyone expecting a stock B7...would run to 60mph in 4.5 seconds...would hit the 1/4 in 12.9-13.1. It would equal an RS4 or an M3 from a dig...and be pretty close from a roll...even though it shouldn't. As would a chipped 335...or a piggybacked B8 S4.
Unless it's our video...hard to say what's legit.
qu@ttr0
10-06-2009, 07:45 PM
If that's the result, MTM S4 will have hard time keeping up with almost full bolt-on JB3 335i.
Here is a clip 335i with the same M3 owner in the MTM video above :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-tsQLbu5_c&feature=player_embedded#
335i owner shifted to 5th early and slow down at the end. Here is the original thread.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5903190#post5903190
I still take the B8 though [:D]
the jb3 got the jump...on the gas sooner, that can make a huge difference. playing catchup from there is tuff.
leviathan18
10-06-2009, 08:10 PM
lets way for APR muahahahahahaha
riegeraudi
10-06-2009, 08:22 PM
Was that just Jb3 or did he have other stuff on the car like meth, etc.?
If that was just JB3 than we are F@ck@d unless APR does something amazing or the HPFP fails during a race.
ElCapitan464
10-06-2009, 08:31 PM
sweet vid, i thought the audi was going to beat it, but the big v8 gets the top end, cant wait until the rs model comes out
Quattro
10-06-2009, 08:42 PM
cool
AofC_RR
10-06-2009, 09:52 PM
Nice race. I agree the tall 6th and 7th gears didn't help. I wonder how they'd stack up from a standstill. Considering they hit close to 150mph according to some of the comments the S4 is the champ. How often are you going to be able to stretch the car out that far?
qu@ttr0
10-07-2009, 04:52 AM
Was that just Jb3 or did he have other stuff on the car like meth, etc.?
If that was just JB3 than we are F@ck@d unless APR does something amazing or the HPFP fails during a race.
No, Bomis's 335i didn't have meth. Meth is pretty ugly. You could find another vid that Kraxx (with meth) with almost same setup and he left the GT3 RS behind bus lengths
YZracer
10-07-2009, 01:00 PM
Isn't MTM's setup just a chip? So if the JB3 setup is all those bolt on's, wont the MTM car with those bolt ons do better?
sleeperwagon
10-07-2009, 05:28 PM
My buddy, who has the new M3, test drove the new S4 and he is going to wait til the new RS4 comes out. He also drove the new X6 that has a twin turbo V8 and curious how much faster the M-X6 can be. Issue he said is the NEW M3 will be a tuned version of the twin turbo V8 and rumor has it the new RS4 is a SC V8. That will be interesting when these 2 beasts come out.
Who said the focus on fuel economy would kill speed?
mrbogangles
10-07-2009, 06:49 PM
My buddy, who has the new M3, test drove the new S4 and he is going to wait til the new RS4 comes out. He also drove the new X6 that has a twin turbo V8 and curious how much faster the M-X6 can be. Issue he said is the NEW M3 will be a tuned version of the twin turbo V8 and rumor has it the new RS4 is a SC V8. That will be interesting when these 2 beasts come out.
Who said the focus on fuel economy would kill speed?
rs4
i thought they where not going to make since they got the rs5
or are there rumors about the rs4
sakimano
10-08-2009, 09:38 AM
there is no B8 RS4 yet
B8 RS5
IF (and it's a big if) there were to be an RS4, it wouldn't show up till the last 2 years of the B8 run. That's 2013-2014.
WinterRunner
10-08-2009, 11:19 AM
^^^ And I hope the B8 RS4 looks NOTHING like the A4/S4, I will be highly dissapointed.
jdmnomore
10-08-2009, 02:53 PM
^^^ And I hope the B8 RS4 looks NOTHING like the A4/S4, I will be highly dissapointed.
I felt the same way, but as with the 335i its really starting to grow on me. If you look at the pics in the C&D article theres a really good one that led me to an epiphany. The b8 is a perfect blend between the b5/b6/b7. It took the B7 grill and refined it and added the led headlights. The whole upper half of the car is shaped very similar to the B5 and the trunk reminds me of the b5 trunk as well. The windows are similar to the B6/B7 and the body its self reminds me a lot of the B6 minus the side blades. I dont know man I really like it.
ZaneS4
10-08-2009, 06:37 PM
^^^ And I hope the B8 RS4 looks NOTHING like the A4/S4, I will be highly dissapointed.
Why? The B8 body, chassis, interior, well everything trumps the B7.
riegeraudi
10-08-2009, 08:42 PM
The said the B6/B7 shape was bulbous and unshapely compared to the B5 and everyone likes it now. The B8 in my opinion is just as nice as the B5/B6/B7. The front in my opinion is a little bit better but the B6/B7 rear in my opinion is a little bit better than the B8 because it reminds me of the B5 while the B8 is totally new design for Audi so maybe we need to get used to it.
IMO though still way better than the hyundai looking rear of the competitor.
WinterRunner
10-09-2009, 05:09 AM
You guys can say what you will, but line my B7 RS4 next your B8 whatever, and there's no comparison. It's an iconic look that won't likely ever be touched. S4's may be uncommon, but how many RS4's do see everyday? The super wide wheel flares, the PERFECT body lines, can't touch it fellas, sorry. Not to mention its 8200+ RPM V8 that has an exhaust note similar to God snoring....... [up]
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l297/jb4200/2008-Audi-RS4-7251.jpg
GrnMtnS4
10-09-2009, 05:57 AM
We like your car and are glad you like it - just odd you find it necessary within a b8S4 forum to post how much you dislike the car we are buying / spending time discussing that is all. No big deal - love your setup on the RS :)
cheers
Brad
sakimano
10-09-2009, 07:52 AM
Why? The B8 body, chassis, interior, well everything trumps the B7.
always debatable. The B6 guys tell us B7 guys this all the time re the B6 body. We laugh. Come into the V8 forum and tell us how great the V6T experience is and how much better the engine is than our V8. Won't go well for you!
Everyone votes with their car...'mine is best'. Can't win that fight.
Personally I love the B8 front and sideviews...but the B8 sedan rear end needs toughening up a bit. Seems to droop. When I first saw the S4 rear though, I was pleasantly surprised...way better than the A4 S-line rear. The valence is much better, and the quad exhaust helps, as do the LED brake lights. They take your eyes right to them, and create a nicer shape than the overall light housings do. I love the A5/S5 rear though. I reckon if there's B8 A4/S4 facelift, it will see it look a bit more like the A5/S5/A6. I love the B8 Avant rear...boguht an A4. Wish they'd bring the S4 over...
S4's stance is great too at 30mm lower than standard A4...10mm lower than A4 s-line. All around it's turning into a great car at a great price. The re-pricing in Canada was INCREDIBLE. That car should do very well here.
http://image.europeancarweb.com/f/11492204+w750+st0/epcp_0811_07_z+2010_audi_s4+rear_view.jpg
S5 Sportback
http://www.gotbroken.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/2010-Audi-S5-Sportback-Rear-Picture-588x441.jpg
A6 3.0T
http://www.seriouswheels.com/pics-2009/a/2009-Audi-A6-Rear-1920x1440.jpg
The White Whale (to North Americans)
http://www.motivemag.com/Content/uploads/1/wagon_1.jpg
riegeraudi
10-09-2009, 08:30 AM
[QUOTE=WinterRunner;4346194]You guys can say what you will, but line my B7 RS4 next your B8 whatever, and there's no comparison. It's an iconic look that won't likely ever be touched. S4's may be uncommon, but how many RS4's do see everyday? The super wide wheel flares, the PERFECT body lines, can't touch it fellas, sorry. Not to mention its 8200+ RPM V8 that has an exhaust note similar to God snoring....... [up]
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l297/jb4200/2008-Audi-RS4-7251.jpg[/QUOTE
"Iconic look that will never be touched"
I don't even think R8 owners say this about their cars. You do realize you are just driving an A4 with fender flares?
"exhaust note .... God Snoring" Man I think if a Ferrari or Aston Martin owner was reading this he would laugh in your face.
You have a nice car but you should really get off your high horse. If you really want to compare it might not be pretty.
dekkard
10-09-2009, 09:51 AM
You guys can say what you will, but line my B7 RS4 next your B8 whatever, and there's no comparison. It's an iconic look that won't likely ever be touched. S4's may be uncommon, but how many RS4's do see everyday? The super wide wheel flares, the PERFECT body lines, can't touch it fellas, sorry. Not to mention its 8200+ RPM V8 that has an exhaust note similar to God snoring....... [up]
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l297/jb4200/2008-Audi-RS4-7251.jpg
Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding...........................
WinterRunner
10-09-2009, 11:29 AM
Hey Im just stating my HUMBLE opinion, and god snoring, I quoted Jeremy Clarkson on that one, so your Aston Martin and Ferrari owners can go talk to him about that. R8's are even more iconic, so stop while your ahead please. As for a a A4 with flares?, that sounds very much like a NON-ENTHUSIAST talking. I think only you B8 S4 guys think it's a better looking car, and thats fine, it's your opinion, and you should feel that way, you just spent 50K+ on one. Now that we're done, I think I'm gonna go ride my horse somewhere else. [up]
ZaneS4
10-09-2009, 11:52 AM
You guys can say what you will, but line my B7 RS4 next your B8 whatever, and there's no comparison. It's an iconic look that won't likely ever be touched. S4's may be uncommon, but how many RS4's do see everyday? The super wide wheel flares, the PERFECT body lines, can't touch it fellas, sorry. Not to mention its 8200+ RPM V8 that has an exhaust note similar to God snoring....... [up]
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l297/jb4200/2008-Audi-RS4-7251.jpg
I'll get you a towel so you can clean up that mess you just made in your pants from all your excitement.
mrbogangles
10-10-2009, 09:47 AM
there is no B8 RS4 yet
B8 RS5
IF (and it's a big if) there were to be an RS4, it wouldn't show up till the last 2 years of the B8 run. That's 2013-2014.
it seems like there are no replacement for the b7 rs4
due to low sales according to audi
EUROTEK//S4
10-10-2009, 11:28 AM
[QUOTE=WinterRunner;4346194]You guys can say what you will, but line my B7 RS4 next your B8 whatever, and there's no comparison. It's an iconic look that won't likely ever be touched. S4's may be uncommon, but how many RS4's do see everyday? The super wide wheel flares, the PERFECT body lines, can't touch it fellas, sorry. Not to mention its 8200+ RPM V8 that has an exhaust note similar to God snoring....... [up]
http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l297/jb4200/2008-Audi-RS4-7251.jpg[/QUOTE
"Iconic look that will never be touched"
I don't even think R8 owners say this about their cars. You do realize you are just driving an A4 with fender flares?
"exhaust note .... God Snoring" Man I think if a Ferrari or Aston Martin owner was reading this he would laugh in your face.
You have a nice car but you should really get off your high horse. If you really want to compare it might not be pretty.
+ 1000000000000000 [up][up][up][up][up]
switchface
10-10-2009, 07:30 PM
I love the fender flares of the rs4. The m3, for example, is very distinguished from a regular 3 series. I hate how the s4's are so similar to the a4's...thats why you have to love the rs4's muscular stance.
How-ev-ah, everytime I thought about buying a rs4, I remembered the photo (I think on Audizine) of a s5 parked next to a rs4. I couldn't believe how dated the s5 made the rs4 look in that pic.
b00st
10-12-2009, 11:03 AM
If that's the result, MTM S4 will have hard time keeping up with almost full bolt-on JB3 335i.
Here is a clip 335i with the same M3 owner in the MTM video above :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-tsQLbu5_c&feature=player_embedded#
335i owner shifted to 5th early and slow down at the end. Here is the original thread.
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5903190#post5903190
I still take the B8 though [:D]
its way to early in the game to compare the 2.
most people don't have their hands on the B8S4 and 335 has a slew of products...lets see what happens if we can do smaller pulley, ecu, full exhaust, some kind of cooling options. and then run them.
thats like comparing a chipped A4 to a full bolt on EVO.
NWS4Guy
10-12-2009, 01:44 PM
its way to early in the game to compare the 2.
most people don't have their hands on the B8S4 and 335 has a slew of products...lets see what happens if we can do smaller pulley, ecu, full exhaust, some kind of cooling options. and then run them.
thats like comparing a chipped A4 to a full bolt on EVO.
Current info points that a goodly portion of boost from the supercharger is bled by the bypass valve and not even used, so a pulley change is not even needed initially. This is why MTM and the few others who have played with the B8 S4 have been able to add ~100HP with only ECU changes, they are just putting all the boost into the intake, then changing the fuel ratios to compensate for this.
Gotta love when you are given more than you need right off and only need computing power to change things :)
riegeraudi
10-12-2009, 03:05 PM
I have a feeling though to beat the JB3 you would need not only a pulley but a new supercharger. It sounds like anything more and the current supercharger would be out of it's optimum efficiency.
Will have to wait and see what the tuners come out with.
NWS4Guy
10-12-2009, 03:22 PM
Actually, it's looking like with 100% of the current chargers boost put into the intake, it's likely already as much as the current engine tolerances can stand withouth a pulley mod, I don't think a larger supercharger would work unless it just gave more grunt lower down and didn't drop off till closer to redline - I get the impression from the numbers the stock charger has that boost is not where things are lacking.
b00st
10-13-2009, 03:59 PM
Current info points that a goodly portion of boost from the supercharger is bled by the bypass valve and not even used, so a pulley change is not even needed initially. This is why MTM and the few others who have played with the B8 S4 have been able to add ~100HP with only ECU changes, they are just putting all the boost into the intake, then changing the fuel ratios to compensate for this.
Gotta love when you are given more than you need right off and only need computing power to change things :)
ok so maybe a no on the smaller pulley...and yes the MTM chip yields a ~100CHP. i would imagine with time and revision we can see more out of these piggybacks ECUs.
all i'm saying is to compete with a JB3...we need more bolt ons and some time to get them. nothing is really developed yet...but given time...i think things can happen. look at the b6s4 right now...things are finally starting to happen there.
i don't forsee this car raping everything in sight. there is always something faster...even if the only thing is an ECU and all we ever get is 100CHP more...that is pretty decent. and 430HP is certainly no slouch.
NWS4Guy
10-13-2009, 04:43 PM
I agree, so much so early in the game only means that there is that much more waiting to be found and tweaked - this is only the beginning :)
jojogoya88
10-18-2009, 10:13 AM
That would be very interesting.
S4 would get owned
toaster
10-18-2009, 10:40 AM
i love how crap like that gets some peoples' panties in a bunch...
"yo!!! the s4 owns the m3 until 150, then the m3 starts to walk away!!! damn the s4 is slow!!!"
ridiculous.
new s4 is a complete monster and i would take it any day over the m3...don't even get me started on the bmw shit interiors...
I love the fender flares of the rs4. The m3, for example, is very distinguished from a regular 3 series. I hate how the s4's are so similar to the a4's...thats why you have to love the rs4's muscular stance.
How-ev-ah, everytime I thought about buying a rs4, I remembered the photo (I think on Audizine) of a s5 parked next to a rs4. I couldn't believe how dated the s5 made the rs4 look in that pic.
really...dated?
the rs4 still looks incredible to me. if you add leds to the b7 platform, i think it looks great. so does the b6, albeit not quite as fresh, due to the older grille style.
winter - we're on an audi forum, in the b8 section no less...just a bit unnecessary.
Okan509
10-18-2009, 09:33 PM
RS4 looks better than the new S4. They look sick. Still would buy a new S4 over an RS4, same performance, and way better gas mileage. not really a hard question
switchface
10-20-2009, 05:11 PM
really...dated?
the rs4 still looks incredible to me. if you add leds to the b7 platform, i think it looks great. so does the b6, albeit not quite as fresh, due to the older grille style.
Just to reiterate, I think the rs4 is beautiful and I love everything about it...but yes, side by side it looks dated.
I dig some digging and found the pic that makes me feel this way. Granted the rs4 looks stock and Sizzle's car is the tits, but you can't tell me after looking at this pic that the rs4 doesn't appear dated next to the newer platform:
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/1517/img0071bd4.jpg
riegeraudi
10-20-2009, 07:52 PM
I totally agree the RS4 looks good but once it was next to a B8 S4 and S5 it looked dated IMO also. It got even worse once you got inside.
But I still think the RS4 interior still kicks any BMW interiors but though.
Okan509
10-20-2009, 08:29 PM
Wow, is it me, or is the A5/S5 so gorgeous! I love this car holyfuck
HobbesA5
10-21-2009, 07:36 AM
Wow, is it me, or is the A5/S5 so gorgeous! I love this car holyfuck
It's not just you. [cool]
joung300
10-25-2009, 07:34 PM
that b7 rs4 looks dated. aging gracefully is a nice way to put it.
the body work is so busy.
MisterQuattro
11-05-2009, 04:23 PM
good video....
thought the S4 was gonna take him especially with MTM under the hood but w.e there both amazing cars